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RE: DEF Math

Buy from the pump at truck stops. Not only is it fresh and stored in a cool place to last longer, but is also only costs about $2 per gallon. My dealerships sells DEF. I can tell you that most of it sits out in a hot warehouse or in a hot semi-trailer for ages before being put out in the showroom which lowers the shelf life.
ShinerBock 11/25/20 08:30am Tow Vehicles
RE: 2012 F-150 tow rating

The truck will easily and safely tow 8k. I towed about 10k with my 2012 F150HD and a 7k enclosed trailer with my 2012 F150 Ecoboost 2wd work truck that had 3.15 rear gears. It didn't do it as well as my personal F150 HD with 3.73's truck, but it did do better than the 2011 F150 5.0L with 3.55 gears work truck I had before that. Both of the work truck only had the basic tow package. If the tow rating of your truck is 11k, then that means you have the max trailer tow package and have a slightly different suspension than the regular F150. This gives you more GVWR and GAWR than the standard F150, and therefore more payload if that is a concern. You are probably between 1.7-2k payload if this is the case. Using the standard 12% tongue weight, an 8k trailer's tongue weight is around 960 lbs which will leave you plenty of rating left over for a small family.
ShinerBock 11/22/20 10:21am Tow Vehicles
RE: Ram 2500 DEF fluid

I have a tuned and deleted 230hp/375lb-ft (stock is 180hp/280lb-ft) 2.0L diesel BMW 328d which I bought as a fun yet fuel efficient commuter car for my 40 mile one way commute. Down the winding roads, the car is fun to drive, but I would still rather be in my truck in any other conditions. The truck is a blast to drive tuned which is why I generally like to drive it on weekends over the car. The torque pull at 1,300-1,800 of the truck is not something the 328d can match since it doesn't start to really pull until around 1,700 rpm due to it being a higher revving diesel with a shorter bore/stroke ratio.
ShinerBock 11/21/20 01:19pm Tow Vehicles
RE: Ram 2500 DEF fluid

^^^What I don't get is why? If a person wants the acceleration of a Civic why not just buy a Civic? I don't think I have ever put my foot to the floor with my truck when I wasn't towing. Even towing it is rare that I am to the floor. Really? I am not stupid and I know the "Civic" comment is intentional passive aggressive dig because it is not a PSD in the video. Yet you tout the 475 hp bump when the engine in question is a PSD.... So obviously you want more power or you would not be excited about Ford increasing it. The last time I did a 0-60 run tuned, it was 5.6 seconds which is well under the 7-8 seconds that a standard Civic can do. As I have stated before in other threads, it is not just about the power at 2,800 rpm. It is about the power at 1,300-1,800 rpm that is more important and makes the truck more fun to drive. My tuned horsepower at 1,800 is more than what I made stock at 2,600 rpm which not only helps keep me in a lower gear when towing, but also makes the truck more fun to drive. There is nothing wrong with someone wanting the truck they will drive for 200-300k miles to be more fun to drive. I have seen people spend way more money than what it costs to delete a truck on other things that brings them joy like RVs or building a garage queen classic car. Maybe they can't afford to have both a hot rod and a daily driver truck that is also used to tow. I know many friends back in the day that the same diesel truck they drove to work all week was the same one they would head to the drag strip with drag tires in the bed on Friday night, blow the doors of a few mustangs, and put the street tires back on to head back home. That very same truck was used to haul the cattle trailer on Saturday and take the family to church on Sunday. It was their passion in life and there is nothing wrong with that. Some of these friends still do it although they are well off enough to have a dedicated race vehicle. It wasn't just diesel guys either. I knew a lot of guys with supped up daily driver cars or motorcycles that did the same. Even if they didn't take it to the strip, it was what they liked to do and there is nothing wrong with that.
ShinerBock 11/21/20 12:30pm Tow Vehicles
RE: Ram 2500 DEF fluid

