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RE: Gasoline or Propane Generators
Don,
What I believe is meant by "liquid propane" is that the tanks have a tube that draws liquid from the bottom of the tank and feeds it into the generator as a liquid where it evaporates in the carburetor, much like gasoline does except the propane needs to be under pressure to remain liquid. Most propane appliances use the vapor that is created when the liquid in the tank evaporates into the head space above the liquid. Maybe very large generators or other very large appliances need a liquid feed. When I bought my propane generator none of the ones I looked at required liquid propane. While I bought a 2800 watt generator some of the ones I looked at were as high as 5000 watts and didn't need a liquid feed.
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gary and ellen
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03/15/10 08:16pm |
Beginning RVing
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RE: Gasoline or Propane Generators
First off there are many who would rather crank a hand generator than use a propane generator. Seriously, there are lots of things to consider. What are you trying to do; run your AC, microwave and watch TV all at the same time or just make coffee in the morning and charge your batteries. Next thing is how long you running the stuff you want to power; AC all day or just an hour or two to charge the batteries?
Personally, I have a Yamaha 2800I trifuel (gasoline, propane, natural gas). I run it mostly on propane. It's mounted on my "A" frame. I cut in a tee and quick connect fitting in the propane line and run it off the two 30 pound RV tanks.
The 2800 has enough power to run the AC or the microwave but not both at the same time but that works for me. I rarely run the AC. Maybe to cool things down before bed but that's only and hour or so. Usually I run it for a hour or so every few days to charge the battery. Maybe defrost something in the wave.
I have never measured the propane consumption myself but the dealer I bought it from claims it runs gallon for gallon propane/gasoline. Many claim that since propane has less BTU's per unit it can't run gallon for gallon and that running propane decreases the electrical output significantly. Again while I never measured it, I don't perceive a derated output or an outrageous consumption of propane. I have yet to burn up one 30 pound tank and I usually boondock for weeks at a time.
That being said, if I ever did plan on running my generator a significant portion of the day then I would certainly run it on gasoline just because it is usually easier to buy gasoline than propane.
Some other reasons why I like my set up. The unit has a mixture control valve and tachometer installed on it. This allows me to adjust the mixture at high altitudes something that is important if you spend a lot of time in the mountains like we do. I also installed a quick connect on my natural gas line outside of my house and run my generator on natural gas in the event of a power failure in my neighborhood.
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gary and ellen
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03/14/10 09:06pm |
Beginning RVing
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RE: Which blue tank?
Here is what I do. I have a maceration pump and a 45 gallon water bag. When I need to dump I unfold the bag in the bed of my truck, hook up the pump and dedicated hose and fill it up. If it's black waste I flush a little water through the pump and hose. Drive to the dump site and set up the pump with fittings to pump the bag out into the sewer. If I need to dump both, I go back and get the grey water. After I am all done I rinse the pump and hose and fold up the bag. Pump fits into it's case; a little smaller than a shoe box. Bag folds up into a plastic box that's about the size of a shoe box. Been doing it for years without a problem. I camp in a lot in BLM areas and National Forests and many times there isn't a dump station for many miles. With my set up I have driven 50 miles into town to dump and get supplies. Rarely do I need to dump the black usually it's usually just the grey. Very fast, very convenient, easy to store and since my tanks are 35 gallons I never worry about overfilling/spilling.
I also have a different bag and pump for fresh water; both bags as well as all the fitting are very clearly marked.
I saw someone with this set up years ago and put one together for myself. I highly recommend it. A little more expensive than the blue tank but for me well worth the money.
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gary and ellen
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12/09/09 07:45pm |
Travel Trailers
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RE: no sewer or dump station
But tent campers don't dump 30 or more gallons of grey water at a time!!!!
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gary and ellen
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12/01/09 04:32pm |
Travel Trailers
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RE: Sanitizing fresh water tank
I read the FEMA link and agree. If there is milk or soda residue then there is a potential source of food. The paragraph above the one you quote recommends the use of new bottles and doesn't include a sanitizing step. I could see sanitizing if you put something other than water in the tank.
