Going from bumper pull to fifth wheel

[2001400ex]

I currently have the shockwave in my signature, which actually is 23 feet box with almost 28 feet from tongue to back. I like the brand, well built and everything but the bedroom meets my needs. I just got off an 8 day camping trip and the small bedroom is getting to us. So I have a few questions and I'm curious on your insight.

(Please no weight police in this discussion, I know the fifth wheel would be overweight for my 3/4 ton in pin weight, I'll deal with that and a new pickup as there's no way I'd go more than a few miles with 2,500 pounds in my bed)

1) I'm looking at the sandstorm/shockwave 28 fifth wheel. Also looking at the eclipse, both links are below. They are almost the same exact setup and can get roughly the same options. I'm curious if anyone has experience with eclipse to know if it's a good brand. Looking online, prices are within a few thousand dollars so that's not really a concern. The eclipse is about 900 pounds lighter, which is a factor to me.

http://www.eclipservmfg.com/Attitude#./AttitudeWideLite5thWheels

http://www.forestriverinc.com/product-details.aspx?LineID=181&Image=5075&ModelID=3583#Main

2) This one has been discussed and I don't really see a good answer on it anywhere. But I got 11.5 mpg coming home Saturday at 66 mph (net downhill, probably would have been 10.5 the other direction). Going 71 I get around 10 (10.5 on the net downhill, 9.5 on the net uphill part of the drive). My current toy hauler is 5,200 dry. Assume I have all the exact same stuff, the eclipse is 9,000 dry after options I'd add. Will the increased weight be more of a factor than the better aerodynamics of the fifth wheel? In other words, would my mileage go down significantly? I'm less worried about cost, more worried about distance between gas stations on my route through Montana and eastern Oregon. I just hear too many stories of "I get 12 mpg at 70 mph with my fifth wheel".

3) The 28 models of each is about the same length off the bumper that I am now. The 32/33 models of these are 4 feet longer. I'm debating which one to get, the wifey wants the extra 4 feet. I'm debating it, as I like the maneuverability of the smaller you hauler. My last one was over 30 feet long bumper pull 27 foot box and I hated pulling that anywhere. No matter the pickup I was in. I'm also concerned just going that much bigger overall as I frequently drive 9 hours in one sitting. The setup I have now is already great for long trips.

Please let me know your thoughts as I struggle with the decision.

[2001400ex]

WillB5 wrote:
Have you looked at the KZ Sportsmen Sportster line? We have a 2018 311TH10 and absolutely love it. I don't know how large a bedroom you are looking for, but this model packs a walk-around queen bed, large living room slide, and 10' garage in a 34' total length 5th wheel that is very towable. Might be hard to find out west though. They are rare even here in the midwest.
Will

Thanks for the recommendation. I like the 7,600 dry and 1,400 pin weight, that's awesome. One concern, I have 3 sport quads, which are 8 foot wide by 10 feet deep if I do it right. I find most of these are under 8 feet wide inside, closer to 7 feet. So generally a model with a garage is out. I can't find the interior dimension of the garage, do you have it?

I can find one in Minnesota, so that's as long drive but doable.

[WillB5]

Have you looked at the KZ Sportsmen Sportster line? We have a 2018 311TH10 and absolutely love it. I don't know how large a bedroom you are looking for, but this model packs a walk-around queen bed, large living room slide, and 10' garage in a 34' total length 5th wheel that is very towable. Might be hard to find out west though. They are rare even here in the midwest.
Will

[2001400ex]

Thanks for all the replies!!! It seems with the feedback that there's a reason the sandstorm/shockwave/stealth weighs more and it's a practical reason. I also don't read anything that makes me think the additional weight is that big of a deal being a fifth wheel compared to a smaller bumper pull. Another deciding factor is I live in Spokane and there is no local eclipse dealer, so I am not sure where I would go for warranty issues. Tho I'm sure they have to have an agreement with a local dealer.

[drmopar]

I went through the same issues when purchasing my Toy Hauler and looked closely at the Frames, Springs, all the running gear of many Toy haulers. What I found out when I looked at the Eclipse was very light duty springs and shackles. No way would that work for a large Trailer/Toy Hauler. When compared to the Forest River Sandstorm and Stealth, the Forest River Springs, Shackles and Frame were much larger and very heavy duty. Start there. Don't let the "Gingerbread" stuff make your decision. The Frame, Springs and Shackles do the work. I also found that Eclipse used a sticky type of wood color shelf paper on the interior trim, compared to actual wood in the Sandstorm and Stealth Toy Haulers. The new Eclipse that we viewed had that shelf paper already peeling, and this unit was new. After reading the reviews and forums, Eclipse did not have the quality you would be led to believe. I was very happy with my Stealth, and now that I have had it awhile, I have had zero problems. I glad I held off on the purchase until I did all my inspections and research. Good luck on your purchase and Happy camping.