Shiner: interesting observations. I'm wondering if rolling coal is a fad whose time has come and gone. There is no emissions testing mandated by Florida; there might be local testing in Southeast Fl counties. I haven't even seen a coal roller with the asinine 6 or 8" stack protruding out of the truck bed in I don't when? What happened? That is because there less of the old (non-common rail) diesels on the road as time goes by. When people hear about a modern diesel being deleted, most ignorantly think of old diesels rolling coal everywhere they go. This is not the case because the DPF, EGR, and SCR were not the only devices added to modern diesels to keep emissions and PM down. Black smoke is essentially unburnt fuel because you do not have enough air for for the amount of fuel being dumped and/or it is too much at once to completely burn it. The more fuel/power you add, the more it will blow black smoke. This is one of the reasons why old diesels were very low on power because they had to comply with PM standards that took effect back in the early 90's. Basically, older non-high pressure common rail diesels operated at low psi compared to common rail diesels. The HUEI pump 7.3L maxed out at around 3,000 psi and the HEUI pump 6.0L maxed out at round 3,600 psi. Old Cummins p-pumps maxed out at round 5,000 psi. All of todays common rail diesels max out at over 25,000 psi and some of the latest diesels are over 30k psi. Higher pressures means better atomization of the fuel which means a more complete burn which means less smoke. Old diesels also had one injection event so it dumped a lot of fuel all at once which coupled with lower pressure (less fuel atomization) means a lower power tolerance for black smoke. They essentially had to keep fuel/power low to keep them from rolling coal and even slight power gains would make them do so. Modern diesels have multi-fire injectors that can fire multiple times for a more complete burn and lower NVH since there are smaller multiple "bang's" during a cycle rather than one big one. There is generally a pilot injection to get the combustion needed and multiple injections as the piston is travelling down. This burns the fuel more completely meaning less black smoke. You also have turbo technology differences such as faster spooling ball bearing turbos, better blade designs, and variable geometry to get more air in at lower rpms to keep smoke down as well. The quicker you get more air to burn the fuel, the less black. These are some of the main reasons why even modern deleted diesels will not smoke as bad as older diesels. Fords especially got a bad rap because they did not switch to high pressure common rail until the 2008 with the 6.4L while Cummins did it in 2003 and the Duramax has always been common rail. Of course there is a fuel/power limit to where you will blow black smoke in a modern diesel, but that fuel/power limit is much higher than older diesels. In most cases, if a modern deleted diesel is blowing a ton of black smoke, then he is either having some sort of engine issues, is on too hot of a tune well past the limits of his turbo, or the purposely tuned it that way(which makes them an a-hole) by removing the multiple injection events. On my 400hp to the wheels tune, there is absolute no smoke even if I go wide open throttle. At around the 450-475 hp to the wheels mark, there might be a slight puff if I go wide open from a dead stop or from a lower rpm with low boost, however, it quickly goes away within seconds once the turbo spools up. At 500+hp to the wheels, it is the same scenario as the previous level, but with a more black smoke initially that starts to clears up once the turbo spools to catch up with the fuel being dumped. It is not a ton of smoke though, and no where near what the old diesels would do when turned up. Here is a good video showing the differences. Keep in mind that this is with the stock turbo and mine has a lot more airflow than stock. Anarchy diesel EFI live CSP5 cummins tuning (stock, tow, street, hotstreet, race)
ShinerBock 11/21/20 11:12am Tow Vehicles
RE: Ram 2500 DEF fluid

My def gauge is bottomed out on Empty, and I never add any, but it runs GREAT. Will this hurt anything? Oh wait! The exhaust is laying in my shop! And the truck runs like it should!!!! Hahahahaha Yup you're one of the ones that makes the world hate diesels. PLEASE explain why. My Son’s truck runs VERY CLEAN. I think the assumption is that most of them don't. Just too many people think its appropriate/necessary to roll coal. While there trade offs with the current emissions requirements, I for one appreciate not seeing black smoke billowing from trucks, as well as being able to follow behind a diesel and not have to turn my HVAC to "recirculate" to avoid the exhaust smell. I have to do the same with gassers sometimes. Only difference is I can't see the exhaust, but I can surely smell it. Most direct injected gassers these days blows out a ton of PM, but it is too small to see compared to the bigger particles of the diesels. This is not a good thing because these smaller particles are small enough to get into your bloodstream causing more damage than the larger diesel particulates. Also, with modern diesels, you would have to be running a very high powered tune or one meant to blow smoke. With much higher fuel pressures, VG turbos, and multi-fire injectors than the diesels of yesterday, you can delete a modern diesel and never see a drop of black smoke. In fact, most people that do delete run tunes that don't smoke. I have to select my 500+ hp tune in order to blow any kind of smoke and even then it it is only a small puff which clears up the second my turbo spools enough air for the amount of fuel I am dumping. All of my other tunes ranging from 400-500 hp do not blow black smoke. I would bet there there are a lot more deleted trucks around you than you think, but they are not running hot tunes all the time so they are not rolling coal. The old single injection diesels blew a lot of black smoke even with just mild power added due to the low fuel pressure and one injection event per cycle. This caused a lot of fuel to go unburned versus todays diesels that have fuel pressures 10-20k psi higher and up to seven injection events per cycle. It is that small percentage of diesel tuners that do blow a ton of black smoke and they are no different than the small percentage of gasser guys(although bigger in number) that delete their cats and other emissions stuff to to hot rod their vehicles. The only difference is that you can see it on the diesel, but not on the gas. Although I will say that my main gripe about diesel emissions is not the DPF that traps the black smoke. It is the EGR and SCR/DEF systems which have nothing to do with black smoke other than the EGR creates more of it when open. If we only had DPF's on these trucks then I would bet that you would see a lot less people removing their emissions systems, myself included. However, in order to remove the SCR/DEF system, you have to remove the DPF as well.
ShinerBock 11/21/20 08:52am Tow Vehicles
RE: Ram 2500 DEF fluid