The vent, I understand it's there and a potential source of microbes and mold spores but again even if they do get in, there is no food in the tank for them to proliferate. Even if you do sanitize regularly, the first time you fill it up, your contaminating it. Even the highest quality tap water contains microbes and bacterial spores. Very low concentrations but they are there. If your filling from a well then the contamination might be worse yet. If the tank had a food source, then the very low concentrations would in fact proliferate into a much larger colony and could be dangerous.
I have yet to keep my tank full for any length of time. Typically I drain it before I depart a campsite and refill it when I get to the next place. I have to drain it for the winter. I am sure there is still a quart maybe a half of a gallon left in there. I have had my tank down a few times and never seen anything other than water and plastic in there.
I know I am sounding pretty argumentative but I am just trying to understand if I am missing a critical step or if it's just germaphobes.
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gary and ellen
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11/28/09 08:39am |
General RVing Issues
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Sanitizing fresh water tank
I am probably going to regret asking this but why are people repeatedly sanitizing their fresh water tanks? I can understand doing it when the RV is new and your concerned where the tank, tubing, pump etc has been, but after that why? I understand that some water remains in the tank and tubing no matter how well you try to drain them but if your only putting potable water into the tank there is no source of food for the organisms to proliferate. Organisms, be it bacteria, yeasts or molds need a source of carbon to grow and reproduce. What is the necessary source of carbohydrate in the tank and where is it coming from??? One only needs to look at the jugs of drinking water in the grocery store to see that water can be stored indefinitely. Most bottled waters, especially the cheap ones, aren't treated other than maybe a particulate filter and the containers aren't sterilized either. Am I missing something???
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gary and ellen
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11/27/09 10:38pm |
General RVing Issues
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RE: Can you convert a quietpact 55 genset from gas to LP?
Try US Carburetion. I bought my tri-fuel Yamaha from these guys. They have good service and were knowledgeable. I love my tri-fuel system, it's the best of all worlds.
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gary and ellen
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10/28/09 07:41pm |
Tech Issues
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RE: Propane generators
Negative comments always come up when talking about propane generators, there is a big difference with your 6.2.kw generator and the small portable tri-fuel generators in operator satisfaction
You got that right...
Had a 6.2Kw propane gen in our first DSDP. Will NEVER have another one, Noisy, overheated in 95° weather and we went through 2 10 gallon tanks and most of our onboard 40 (32 usable) tank in 5 days. When it overheated it blew the breakers on the gen set, as we had pets with us we couldn't trust it to keep running and it limited us as to leaving the rig. It was at an FMCA rally so we couldn't take time away to look at what we wanted without jeopardizing the pets
Sounds like you had a piece of junk for a generator. Nothing to do with propane as the fuel..
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gary and ellen
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10/21/09 08:32pm |
Tech Issues
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RE: Measuring 12v load and finding phantom loads
Clamp on meters have lines on the clamps. The wire needs to be at the intersection of those lines for it to be accurate. It also has to be held steady or the accuracy suffers. My Fluke is very accurate and very reproducible. If your reading 0.1 amps (100 milliamps) your at or less than the self discharge rate of the battery (as someone already suggested).
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gary and ellen
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10/20/09 09:35pm |
Tech Issues
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RE: Propane generators
Don't dismiss propane because simply because it has less energy per gallon than gasoline. This summer the guy next to me saw that my generator was running propane and called it junk. Justice was watching him spill gasoline on shoes when he overfilled his generator.
You have to look at the intended usage. Long hours with the AC on then gasoline is the way to go. Easier to find fuel, longer run times per gallon etc. If you looking to charge your batteries, run the microwave or even the AC for an hour to cool the trailer off before bed than nothing beats the convenience of propane. Me personally, I have never come close to running out of propane on a trip. My trips are usually 4 week boondocks. I carry 2 - 30 pound propane tanks. In fact I think my Weber Q uses significantly more fuel than my generator does.
My personal recommendation is to go with the Yamaha 2800I from US Carburetors, set up for tri-fuel (assuming of course that 2800 watts will cover your needs). The tri-fuel option is the best of all worlds. I have yet to run off anything but propane but if I decided to boon-dock in Florida in the summer I simply run it off gasoline and keep my AC cranked 24 hours a day. At home I have a natural gas outlet with a quick connect coupling for emergency power outages. Lastly the set up I have has a adjustable load block and tachometer so that I can adjust the fuel mixture for high altitudes (and different fuels) which is an issue as someone posted before.
