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 > Your search for posts made by 'vtraudt' found 46 matches.

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RE: Kia, Hyundai: Please come to the rescue "Pathetic Quality"

Unfortunately inspection is a lost art. In North American manufacturing there has been a major swing to self inspection. If I do it wrong without realizing it then it goes down the line like that. Owners save money by having a minimal quality department at the expense of, you guessed it, product quality. And if supply and demand are somewhat in balance, then there IS a penalty (=cost) associated with low product quality. But currently, it is and Indiana monopoly (the RV Mafia), and they get by even AFTER the 2021 price hike of 25% (last dealer survey).
vtraudt 10/03/21 01:03pm Travel Trailers
RE: Kia, Hyundai: Please come to the rescue "Pathetic Quality"

I'm not sure why Kia and Hyundai were mentioned in the OPs post Simply space holders for any market disruptors, those being the most recent once from the auto industry. Earlier examples where Honda, Toyota. Could be a new player from Canada or Mexico. Could be a new player outside the current "Indiana Cartel" that holds a monopoly on the RV market in the US. Maybe a big European manufacturer wants to seize the opportunity and break into the North American domestic market with a good value proposition (bang for buck, Quality:Price ratio). Or a big China player just buying up one of the Cartel members, putting up new plants outside Indiana, new top management, more dedicated managers and workforce.
vtraudt 09/15/21 06:36am Travel Trailers
RE: Kia, Hyundai: Please come to the rescue "Pathetic Quality"

The current situation: - high demand (so companies get away with PATHETIC quality "proudly made in USA" (big sticker on my Forest River trailer) - workforce shortage (so workers get away with "I don't give a ****" attitued towards quality and craftsmanship) - qualified, skilled, good attitude workforce shortage (so works stay on the job that would normally be fired on the spot) - managment that makes tons of profit for the shareholders (very high demand) - NO outside (of Indiana) competition so EVERYONE is having a good time/profit by providing the same pathetic quality since no one gets penalized
vtraudt 09/14/21 05:07pm Travel Trailers
Kia, Hyundai: Please come to the rescue "Pathetic Quality"

I think the market is ripe for a 'disrupter'. Maybe foreign builders need to enter the market to wake up the "Indiana RV Maffia" "One West Coast dealer echoed those thoughts. “My greatest fear now is watching the motorized RV industry get toppled,” he said. “They just don’t have the expertise to complete a motorhome in Northern Indiana anymore. Their labor force has no eye for quality and they have no way of teaching it. The industry is ripe for someone else to step in and start producing quality products, but it will likely have to be someplace other than Indiana. Right now, if the workers there get upset by something, they just walk off because it’s easy to get a job in Elkhart right now.” https://www.rvtravel.com/pathetic-quality-rv-dealers-fed-manufacturers-producing-1017b/?fbclid=IwAR2teVjEoUA7FN2L5rJzIU89iYB3WXm9dyZ8Wu309q_2BSBiX0UVYKrj7cw
vtraudt 09/14/21 11:18am Travel Trailers
RE: Rear Bumper Storage - how bad is it?

Only concerned about the increased sway tendency from the added mass so far away from center. Any mass you added to the hitch tongue would tend to counteract the additional mass in the back. At any given instant, any torque applied by the mass in the back will be resisted by the mass in the front. No, that is not how inertia works. Any mass added away from the center line ADDS to the inertia.
vtraudt 09/09/21 07:09am Travel Trailers
RE: Rear Bumper Storage - how bad is it?

Gotta worry about the bounce too. Good point. Whatever is stored back there needs to be secured (vertically as well) and content 'rattle and bounce' proof.
vtraudt 09/09/21 07:07am Travel Trailers
RE: Rear Bumper Storage - how bad is it?

BTW, our current Class C, I added a spare tire carrier and spare...the carrier alone was HEAVY -- solid steel -- to carry the 200lb (guestimate) spare tire. The carrier also allows me to still tow a car flat down or trailer. On the C, on a 450 chassis, I don't notice it at all. You probably experienced the same on a C... On my first class C, I mounted a HUGE wooden box (on wheels, serving as outdoor storage in the winter) to the rear frame (Chevy class C chassis, 25 ft, huge rear overhang). It was SO heavy, that going through road 'dips' it felt (or actual?) the front wheels came OFF THE GROUND. Also: front brakes locked up like CRAZY during emergency braking (no weight!). In retrospect: I was a nutty setup!
vtraudt 09/08/21 07:53am Travel Trailers
RE: Rear Bumper Storage - how bad is it?

