wny_pat
Western NYS
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T&A wrote:My standard ignition key is chipped so for added security, I had an unchipped key cut for towing. It will unlock the steering but you can't drive away using it.
Terry Me too. 2009 Ford Focus.
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ShapeShifter
Buffalo, NY
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Many cars won't let you use the power door lock button or the key fob to lock the doors when the key is in the ignition -- it's to prevent you from locking yourself out. But usually, the manual way of pushing the lock knob, or using a key from outside will still work.
You need to experiment with ALL of the ways that the lock can be operated to see what works for you. Just because the button you routinely press in normal use doesn't work, doesn't mean it can't be done.
BarbaraOK wrote:We don't put locks in place of the pins connecting the tow bars to the car - - you want to be able to unhook quickly should the need arise. We can do it in less than 4 minutes to separate and move the two vehicles to safe places.
Barb
I've heard this argument against locks many times. Even with the locks in place, and even with some fumbling to get the key in the slot, it doesn't take me anywhere near 4 minutes to unhitch. And if it was some sort of an emergency, and I had to get them apart fast, I know I could do it even faster (by not worrying about dropping pins, or dragging cables.)
In reality, the locks add about 10 or 20 seconds to routine operations.
robatthelake wrote:Be careful when using Locks instead of the supplied Pins! The Metal used on Many Padlocks can Shear or crack with use, which may allow the Hitch to separate!
That could be a valid concern. To help reduce the chance of failure, I use locks recommended by and supplied by the tow bar manufacturer.
But even still, nothing can totally eliminate the possibility of failure. Even the stock non-locking pins can fail. One should always inspect all of their equipment for signs of stress or wear when hooking up.
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mowermech
Billings, MT
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Sully2 wrote:Mountain Aire34 wrote:The tow bar is attached to the coach via hitch receiver and a pin.
The toad is attached to the tow bar with one pin in each arm. The toad itself is in neutral and the key in the ignition. With the key in the ignition the doors can not be locked. Has anyone ever had a car stolen. ?? Is locking the toad to the tow bar, or locking the tow bar to the coach a good idea.??
If you are WITH the toad...there's no reason to lock it. But you NEVER leave it...or go to sleep at night with it unlocked and a key in the ignition. If your traveling and stop at some Mall to shop...and everyone goes shopping...remove the key from the toad and lock the doors.
Would you leave your motorhome unlocked with a key in the ignition??...if not then why would you leave the toad in that condition??
My thoughts exactly! Yes, I know, "but what if I forget to remove the key, or even worse, forget to put the key back in?"! It is known as "situational awareness" and "attention to detail".
I don't lock the boat to the trailer, or the trailer to the motorhome. I don't lock the flatbed trailer to the motorhome, either. The makers of these locking devices are getting rich off the paranoia of people. I have rarely seen reports of toads stolen from the back of tow vehicles. It must happen, of course, but is it really prevalent enough to warrant all the worry?
Just my opinion, of course, but I don't think so.
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enblethen
Moses Lake, WA USA
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The locks for the tow bar brackets are for the safety pins not the actual pins.
The pin style locks such as the Roadmaster 315 or Blue Ox BX88212 are designed for the purpose and pose no safety issue.
Use of products other then those designed for such purpose can provide create a safety problem.
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Not a Clue
Southern Ca
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Our Vue will lock with fob and the key in the ignition. We do it all the time.
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& Demco baseplate and tow bar.
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BarbaraOK
On The Road
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ShapeShifter wrote:
BarbaraOK wrote:We don't put locks in place of the pins connecting the tow bars to the car - - you want to be able to unhook quickly should the need arise. We can do it in less than 4 minutes to separate and move the two vehicles to safe places.
Barb
I've heard this argument against locks many times. Even with the locks in place, and even with some fumbling to get the key in the slot, it doesn't take me anywhere near 4 minutes to unhitch. And if it was some sort of an emergency, and I had to get them apart fast, I know I could do it even faster (by not worrying about dropping pins, or dragging cables.)
In reality, the locks add about 10 or 20 seconds to routine operations.
That was under 4 minutes from the time we left the coach, got to the car, got them separated, and the two moved safely to opposites sides of the road. And if it had been a fire we could have done it even faster. I have just never understood why you would need to lock at that point - the pins will not get loose if they are installed correctly. And we always check during the walk around if we have stopped before we get underway again. We don't travel with the car locked - if you can run down the road, jump in the car, unhitch it, etc. while we are underway, more power to you. But if we stop and leave to go shopping or something, then we take the key out of the ignition, etc., and lock up.
Barb
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ShapeShifter
Buffalo, NY
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mowermech wrote:I have rarely seen reports of toads stolen from the back of tow vehicles. It must happen, of course, but is it really prevalent enough to warrant all the worry?
Well, then, if you've rarely seen reports of toads stolen from a MH, then you must have seen some, and that means you've seen more than I have, because I haven't seen any such reports.
But still I use locks. Why?
Because I have seen several reports about people who have found that someone tampered with their equipment and pulled pins at a stop, or have reported that a pin worked loose and fell off while driving. I use the locks primarily as secure safety pins. While it is still possible that they can be tampered with, and still possible that they could fail, I feel it reduces the chances of it happening.
I'm not worried about the toad being stolen, as it is locked when being towed, and there is no key in the ignition. It's at least as secure while being towed as it is when normally parked.