Good luck and be sure you determine your needs before you decide.
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gary and ellen
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10/20/09 08:33am |
Tech Issues
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New rims for my TT
Anyone have any suggestions as to where to buy some new rims for my TT. I have tried the Internet sites, Tire Rack, Discount Tire, etc. and there is a sea of rims out there. Problem is that there are no specifications for loading and pressure. So I decided to make a few phone calls. You'd think I was talking Chinese when I mentioned load rating. The only shop that understood my needs quoted me $250 each, no tires, because they were "high pressure rims". All I want is some simple 14 inch aluminum rims that will handle the new D load rated tires I want to get. I have some nice ones that came with my TT but they are only rated for 60 psi. Am I asking too much?
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gary and ellen
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09/17/09 06:52pm |
Travel Trailers
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RE: China into RV's - Yeah
WP6529. I didn't mean to PO you. If fact I applaud you. You are exactly the opposite of the people I am talking about. I don't know you situation but I am fairly confident that you aren't screwing a part into a widget on a factory line. My guess is that you did things to better yourself or you worked your a** off and climbed the ladder. Either way your ambition and hard work got you where you are. Maybe I am wrong.
You mention fair market wages. How is that determined? If we determine that "fair market wages" should afford a line worker a 4000 sq ft house in the suburbs, 2 cars, a 60" plasma home theater and a closet full of brand name clothes then it's no wonder we can't compete with overseas labor. I live within my means and from what you wrote so do you. My parents made very little money, even by the standards of those times but we ALWAYS lived within our means.
My point is still the same, a whole lot of people out there aren't living within their means. They aren't doing anything to better themselves. They aren't working their a**es off. They ARE demanding lots and lots of cheap stuff be it cars, RV's, TVs, tires or fast food. They feel entitled. They didn't do anything to deserve that stuff. They feel just their entitled. And as I said before, companies and CEO are just doing their jobs - pleasing their customers and more importantly their stock holders.
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gary and ellen
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09/14/09 10:07pm |
General RVing Issues
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RE: China into RV's - Yeah
Just for clarification, the people I am referring to don't receive a dime of government subsidies. Lazy, yes. They never do anything to better themselves yet they feel they deserve all the perks. Because they don't/can't make good salaries they buy cheap crap, lots of it and charge it on their credit cards. The more******they have the better off they think they are. Certainly banks and banking executives have blame in the crisis we just endured but consumers have more of the blame. Whatever happened to buyer beware. Why would someone think they could afford a $500K house on $12.00 per hour wage? Just because the bank gave them the money it's a good idea? Again companies and company exec's pleasing their stock holders so their stocks don't get pummeled when they miss their earnings by a penny.
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gary and ellen
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09/14/09 04:54pm |
General RVing Issues
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RE: China into RV's - Yeah
China is a super power. The only reason they don't flex their muscles too much is that it's bad for business to be at war with you customers. The Chinese aren't too happy about their reliance on foreign trade. They realize the stability of their people comes from the jobs that foreign trade brings them. If all the foreign companies pulled out of China and Chinese exports went away, Chinese unemployment would soar. The government would have a revolution to contend with. The last thing a government wants is 1.2 billion PO'd, unemployed, hungry people.
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gary and ellen
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09/14/09 09:54am |
General RVing Issues
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RE: China into RV's - Yeah
While I can't disagree the the CEO who's making millions for playing golf is a problem, the reality is that for a multi-billion dollar company the top exec's salary and benefits represent only a very small fraction of the total compensation. Should the stock holders reign in the exec's, certainly. The reality is it will only be a "feel good" moment.
Overnight millionaire expectations is exactly one of the problems. Gone are the days of long term investing in the stock market. Too many people would rather sit behind their computers day trading then going off to a job or starting their own businesses. Today if a company misses it's earnings by $0.01 per share Wall Street pummels them 5% - 10% - 20% drop in the price of the stock. Wall Street is out for blood they want the top exec's hanging because they "lost" so much money. I can't blame the exec's it's their job, their livelihood their reputation. Their going to do anything to make the owners (stock holders) happy.