[N-Trouble]

2001400ex wrote:

N-Trouble wrote:
See my sig. Those smaller 28ft 5ers are perfect for a newer 3/4 ton. I came from a 21ft WW Superlite bumper pull. The 5er while heavier is a much nicer pull. I get nearly identical mileage on the flats and only a little less pulling hills. No regrets. Do it!

You will have to contend with the added height depending on where you camp so keep that in mind.

One thing I would look at in regards to the trailers is whether they are spring over or spring under suspension. I had to do a spring over flip to get a level tow behind my truck. The added stresses from the spring over causes horizontal stress cracks in my frame between the axles. Lippert took care of it and sured it up with three cross members but it is something I would have tried to avoid if I had known.

What do you think about the overall quality of the eclipse? And do you think the stress cracks could also be from poor quality? They are quite a bit lighter than the competition.

For other responses, my wife prefers the eclipse because of the bedroom and the spice rack, a few other things. I like it cause it's lighter. They both are so similar in design.

There was a bunch of questions on the closed thread. Basically, when I bought it, I was only camping 2-3 nights at a time. So the bedroom wasn't a big deal. And in places where there is wall to wall camping sites, like lines painted on cement and your neighbor is right there. Since then, I've had 4 buddies buy campers as well and have been camping longer periods of time. My rational on the smaller trailer was 1) we only sleep in our camper (still true, just uncomfortable) 2) we camp in tight spaces, didn't want bump outs and 3) long distances in one day meaning I don't want to lug around a big beast.

I still do that type of camping, but now also camp in different areas. And those are closer to town where size isn't an issue.

Yes a modern 3/4 is probably viable. Mine, I'm 7,700 pounds with the family and gear. 9,200 GVW. This has a dry pin weight of 2,000 pounds, I've had that much rock in my bed and there's zero chance I'd enjoy that's with a 32 foot trailer included.

Overall quality is decent but I have seen some things that leave me scratching my head. They are all this way though. Just how the industry is. The frame cracks I feel were the direct result of the axle flip. I don't think the trailer and frame were designed to handle the extra stresses. I would look at the frames between the units your looking at. If the added weight is in the frame I wouldn't mind it. I feel the frame on the 28SAG is marginal at best. Likely in an attempt to save weight. Anyways Lippert took care of my frame issues and its really strong NOW. I like the overall size of the unit as I can maneuver it fairly easy and get in/out most any place I took my bumper pull. If you opt for the sofa slideout (highly recommend) the interior is fairly roomy even for the 28ft model.

[pennysmom09]

MarkTwain wrote:

sin cal hd wrote:

DutchmenSport wrote:
Regardless of all your facts and figures, and estimates, and planning, and common sense, or lack of common sense. It doesn't matter a hill of beans if you don't get the camper your wife wants! Problem solved. Get it and move on. It will tow the way it will tow. The mileage will be what it is. But if you don't get what the wife wants, you might end up traveling alone.

I'm calling BS on this. Do not get an RV just because the wife wants it. Do your homework. I made this mistake with the trailer we bought in March. I knew nothing about it. The storage, tank capacities, weight ratings on this rv. Now we are stuck with it. The trailer was not even on my radar for trailers I was interested in. Don't get me wrong it's a nice trailer. But, not what I knew we needed for our family.

Another way to look at the issue of the "wife", be sure that your wife for the most part agrees with your choice of RV:)

None of this is BS. It makes sense to decide together about the all the specs, but if you get a floor plan that doesn't work for the wife, what's the point?

[2001400ex]

N-Trouble wrote:
See my sig. Those smaller 28ft 5ers are perfect for a newer 3/4 ton. I came from a 21ft WW Superlite bumper pull. The 5er while heavier is a much nicer pull. I get nearly identical mileage on the flats and only a little less pulling hills. No regrets. Do it!

You will have to contend with the added height depending on where you camp so keep that in mind.

One thing I would look at in regards to the trailers is whether they are spring over or spring under suspension. I had to do a spring over flip to get a level tow behind my truck. The added stresses from the spring over causes horizontal stress cracks in my frame between the axles. Lippert took care of it and sured it up with three cross members but it is something I would have tried to avoid if I had known.