While routine inspections of the equipment may turn up tampering or failure events before they are an issue, there are those who may think that looking things over at each stop is paranoia, since failures are rare. So it's no surprise that some would think it's paranoid to take it one step further and attempt to reduce the chance of failure, in addition to detecting failures after the fact with inspections.
BarbaraOK wrote:I have just never understood why you would need to lock at that point - the pins will not get loose if they are installed correctly.
And yet there have been reports on this forum about properly secured pins disappearing on the road. I guess that's something that only happens to the other person?
BarbaraOK also wrote:And we always check during the walk around if we have stopped before we get underway again.
That's a good thing to do, and should always be done regardless of the equipment in use. But it will only find faults after the fact, and won't do you any good while driving. If finding faults are important enough to make you do an inspection at every stop, why not put in a little extra effort and try to prevent the faults in the first place?
The one time I almost had a failure, my routine inspection before taking off showed that everything was in place and secure. Yet, when I stopped the next time, I was shocked to find that things were hanging on by a thread. Inspections are important, but not foolproof.
BarbaraOK finally wrote: We don't travel with the car locked - if you can run down the road, jump in the car, unhitch it, etc. while we are underway, more power to you. But if we stop and leave to go shopping or something, then we take the key out of the ignition, etc., and lock up.
Why go to all of that extra work to lock up at stops? Wouldn't it be easier to just keep it locked the whole time?
You say you don't understand why anyone would want locks. I guess I don't understand why anyone would be so cavalier about security when it costs so little and takes such little effort? It's not paranoia, it's just a cost/benefit study in risk reduction.
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hershey
Albuquerque,(fulltime) NM, USA
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robatthelake wrote:Be careful when using Locks instead of the supplied Pins! The Metal used on Many Padlocks can Shear or crack with use, which may allow the Hitch to separate! I'm sure the poster was using the locks as replacements for the snap ring pins or snap pins that keep the large hardened steel pins from slipping out. Thoses are usually about a half inch diameter pins.
hershey - albuquerque, nm
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mowermech
Billings, MT
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ShapeShifter wrote: It's not paranoia, it's just a cost/benefit study in risk reduction.
Paranoia=a cost/benefit study in risk reduction concerning a slim to non-existent risk.
There is time to deal with all the locks, but no time to remove the key and lock the car?
I'm retired, it isn't a matter of time. However, being on a limited budget, the cost of those locks might mean I couldn't buy a fishing lure, or several flies, or new line, or a box of ammunition, or a gallon of gas, or... THAT is where the "cost/benefit" comes in; there are many things more important than locks on which to spend my limited income!
It is the same as Brinks wanting to come out and give me an estimate on "upgrading/updating" my house security. Sure, the Brinks system has more "bells and whistles" than the existing Kenco system does, but why should I spend the money? The Kenco system works just fine, and, living in the country, the cops are so far away that any burglar would have his job done and be long gone before they got here. So, why bother? "Cost/benefit": High cost, little or no benefit.
IMO, locks on the fifth wheel hitch pins or the towbar pins or special locks for storage compartments are in the same category. The low risk simply does not justify the cost or the annoyance of having them. Having had to deal with rusted and frozen locks many times, I don't need any more of them.
Your opinion, of course, differs. That is as it should be. You won't change my mind, and I am not even trying to change yours. I am merely stating my opinion.
That reminds me, on an off-topic note, if anybody changes the dreaded "751" compartment door locks, please send the "751s" to me. The previous owner of my Tioga changed locks, and now it takes THREE different keys to open the compartments. VERY annoying! I would really like to put all "751" locks back, but I don't want to buy them.
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ShapeShifter
Buffalo, NY
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mowermech wrote:ShapeShifter wrote: It's not paranoia, it's just a cost/benefit study in risk reduction.
Paranoia=a cost/benefit study in risk reduction concerning a slim to non-existent risk.
An interesting definition! But how do you know the risk is slim to non-existent until you study it?
Coincidentally, I use that same logic when it comes to the need to "get the toad away fast." I see more reports of tampering or failure than I do of a fire or other catastrophic event where a few extra seconds could make the difference between success and failure. I see the need to save those few seconds as being a very slim risk, especially compared to the failure I almost experienced first hand.
mowermech also wrote:There is time to deal with all the locks, but no time to remove the key and lock the car?
You apparently missed part of my post, because earlier in that same post I wrote:
ShapeShifter wrote:I'm not worried about the toad being stolen, as it is locked when being towed, and there is no key in the ignition. It's at least as secure while being towed as it is when normally parked.
mowermech also wrote:It is the same as Brinks wanting to come out and give me an estimate on "upgrading/updating" my house security. Sure, the Brinks system has more "bells and whistles" than the existing Kenco system does, but why should I spend the money?
Complete agreement there! I firmly believe that all you're paying for is the name, not extra coverage or performance.
mowermech finally wrote:Your opinion, of course, differs. That is as it should be. You won't change my mind, and I am not even trying to change yours. I am merely stating my opinion.
I'm not trying to change any opinions either, and I'm in no way trying to tell anybody how they should do things, or that the way they do it is wrong. I'm just trying to discuss the topic so that people can see things they may not have thought of, and to encourage others to express their opinions and thoughts. The same goes for me: I'm also trying to understand the reasons behind other's decisions, to see if maybe there's a part of it that I hadn't previously considered.
Isn't that what this forum is all about? I think this is a good discussion, and I respect yours, Barb's, and other's opinions, and find them valuable.
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