I added an aluminum tool box at the rear then added larger propane tanks, two batteries and a 2k generator up front to Not afraid about the weight balance (I plan to add storage up front as well) or overall weight (we travel fairly light, plenty off weight 'room' to get to our 7500 lb trailer weight limit). Obviously, under floor storage (near axle, or further to the front) would be ideal, but inconvenient (will add some 'shelf' down there for storing boards, battery relocation, spare tire and other stuff not often needed). Only concerned about the increased sway tendency from the added mass so far away from center.
vtraudt 09/08/21 07:49am Travel Trailers
Rear Bumper Storage - how bad is it?

The easiest place to make more room for stuff is the rear of the trailer. I used a large platform on all my Class C RV. But now with travel trailer, any mass added 'back there' is not just reducing the tongue weight (which could be compensated by relocating items). But adding mass so far away from the center adds a LOT of inertia to the trailer. I am wondering how much it can or will impact the towing stability and sway tendency. https://drive.google.com/file/d/16oDb3OWVwAaeicJUVJ1MYutku4aN96zU/view?usp=sharing
vtraudt 09/08/21 06:44am Travel Trailers
RE: Adding scissor jacks for side to side leveling

What is wrong with that simple view point? Doesn’t need a discussion of gravity. There is nothgin wrong per se with the simple few: the rear overhang when on wheels is bending the frame down under its weight/mass (gravity does it, and in addition, acceleration (from bumps) does it too. Bend lifting up, it is bending the frame up by (simplified) the same amount. Regarding uneven "twisting". If you drive through a pothole with one side of camper only, the same 'twisting' of the frame will occurs as if you lift on one corner only. How much (in accurate terms and amounts) bending down (gravity, acceleration from bumps) and up (lifting, bumps) takes place is difficult to calculate (too many unknown variables). Fact is: our trailers bend A LOT already (mostly down)
vtraudt 09/02/21 07:16am Travel Trailers
RE: Adding scissor jacks for side to side leveling

I can't stand under the "potentially several times". You don't have to stand under anything if you don't want to. But if 'back/forth' is not an option (as stated), it simply IS not an option. Hence, an alternative way is needed.
vtraudt 09/02/21 07:08am Travel Trailers
RE: Adding scissor jacks for side to side leveling

Assuming you have a twin axle trailer? You also said jacks, not stabilizers. Jacks can and will and are made to lift the trailer. We are not talking about stabilizers. I lift the frame at the axle point. I used a bottle neck hydro jack, not scissors jack. For a dual axle I put the jack between the axles under the frame if possible, or as close to the axle as I can get if in front or behind the axles. This does not put any new stresses on the frame and lifts the frame at about where the axles hold the frame anyway. Or easier to just lift the axle, not the frame. One axle is fine and will not damage the frame, body, or door or bend anything. Your trailer goes on one axle all the time driving it around (one of 4 wheels unloaded anyway). I do this only in extreme situations if I have to park off level and my other leveling method is too short. Parking on ramps or boards or rocks is much preferred to me. It is easier than crawling around with a jack. I was under there yesterday; the process is certainly easy (lifted one axle at a time, but board under. But it is combersome. If planning to keep trailer ON WHEELS, then lifting axle is easier. If NOT using wheels, I would lift the FRAME and put jackstand under frame. I will use this method when 'driving back/forth' (potentially several times) is not an option. And certainly in my driveway (car/trailer under angle, incline and more than 4 inches to level sideways. For axle lifting, I am planning to make a "U" shaped top for my bottle jack. For the 'frame lifting', a square platform (with replaceable wood on top).
vtraudt 09/01/21 02:23pm Travel Trailers
RE: Fresh water tank