And just think, you have to use all of this DEF just to save a very tiny .01 g/km versus older trucks that didn't use it. I wonder if that .01 g/km is worth the added pollution from the jugs and chemical plants used to make DEF. Probably not. Heck, even our older trucks without DEF and EGR's had a lower NOx limits than even the latest Euro emissions standards. One would think that their mortality rate would be lower if NOx is as bad as the EPA says it is in the US given that the Euro emissions have been a lot higher than ours for decades and they have many times more diesels on the road than the US. However, our mortality rate is near the bottom versus most European countries because it is acceptable by the government to eat 10 cheeseburgers a week, but how dare you release an added .01 g/kw of NOx even though other countries are much higher without issues. https://i.postimg.cc/ncJjM5Hr/US-vs-EU-emissions.png height=550 width=550
ShinerBock 11/20/20 08:07am Tow Vehicles
RE: The price of new trucks is beyond comprehension!

$10k in 1984 is $25k in 2020 adjusted for inflation. That is not too far off from the base price of a 2020 Ram 1500 Tradesman with a Pentastar that cost $29k. Although the 2020 V6 has 305hp/269lb-ft with an 8-speed versus the 120hp/245lb-ft and 4-speed of the old 318. It probably gets 50-75% better fuel economy too. Not only that, but it has government mandated things like air bags, reverse cameras, stability control, anti-lock brakes, and crush resistant pillars to name a few. So I will say that is about even given the added stuff you get since a $29k vehicle in 2020 is equivalent to an $11.5k vehicle in 1984. I bet a lot of people would have paid that back then to get all of the added features stated above. People often forget about inflation even though them wanting raises and more money at their job every year for doing the same work is part of the reason why a dollar cannot buy the same thing today as it did 30 years ago.
ShinerBock 11/19/20 04:16pm Tow Vehicles
RE: Ram 2500 DEF fluid

The DEF usage ratio is about 50 to 1 per Cummins meaning for every 50 gallons of diesel fuel burned, you will use 1 gallon of DEF. The less miles per gallon you get in fuel, the less miles per gallon you get in DEF. So if you are getting 15 mpg, then you are getting 750 mpg in DEF. If you are getting 10 mpg, then you are getting 500 mpg in DEF. Basically, multiply 50 times your MPG and you will get your DEF mpg.
ShinerBock 11/19/20 10:01am Tow Vehicles
RE: New mall crawler!

Can I plug in the Bullydog and just use it as a monitor with the EFI tunes? Yes. I did it for a short period of time until I got my CTS2.
ShinerBock 11/18/20 11:48am Tow Vehicles
RE: New mall crawler!

Awesome, congrats!! The only modification I think it needs is the blacked out projector headlights that came stock with the Laramie blacked out trucks. They sell some really good aftermarket ones too for less than $400. Did they give you the EFI Autocal as well? You will need it if you every switch tunes. At the very least I would find out who did the tuning. They will have your files for the VIN in their system and can just put them on a new Autocal that you will have to buy.
ShinerBock 11/18/20 08:03am Tow Vehicles
RE: Those that have tuned or programmed

Appreciate you guys turning my thread into your own personal sh!t show. Sorry, I will stop. My goal was to provide some kind of info on what your truck can sustain at certain tuned power ratings, and what mods are needed.
ShinerBock 11/11/20 08:09am Tow Vehicles
RE: Those that have tuned or programmed

