An older class A for a single traveler

[I-10bound]

It's me again, the dreamer. But it's all about all you can do though when you're saving up for a motorhome.

I know an older class B would be the most practical motorhome for me. Most of the time I will travel by myself, and they're easy to drive and park in big cities like LA.

I'm constantly surfing craigslist, and every so often a beautiful older class A will come up for sale, like 1980's Pace Arrows, Chieftains, Holiday Rambler Aluma-lites, and Tiffin Allegros. And between 7 and 10 grand it looks like you can get one in beautiful condition. You just can't find many class B's at that price. Plus a class A, well it's a real home on wheels. It would be decadent to have a dedicated queen bed, dinette, and sofa!

Do you think an older, short (25-27') class A would be a good choice for a single traveler in his early 40's? Many times I will just take it out to local parks around Phoenix just to get away from my roommates (family). And occasionally I might take it to southern Cal to cool off in the summer and go surfing. I see people parking old motorhomes all over the streets of LA.

Now for my biggest question. These old motorhomes all have 3 speed trannys right? Is there such thing as a 4 or 5 speed conversion that would allow you to get better mileage on flats? It seems all that torque of a big V8 could be better utilized with taller overdrive gears, allowing you to cruise at 70mph without chugging so much gas.

Thanks, Matt

[I-10bound]

Thanks you all for sharing your knowledge with me. I probably should just stick to a van based Class B of some sort.

[olfarmer]

I think an older MH could server you very well if it is in good condition, if it is not in good condition it could be a money pit.
As far as gas mileage, you would not get enough benefit to pay for changing the transmission. I had an '87 Itasca 30 foot Windcruiser with a carbureted 454 and 3 speed transmission, it got about 7 mpg average. I now have a 2001 Winnebago 30 foot Brave with a 7.4 fuel injected engine and a 4 speed overdrive transmission, it averages about 8 mpg. Not that much difference, and it would take a long time to pay for the upgrade. Just use the money it would cost to change the transmission to buy fuel and you will be way ahead! I drive about 65 mph on interstates and the speed limit on other roads.

[BigRabbitMan]

Matt_Colie wrote:
Matt (a different Matt)

You are laboring under the weight of the preconceived misconception. Overdrive and transmission gear counts don't really do great things for fuel economy. As a great real world example, I am an owner and a member of the group (cult) of owners of an older coach. Said were originally build with an Olds 455 and later (because the BB ended) with a 403. All were OE with a 3.07 rear end and a 3 speed Hydramatic. The 3.07 puts the engine speed right about where a typical OD trans would land. A 455 can survive this, but the 403 takes a beating. Later coach owners that have done to an aftermarket (we have amazing support) rear end have all reported improvements in fuel economy and better response. The fuel economy improvements are never great. Going from open loop carburetor to a closed loop with timing control gets the best, and then they report going from the common 8~10 to ~11 and even 12 on rare occasions.

Another issue just as big is that unless you travel a great deal (like 8~10Kmi/yr) fuel will not be one of your bigger costs. If you plan to stay at any crampgrounds, plan on 40+$/night. Tires only go 7/8 years and 16" are 250$us/ea. You should start a lockbox for maintenance of about 1K$/yr.

Somewhere, some idiot started a rumor that motorhomes can be inexpensive to own and operate. If I ever find that sucker, I plan to pummel him profoundly.

If you buy an older coach that has been in use this last year and has no water leaks at all and you can do all the work yourself, you can have it affordable. But, you have to be super diligent with both the regular and preventive maintenance to keep it reliable and affordable.

Matt

This is a good post. I also have an older coach and like it. In my case I have a done a big upgrade, but it is NOT suggested for others to do. FMC's in decent running condition can be gotten for 5-10,000. But with any older coach, (or newer one in my opinion!) you need to be able to do maintenance and minor repairs yourself. Also and motor homes and fuel mileage shouldn't be discussed in the same conversation! But I love my 29ft unit!

[Bumpyroad]

Matt_Colie wrote:
Matt (a different Matt)



Somewhere, some idiot started a rumor that motorhomes can be inexpensive to own and operate. If I ever find that sucker, I plan to pummel him profoundly.

Matt

perhaps he was comparing it to a yacht or a Lear Jet?
bumpy

[Mile_High]

Interesting on the 403, I didn't know that. Was that an overstroked 350 Olds Rocket?

[Matt_Colie]

Matt (a different Matt)

You are laboring under the weight of the preconceived misconception. Overdrive and transmission gear counts don't really do great things for fuel economy. As a great real world example, I am an owner and a member of the group (cult) of owners of an older coach. Said were originally build with an Olds 455 and later (because the BB ended) with a 403. All were OE with a 3.07 rear end and a 3 speed Hydramatic. The 3.07 puts the engine speed right about where a typical OD trans would land. A 455 can survive this, but the 403 takes a beating. Later coach owners that have done to an aftermarket (we have amazing support) rear end have all reported improvements in fuel economy and better response. The fuel economy improvements are never great. Going from open loop carburetor to a closed loop with timing control gets the best, and then they report going from the common 8~10 to ~11 and even 12 on rare occasions.