Just received a 'fountain' pump (submerge style). Will check today if I can get it through the LID of the 7 gal jug. Has barb adapter for 1/2" (?) hose. The pump BARELY (I ground off some edges) through the large lid, but then need to put the barbed adapter on the outlet and push the hose on. Doable, but a bit combersome. Will look into 'plumbing' up teh pump inside and bring the 110V wire/plug and the hose (garden hose connection) to the outside (small hole for wired and larger hole for the garden hose connection). Not sure if large blobs of silicon (inside as good as possible, plus from the outside) will seal AND hold. I think I have seen srew on conenctions for fresh water tanks, but nut sure how they work (and if they work with the really thin walled 8 gal roller jug I want to use). Then tried my "spare" sureflow (self sucker supposedly). Bought adapter from home depot (plumbing expert) from sureflow thread (had pump with me) to garden hose. Screwed on a few threads, but then started to go crooked. NOT sure if they gave me the correct thread, but forced it on with teflon tape. Turns out that pump is shot (have to suck water in only then will it pump; gravity alone NOT enough). Ordered repair kit for the pump, see if it works. Benefit: short suction hose (garden hose connection), stuck through top of jug. existing fresh water hose (or another short 8 ft section) from pump into fresh water tank fill. Run 12V with connectors to near the fill and plug in the pump.
vtraudt 08/31/21 06:46am Travel Trailers
RE: Fresh water tank

Just received a 'fountain' pump (submerge style). Will check today if I can get it through the LID of the 7 gal jug. Has barb adapter for 1/2" (?) hose. If that works, I think I am all set. Wouldn't mind a couple short trips to the water source to fill the small (wheeled, nice handle, large enough yet small enough to stow) to make it to the end of the stay. Last trip, we actually made it on one fill (2 person this time, lot less dishes).
vtraudt 08/30/21 08:20am Travel Trailers
RE: Adding scissor jacks for side to side leveling

You are correct (if you put your trailer into a no gravity zone (like outer space). You are my first alien contact on RV.Net. If you would bring your trailer here on earth, gravity does do its bending thing, if you like it or not. In fact EVERYTHING on earth is bent (past tense), sometimes just bent into a straight line (I know, this will bend (present tense) your brain; double pun intended (yes, gravity bends even the stiffes brain on earth!). This sounds like somebody educated beyond their intelligence, or acting stupid. Over the years I have bent a lot of steel, (most, but not all on purpose). I have had some sag under own weight when lifting 1 end. But even a super light duty, like a garden cart, when loaded to capacity, you lift the tongue, the back goes down, but nothing bends. (If it did, you could not tow it without it bending.) Who is talking about raising the tonque? if you raise or lower the tonque, the bending does not change (yes, it is bent if a load is applied). But if gravity is present, your tonque is actually pushing UP the A frame. If you want to test it (the amount of bend), balance out the trailer (for example put a lot of weight on the rear until the tonque just lifts up. Now check how much your rear has gone down. That is about the amount your front is sagging. Note: you would need to put jacks under the center (axles) to prevent your suspension to go down. But the concept of a beam bending, the force that act upon the beam, bending stiffness, moment of inertia, forces from acceleration, etc is very much beyond the grasp of the most of the members of this forum, and not (I realize it finally) suited for discussion here.
vtraudt 08/30/21 06:21am Travel Trailers
RE: Adding scissor jacks for side to side leveling

As for it not adding any strength, see the exerpt from my previous google quote: Cambering beams allow smaller beams to be used in place of larger beams to support the same load.May 29, 2016. (that is a very cost effective way of making an RV lighter.) Yes, allow smaller beams to be used in place of a larger beam so support the same load. Reason: the beam was BENT UP, adding load flattens it to be used with the 'house'. It was BENT DOWN by the load of the house to be flat again. It did NOT make the beam STIFFER. It did NOT (and your article nowhere states it since it is NOT true) reduce the bending. The beam was just crooked to start ("cambered") and then flexed down (bent) by the weight. The amount would have been teh same if they had started with a straight beem, the beam would then flex down by the weight of the house, by the same amount. Quite simple physics (here: stiffness of a beam as calculated by moment of inertial (simple example: rectangle shape beam: https://wesbeam.com/Wesbeam/media/Images/Blog%20images/2019-08-27_14-10-28.png).
vtraudt 08/29/21 05:38pm Travel Trailers
RE: Adding scissor jacks for side to side leveling

Lifting at the 2 rear corners (the front is already lifted at the corner, the A frame (front jack) lifts the 2 front corners, and all the static bending is/has taken place every time you put your front jack down, or hook up your trailer to the car) You must have some weird trailer. Other than the ones with floating tongue, any of the hundreds, if not thousands of trailers I have been around, jack the front up, the rear goes down. When pivot on the suspension, there is no force to flex the frame. You are correct (if you put your trailer into a no gravity zone (like outer space). You are my first alien contact on RV.Net. If you would bring your trailer here on earth, gravity does do its bending thing, if you like it or not. In fact EVERYTHING on earth is bent (past tense), sometimes just bent into a straight line (I know, this will bend (present tense) your brain; double pun intended (yes, gravity bends even the stiffes brain on earth!).
vtraudt 08/29/21 05:26pm Travel Trailers
RE: Adding scissor jacks for side to side leveling