There is nothing wrong with advertising short burst power over sustained power. It is completely legit using SAE methods and all of them do it to a certain extent. Some more than others. To some companies, highest power ratings possible is more important for marketing and being "best in class". Other companies feel that sustained power is a more important figure for their customers. I have worked for both Ford and Cummins and I would definitely put Ford in the former while Cummins was more in the later. Ford knows that "best in class" power ratings sells more trucks, and they will do whatever they can to keep these titles. So does Ram, and they(or Dodge at that time) wanted Cummins to post highest power levels possible back when I was there and probably still do. However, that is not the way Cummins does things and would rather give a more sustained hp rating to their customers rather than a short burst power rating so they tune their engines accordingly. Take the Ford F450-550 and Ram 4500-5500 trucks. The highest rating for the PSD is 330 hp while the highest rating for the CTD is 360 hp. That alone tells you that the Cummins is able put out more sustained power since the emissions and power certifications on these trucks is geared towards the emissions and power at sustained power outputs.
ShinerBock 11/11/20 08:03am Tow Vehicles
RE: Those that have tuned or programmed

More passive aggressiveness. I thought we already covered the difference between short burst rated power outputs and sustained rated power outputs and how sustained power is more important while towing. Although it is not just about power, it is also about fuel economy. Tuned, I am able to pull up hills at lower rpms that would make my father in laws 2019 F350 downshift into a lower gear at much higher rpms. It takes a lot to make it shift out of the 1,800 rpm range at 65 since I have about 400 hp available at that rpm.
ShinerBock 11/11/20 06:46am Tow Vehicles
RE: Those that have tuned or programmed

Shiner I know you know some things. I also know you have more experience with tuned engines than I have, but when you say things like:I tow mine in level 3 of 4 which is about 475 hp at the wheels. I never have a problem with EGTs, but my intake and intercooler is not stock. Neither is my turbo, exhaust manifold, and the rest of the 5" exhaust. One can reliably tow on higher power level tunes if they have the mods to support it. it comes across to me as though you are claiming that you can reliably put 475 HP to the pavement with a tuner plus a few mods to your intake and exhaust.... maybe you can for a 20 second run. Maybe you and I both know that, but you don't say it. You don't say that if you actually made your engine deliver 475 HP to the rear wheels the engine would overheat in a matter of minutes; You don't remind whoever is reading this that the 68rfe is designed to handle 300 rear wheel horsepower and that it will have a very limited life if it is expected to handle 475 HP. Whether the Cummins engine can tolerate that kind of power for any length of time or not I don't know but I suspect that if Ram ever wants to increases their power ratings to the 548 crankshaft HP you talk about, Cummins will make some significant changes to their 6.7 and not just because of the emission BS. I actually started out wanting to ask you some questions to learn what is out there in the aftermarket diesel world .... especially in the area of cooling. Again, you are not reading what I am posting. I already stated that while I mainly tow in the 475 hp tune, but moslty for the power/torque it makes at 1,800 rpm. I rarely use all 475 hp except for a few passing scenarios which I stated earlier as well. Why are you not reading what I am saying? If you did, then it would have saved both of us lots of time. I also have a custom built 68RFE which I have mentioned multiple times in other threads. Although with trans tuning and light mods, the 68rfe can handle up to around 500 hp with a long life. It wasn't until around 2013 that the tuners were finally able to tune the 68RFE to be able to handle the added power. Before this tuning, about 450 hp was all it would handle. Beginners will generally refer to their tunes as tow, economy, race, or hot which is not really a good indication to know what kind of power you are talking about. Why? Because using terms like tow or level one could mean two different power outputs between various tuners. One tuners tow or level one on a Cummins could be 430 hp while another's could be 390 hp. Using hp increases is not a good term either because some tuners use higher gains throughout the whole rev range while others use the gains at peak. This is why Calibrated Power Solutions(and myself) refer to tunes by the horsepower ratings in the video I posted because people will know that max effort on all of the big three current diesels tuned on stock fuel and air is about 520ish hp and giving a power level instead of a tune number or name(which could mean anything) is a way to better understand how close to max effort the tune is given what kind of mods are on the truck. Also in that video they reiterated what I have been saying about having gauges and knowing your truck before going to the higher powered tunes. So I am sorry for you that you don't like the fact that I refer to my "level 3" tune as my 475 hp tune, but that is what it is based on my dyno and is what I will continue to call it. And I have to call BS on the learning thing. A few passive aggressive fanboy posts blows that excuse out of the water. How dare I say that the mighty Powerstroke's 475 hp rating is not sustained or say that my truck makes more power than that. You must defend Ford's honor..... lol
ShinerBock 11/10/20 08:39pm Tow Vehicles
RE: Those that have tuned or programmed