What do you think about the overall quality of the eclipse? And do you think the stress cracks could also be from poor quality? They are quite a bit lighter than the competition.

For other responses, my wife prefers the eclipse because of the bedroom and the spice rack, a few other things. I like it cause it's lighter. They both are so similar in design.

There was a bunch of questions on the closed thread. Basically, when I bought it, I was only camping 2-3 nights at a time. So the bedroom wasn't a big deal. And in places where there is wall to wall camping sites, like lines painted on cement and your neighbor is right there. Since then, I've had 4 buddies buy campers as well and have been camping longer periods of time. My rational on the smaller trailer was 1) we only sleep in our camper (still true, just uncomfortable) 2) we camp in tight spaces, didn't want bump outs and 3) long distances in one day meaning I don't want to lug around a big beast.

I still do that type of camping, but now also camp in different areas. And those are closer to town where size isn't an issue.

Yes a modern 3/4 is probably viable. Mine, I'm 7,700 pounds with the family and gear. 9,200 GVW. This has a dry pin weight of 2,000 pounds, I've had that much rock in my bed and there's zero chance I'd enjoy that's with a 32 foot trailer included.

[MarkTwain]

sin cal hd wrote:

DutchmenSport wrote:
Regardless of all your facts and figures, and estimates, and planning, and common sense, or lack of common sense. It doesn't matter a hill of beans if you don't get the camper your wife wants! Problem solved. Get it and move on. It will tow the way it will tow. The mileage will be what it is. But if you don't get what the wife wants, you might end up traveling alone.

I'm calling BS on this. Do not get an RV just because the wife wants it. Do your homework. I made this mistake with the trailer we bought in March. I knew nothing about it. The storage, tank capacities, weight ratings on this rv. Now we are stuck with it. The trailer was not even on my radar for trailers I was interested in. Don't get me wrong it's a nice trailer. But, not what I knew we needed for our family.

Another way to look at the issue of the "wife", be sure that your wife for the most part agrees with your choice of RV:)

[sin_cal_hd]

DutchmenSport wrote:
Regardless of all your facts and figures, and estimates, and planning, and common sense, or lack of common sense. It doesn't matter a hill of beans if you don't get the camper your wife wants! Problem solved. Get it and move on. It will tow the way it will tow. The mileage will be what it is. But if you don't get what the wife wants, you might end up traveling alone.

I'm calling BS on this. Do not get an RV just because the wife wants it. Do your homework. I made this mistake with the trailer we bought in March. I knew nothing about it. The storage, tank capacities, weight ratings on this rv. Now we are stuck with it. The trailer was not even on my radar for trailers I was interested in. Don't get me wrong it's a nice trailer. But, not what I knew we needed for our family.

[MarkTwain]

DutchmenSport wrote:
Regardless of all your facts and figures, and estimates, and planning, and common sense, or lack of common sense. It doesn't matter a hill of beans if you don't get the camper your wife wants! Problem solved. Get it and move on. It will tow the way it will tow. The mileage will be what it is. But if you don't get what the wife wants, you might end up traveling alone.

X1. Could not agree more and this will avoid the possibility of selecting an RV and regretting it down the road.

[N-Trouble]

See my sig. Those smaller 28ft 5ers are perfect for a newer 3/4 ton. I came from a 21ft WW Superlite bumper pull. The 5er while heavier is a much nicer pull. I get nearly identical mileage on the flats and only a little less pulling hills. No regrets. Do it!

You will have to contend with the added height depending on where you camp so keep that in mind.

One thing I would look at in regards to the trailers is whether they are spring over or spring under suspension. I had to do a spring over flip to get a level tow behind my truck. The added stresses from the spring over causes horizontal stress cracks in my frame between the axles. Lippert took care of it and sured it up with three cross members but it is something I would have tried to avoid if I had known.

[LadyRVer]

Remember that part of the fifth wheel will be in the bed of your truck, so what is the overall length when hooked up with the unit your wife prefers than the unit you are towing now? Just a thought to ponder.

[DutchmenSport]

Regardless of all your facts and figures, and estimates, and planning, and common sense, or lack of common sense. It doesn't matter a hill of beans if you don't get the camper your wife wants! Problem solved. Get it and move on. It will tow the way it will tow. The mileage will be what it is. But if you don't get what the wife wants, you might end up traveling alone.

[2001400ex]

My bad. Bad internet connection. Mods please delete one.