People also ask What is a cambered chassis? In the structural engineering world, camber is known as having a slight arc or bend induced in a beam. Yes, cambered means using a pre bent beam. Take a piece of steel, and bend it over your knee. Now it cambered. Adding weight of top of that piece of steel, and it gets flatter (fi the pre bent was up). Putting some welding lines on top of a piece of steel will induce stress, and bent the piece of steel. EVERY weld does that. That is why when welding pieces of steel together, the welder is using a certain sequence to equalized the bending if a straight, NOT bent work piece is desired at the end. You could also use a TORCH and heat up one side of your beam, and then quench (to induce thermal stress). If you have a high carbon content steel, you could actual HARDEN that material (think knives and swords). That bead of weld - while bending the beam for the intended purpose - does NOT make it stiffer. Sorry.
vtraudt 08/29/21 05:06pm Travel Trailers
RE: Fresh water tank

Just a thought as I am thinking of a solution for us as well... Most water pumps have a bypass already installed for winterization with a short cut hose designed for pumping antifreeze. If one carried an extra 40+ gallon bladder, could you not use a full length hose off that typically short hose connection and run it to the bladder? Then just flip your valve from the internal tank to the external tank when needed? Anyone see any downside to that concept? My class C had the 2 way valve on the pump inlet: 1 = get water from fresh water tank 2 = suck in antifreeze. Unfortuantely, my cheap Forest River Sales travel trailer does NOT have it. Otherwise (if connections on the suction side can be made, and more so if spare water is not substantially lower (can only suck up that much), that would allow to USE the spare tank, but NOT to FILL the fresh water tank, unless you now also connect a trailer faucet and run the line back into your freshwater fill connection.
vtraudt 08/29/21 04:52pm Travel Trailers
RE: Adding scissor jacks for side to side leveling

https://i.imgur.com/9j3d5Zul.jpg "border=0" https://i.imgur.com/m3zZPvb.pngClick For Full-Size Image. The few lines of surface welds induce some heat stress to the beam, which then bends up. This helps to end with a someone flat beam when load is applied and axles put underneath to push up. It does NOT add any strenght. It only changes the bending line (crooked before weight, somewhat raight when loaded 'dry', somewhat crooked again when additional load is added (full tanks, food, storage, stuff on the rear bumper, stuff on the A frame, etc). There may ONE very special/rare load condition when this beam is STRAIGHT. For practical terms, it will NEVER be straight. The amount of bending depends ONLY on a) the stiffness of the frame (fixed, and NOT influenced by the pre bending) b) the load and load distribution. Lifting at the 2 rear corners (the front is already lifted at the corner, the A frame (front jack) lifts the 2 front corners, and all the static bending is/has taken place every time you put your front jack down, or hook up your trailer to the car), will add equal (but in reality less) than the normal static flex. Less, because A the axle is not in the middle of the lifting point and be the load is heavier on the front section ('tonque weight'). So lifting on the rear corners will ADD static bending (in the opposite direction. NO QUESTION. The AMOUNT of bending could be the range (but opposite direction of the 'empty load' (the weight of the chassis itself, plus weight of the empty 'house'). In my case: 4400 lb weight empty, assumpe 2200 on 'rear' half. Lets call this the 'flat static' (assuming pre bend frame to make it 'flat' with this load). Now adding 120 gal of fluid (black, grey , fresh water) (on earth, roughly 1000 lbs) near the rear bumper. That ADDS 50% to the static bend. Now we bounce it over a speed bump at 3 g. That is now an additional 2 g or 2000 lb near the rear bumber for a total of 3000 lbs. That is 1.5 TIMES the bending amount of the static 'assume flat with pre bent beam). Now if we push UP the rear end of the empty trailer, that is 2200 lbs. This will result in roughly 50% LESS bending as the 'bump' with full tanks'. Ditto, if the trailer is full (here: 7500 lbs, or 3750 on the rear portion), if we lift the rear, the bending is about equal to the amount exerienced during every 3G bump no the road (but only done once every time to jack it up, so say one per vacation, vs xxxx during driving). Just some perspective on the issue.
vtraudt 08/29/21 04:35pm Travel Trailers
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