I have been reading what you posted. You didn’t seem to appreciate my post suggesting the need to watch your gauges closely when towing with a tuned truck. I just wondered what would happen if you ignored them. Seems like we agree that tuning a truck puts it in a category where you need to be careful with it while towing. I also agree with you that your turbo upgrade is a very important addition if you’re wanting to tow with a tuned truck. You come across as though you don’t think the cooling system on a stock Ram is a very limiting factor when you start adding power. I know first hand the kind of cooling that is required to put 400 hp to the pavement with a truck.... and I know you’re not going to get that kind of cooling out of a 27 x 22 inch radiator. Getting rid of the EGR is not what it used to be. Basically you can’t throw a turbo and tuner on a pick up and turn it into a Freightliner. Again, have you even been reading my posts? Seriously, go back and real all of them and you will notice me telling people that they need gauges and supporting mods when they are towing heavy on high power level tunes. This isn't my first rodeo and I know what my truck is capable of along with what it's limits are. I am not sure why you feel the need to explain things to me like I don't. So please, stop being so concerned for what gear I tow in and and what power levels I choose to do it in. Besides, I probably have way more experience behind tuned vehicles and various medium/heavy duty diesel engines(both driving them and test cell dyno testing) than you do so why would I listen to an armchair quarterback with less experience especially one that doesn't have any experience driving what I do?
ShinerBock 11/10/20 12:55pm Tow Vehicles
RE: Those that have tuned or programmed

^^^I bet if you were to ever climb a long 6 or 7% grade at 60 mph, on a hot day with that 4020 you'd watch your gauges very close. In a situation like that, would you have to back off to prevent overheating or would your programmer defuel for you? If my temps were getting hot then I would defuel myself while my father-in-laws stock F350 will do it on its own. There are limiter built into my tuning files that, but I back it down before they are reached. Although I am not sure what the point is here since I have already stated that the various power levels I use are based on the load and temps I am at just like the stock engines. Are you not reading what I am posting? I would also ask what is the point putting my truck in a scenario it will likely never be in because I would have went with a different truck set up (like a 4.10 DRW HO) if that were the case? The main difference is that I can sustain higher power levels than stock since I have mods that can support higher power levels and reduce how much heat the cooling system has to shed versus stock. My coolant system does not have to keep an EGR cooler and turbo actuator cool on top of keeping the engine cool. My intake is set up in a way to keep temps 10% lower than stock, and there hardly any resistance pressure in my 5" exhaust. This is essentially the same setup that my hot shot friends use on the DRW HO's that allows them to keep it at 425 hp at the wheels towing much heavier weights than I am on a regular basis.
ShinerBock 11/10/20 10:34am Tow Vehicles
RE: Those that have tuned or programmed

I actually have towed more than what my 3.42 standard output Cummins truck was designed for on multiple occasions when transferring our cabbed John Deere 4020 tractor between properties about once or twice a year for the past five years because my father-in-laws F350 6.0 was not up to the task. Now that he has his 2019 F350 3.55, he tows it, but requires a lower gear at a higher rpm than my truck to do so.
ShinerBock 11/10/20 09:08am Tow Vehicles
RE: Those that have tuned or programmed

Well, I will let my hot shot buddies who have put well over 300k miles towing with the 400+hp at the wheels that a guy on a forum who has never owned a tuned and moded truck like theirs did the math on their radiator sizes and said they better be watching their gauges because they are pushing it. I am not concerned, but maybe your math is enough to trump their real world experience and make them more concerned. God forbid they make more power than the mighty 475 crank hp Powerstroke. Something has to be found wrong if they do because only that engine was built to handle it.
ShinerBock 11/10/20 06:35am Tow Vehicles
RE: Those that have tuned or programmed

Coolant still flows through the EGR cooler regardless of whether the EGR valve on the other side of the cooler is open to let cooled exhaust escape into the intake or not. You also have coolant cooling down the electronic turbo actuator which gets very hot. I don't care about the surface area of the new Ford's or Ram are and don't want to make this into a fanboy p!$$ing contest thread of comparing trucks neither if us own or drive. This thread is about tuned diesels and how well they tow at different power levels which I am providing my own real world experience on.
ShinerBock 11/09/20 07:48pm Tow Vehicles
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