Another issue just as big is that unless you travel a great deal (like 8~10Kmi/yr) fuel will not be one of your bigger costs. If you plan to stay at any crampgrounds, plan on 40+$/night. Tires only go 7/8 years and 16" are 250$us/ea. You should start a lockbox for maintenance of about 1K$/yr.

Somewhere, some idiot started a rumor that motorhomes can be inexpensive to own and operate. If I ever find that sucker, I plan to pummel him profoundly.

If you buy an older coach that has been in use this last year and has no water leaks at all and you can do all the work yourself, you can have it affordable. But, you have to be super diligent with both the regular and preventive maintenance to keep it reliable and affordable.

Matt

[Captain_Happy]

In my life I've had 2 motor homes. The first one was a 2000 Damon Intruder, 34 footer, V-10, 3 speed tranny. Lower horse powered engine. We got around 7 mpg driving around 60 mph. the one I have now is a 2007 Winnebago Vista, 30 footer, Ford V-10, higher horse power engine, 4 speed tranny w/tow haul mode. I drive it at around 60 mph and still get around 7 mpg. And I could say it had any more power then the 2000 model. Probably was gear different.

My brother has a 2005 class B. It's on a Ford E450 Ford frame, 25 foot long, 2 slides, and has the Ford V-10 engine. And take a guess on the gas mileage he's getting. Answer is: 7 mpg

And yes, if you drive them faster the mileage really goes down big time.

[magik235]

I paid $8500 for my 1993 Damon. Check out the link below for details.

http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/26989746/srt/pa/pging/1/page/1

[D_E_Bishop]

The DW and I have traveled to all 49 continental states in a Bounder 27D and loved it. Today with the Winnie, it would be hard to go back to that era but darn, that was a great RV.

Remember unless it was garaged, it will be sunburned and the plastic trim and there was a lot in those days did not have UV protectors and will show sun rot.

Those aren't big problems but esist.

[Goldencrazy]

As single you can do so much with the space. Dual prupose area is smart. I would go smaller and get a good chassis. You can redo the interior to fit your needs. Smaller is easier bargaining and can be more stealthy if you plan on street parking. I would go to B, I love the Rialta if you could find a good used one. I guess you decide what you want to do, Boondocking in the desert is so much different than street parking.

[Son_of_Norway]

We love our HR, it was the top of the line in its day, but getting a motorhome that has a modern fuel-injected engine and more advanced transmission would be worth it.

[timmac]

Forget trying to upgrade transmission and try and save more money and buy a newer unit, the older they are the more problems they have, try to get one with fuel injection and it will have a over drive trans as well, the old carburetor models have to many issues with vapor lock, over heating and many other issues and you will be spending lots of time and dollars trying to fix those issues alone plus many other issues such as refrigerator, heater, a/c, roof leaks and such.

Newer is better when it comes to motorhomes..

Just my 2 cents.

[Bumpyroad]

what ever you do, don't get an old A built on a P30/32 chassis. very poor handling,
bumpy

[tatest]

Gas motorhomes in the 1980s will usually have Ford/John Deere or Chevy (P-30 series) chassis with 460 V8 and C6 automatic on the Ford, 454 V8 and TH475 automatic on the Chevy. These are three-speeds.

In the era before electronic controls, these drivetrains can be matched up with a Gear Vendors over/under drive, for about $3200 - $3600 plus installation. Best use of the combination might involve re-gearing the final drive to optimize 3+overdrive for your load and cruise speed (for some loads, particularly towing, overdrive can be too tall).

For something that cost $7000-8000 to start with, I think the additional cost of the overdrive would best be used to get something new enough to have the more modern fuel injected versions of these big V8s, combined with 4-speed overdrive automatics.

The added cost of the overdrive might even put the budget into the late 90s, early 2000 era, when GM offered the more powerful and economical Vortec engines with electronically controlled automatics, and Ford had made the transition to the Triton V-10.

27 feet usually gets you a bedroom and either dinette or sofa. 30-32 feet gets you a bedroom and dinette and sofa and maybe an easy chair or bigger kitchen or bathroom. You will not find much difference in getting around, finding parking, 27 vs 30 feet.

For concerns about gas mileage, weigh whatever additional cost for overdrive against how far you intend to drive and MPG improvements. I used about $10,000 worth of gas to move my 29-foot motorhome 30,000 miles. That was 8.2 MPG average, most of it in the $3 - $4 per gallon era. A 2 MPG improvement would have saved me about $2000 over that time, not quite halfway to paying for a Gear Vendors installation. Payout would need something like 60,000 to 100,000 miles of driving. I can get the 2 MPG improvement by slowing down 10-15 MPH.

Now that I'm using the motorhome mostly for short trips to the lake, I don't worry about MPG for those trips. I do my travel camping in a full-size van, 15-16 MPG, essentially what you can expect from a 1990s or later B (older ones might be more like 12-13).