Lastly I am not denying anyone a decent living wage. 40K, 50K, 60K PLUS benefits and lifetime pensions for someone with a high school diploma give ma a break. I own apartments in lower income working class neighborhoods. Many of my tenant's have better TVs then I do. Of course they all have cable or satellite. Their kids have Nike's and North Face's. They drive car with $5000 worth of tires and rims. The neighborhood McDonald's is ALWAYS packed. They have to be spending $10 - $20 - or $30 dollars per day to feed their cigarette habit. Meanwhile their constantly late on their rent. An just so no one starts pegging me a racist - their Anglo's and so am I. I grew up lower working class. I had lots of hand-me-downs. We had a black and white TV because we couldn't afford a color TV. Our cars lasted until they fell apart. Baked chicken and tuna surprise were the staple. We rarely saw a McDonald's. My mother worked a night job so she could be home when we came home from school. They made sure we were educated and understood how to work hard. They taught us to save for what we want and save for the future.
I am not looking for praise because I am sure most of you have the same story. My point is that's not the world today. Today's world is immediate gratification. Cheap stuff and LOTS of it. Credit card debt to the sky and not a penny in reserve.
American consumers and stock holders are what drove companies to move production overseas. It's what we wanted. The government can't tariff that sentiment away. They shouldn't try. Competition - it's the basis of a free market society. We have to be the force of change. Look at tires, too many complaints, loosing market share, slowly production is moving back to the USA.
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gary and ellen
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09/14/09 08:35am |
General RVing Issues
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RE: China into RV's - Yeah
Toss into this the fact that the stock holders want more and more and more profits from the companies they own stock in. The very Americans who complain about cheap Chinese junk and "American" jobs going overseas complain about their stocks "not doing well". Investors want their stock prices to go up so companies are forced to increase sales and profits. Hard to increase sales with the highest priced product in the market place. Hard to increase profits with some of the highest labor costs in the world.
Jobs will start returning to America when we realize some guy with a GED, working a line in some factory, doesn't deserve $20.00 - $25.00 - $30.00 or more PLUS full benefits and a lifetime pension.
For those who believe they "only" buy American dig deeper. Countless products are mostly made overseas with final assembly and packaging done in the USA so they can put the "made in the USA" label on it. Why? All in the name of pleasing the stock holders with higher sales and profits.
To a lot of Americans, a hard days work is sitting behind their computer trading stocks on E-Trade.
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gary and ellen
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09/13/09 10:05pm |
General RVing Issues
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RE: Tires, Tires, Tires!!!
I have heard that some Kumo's are made in China. One of the reviews on the above link even pointed that out. They didn't note any problems just that his were made in China.
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gary and ellen
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09/13/09 02:47pm |
Travel Trailers
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RE: Chinese tire tariff
The American consumer is to blame. We want cheap stuff and a lot of it. Over the decades the manufacturers and retailers complied. It's a catch 22 for companies today. Everyone wants to vilify the companies for importing or moving production overseas because their being "greedy", yet the same people will complain when they see their stocks go down because their not as profitable as they should be.
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gary and ellen
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09/13/09 11:16am |
General RVing Issues
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RE: Tires, Tires, Tires!!!
Check out these UE-168(N) Maxxis Bravo Series commercial LT's. Someone recommended them to me on this forum. I haven't pulled the trigger yet but I think I might in the spring. They make a 14 inch with a higher speed rating and higher load rating. They are exactly what I need and everyone has good things to say about Maxxis.
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gary and ellen
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09/13/09 07:53am |
Travel Trailers
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RE: Safety Chains..... They really do work!!!
Jim, Sabre thanks. Obviously none of us wants this to happen to our rig but It's my feeling that the breakaway cable slamming on the trailer breaks would only have made the situation worse. Clearly if the chains failed and the trailer TRUELY separates from the tow vehicle then for the sake of everyone around you the trailer needs to stop ASAP. Well glad no one was hurt.
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gary and ellen
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09/12/09 11:06am |
Towing
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