On-board propane tank refill

[vcbutton]

I have a 20 Gallon propane tank welded to the frame. I have had this tank refilled dozens of times over the last 10 years. Today, the propane truck refused to refill the tank, citing some fuzzy DOT rule. Does anyone have info about this?

[Wiz]

So here in New Hampshire, the cost to fill varies quite a bit from vendor to vendor. Tractor Supply is usually very competitive but lately, they have been telling me "This is the last time we will fill it until it is recertified" or the store closest to me says, "the manager told us we don't fill RV's, and no he/she isn't here now." Very frustrating. I will say the bottom of the tank has surface rust. I guess I need to sand and paint it.

[Dusty_R]

For when we are parked for the winter in the land of warm weather and sunshine, I built a exten-a-stay, and use 20 lb. tank. Local LP supplier will come and fill our mh tank, but it cost $1.00 more a gal. than if we go to their place and get filled. And they do put 20 lb. in.

Dusty

[vcbutton]

There appears to still be confusion between ASME (built-in) tanks and DOT (portable) cylinders. I am stationary at a campground for what I hoped to be a couple months. I wanted the local propane dealer to send a bobtail over to refill my tank. They refused, citing a DOT regulation. My arguments were futile. I am now searching for another, more knowledgeable dealer. Meanwhile, I'll continue to use my "Extendastay"

Thanks for all your helpful info. I think we can put this to bed.

[Old-Biscuit]

CharlesinGA wrote:
Keep reading, the original rule change made the interval ten years.

NPGA petitioned to have rulemaking that would return the interval to 12 years. That rulemaking is still in process (according to the link, it has to be published in the Federal Register as a NPRM, Notice of Proposed Rulemaking).

The ten year rule, from how I read it, still stands, until the rulemaking to return it to 12 year is made a final action, which is has not yet "it is not a final rule" according to the article.

In the meantime, the ten year rule is not being enforced.

I am fairly familiar with the rulemaking process, as it is very common in Aviation and, have written my share of comments for NPRM to attempt to sway the FAA to do or don't make a rule.

So yes, defacto, 12 years.

Charles

DOT Halts 10-Year Cylinder Requalification Enforcement

Pending Further Review


I also wrote RULES/REGULATIONS/PROCEDURAL CHANGES involving NFPA

Halted/not enforced is SAME as doesn't exist---didn't happen

[CharlesinGA]

Keep reading, the original rule change made the interval ten years.

NPGA petitioned to have rulemaking that would return the interval to 12 years. That rulemaking is still in process (according to the link, it has to be published in the Federal Register as a NPRM, Notice of Proposed Rulemaking).

The ten year rule, from how I read it, still stands, until the rulemaking to return it to 12 year is made a final action, which is has not yet "it is not a final rule" according to the article.

In the meantime, the ten year rule is not being enforced.

Here is the Electronic Code of Federal Regulations section that covers it.

https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=cf06245b43ef21a9cfc276d0411360d7&mc=true&node=se49.3.180_1...

Footnote (e).

I am fairly familiar with the rulemaking process, as it is very common in Aviation and, have written my share of comments for NPRM to attempt to sway the FAA to do or don't make a rule.

So yes, defacto, 12 years.

Charles

[Old-Biscuit]

CharlesinGA wrote:

Old-Biscuit wrote:
So much confusion........
(DOT 'considered' 12 yr rule change to 10 yr BUT it never was implemented and was HALTED ------DOT 10 year rule HALTED)

From what I read in the link you posted, the rule is actually in place, just that the Pipeline and Hazardous Materials Safety Administration (PHMSA) of the Department of Transportation (DOT) will not take enforcement action against the requalification of DOT-specification cylinders by volumetric testing according to a 12-year period.

It would be best to adhere to the 10 year rule, as implementation in the future could make a tank instantly unusable, depending on when it was last inspected.

Charles

From the link.....
PHMSA formally accepted NPGA's Petition for Rulemaking to return the cylinder requalification period to 12 years,

12 year rule remains intact.

Bottom line......
Propane cylinders have to be requalified 12 Yrs after date pf mfg. stamped on collar
7 yrs 'proof pressure' test (if one wants)
OR
5 yrs visual inspection can be done,,,,,,every 5 yrs

Rule change is NOT a rule change until Federal Registration was has not occurred

[CharlesinGA]

Old-Biscuit wrote:
So much confusion........
(DOT 'considered' 12 yr rule change to 10 yr BUT it never was implemented and was HALTED ------DOT 10 year rule HALTED)

From what I read in the link you posted, the rule is actually in place, just that the Pipeline and Hazardous Materials Safety Administration (PHMSA) of the Department of Transportation (DOT) will not take enforcement action against the requalification of DOT-specification cylinders by volumetric testing according to a 12-year period.

It would be best to adhere to the 10 year rule, as implementation in the future could make a tank instantly unusable, depending on when it was last inspected.

Charles

[rockhillmanor]

Motorhomes...Class A, B, C have propane TANKS (permanent mounted....owner does not remove for filling).
Propane TANKS are under ASME/NFPA jurisdiction which does NOT require ANY form of inspection/certification/requalification UNLESS tank has been damaged by fire/accident

Thanks for the research and clarification! :C

I was starting to worry about being able to fill up an older MH.

[Old-Biscuit]

So much confusion........

Motorhomes...Class A, B, C have propane TANKS (permanent mounted....owner does not remove for filling).
Propane TANKS are under ASME/NFPA jurisdiction which does NOT require ANY form of inspection/certification/requalification UNLESS tank has been damaged by fire/accident

Travel trailers/5th wheels----trailers that have 'Portable' removable propane CYLINDERS (4# to 100#) are under the DOT jurisdiction and must be recertified 12 yrs AFTER mfg. date STAMPED on collar

(DOT 'considered' 12 yr rule change to 10 yr BUT it never was implemented and was HALTED ------DOT 10 year rule HALTED)


SO.........

Propane TANKS ------NO
Propane CYLINDERS ---YES (12 yrs after mfg date then 5 or 7 yrs)

This information is FOR the OP and others residing in the USA
(Canada has its own set of rules and they vary depending on Province)


OP....go somewhere else and get your propane TANK refilled
U-haul, Tractor Supply, A BULK propane Dealer and forget about using THAT propane truck for delivery (driver is an idiot----if he doesn't know the correct rules then he probably shouldn't be handling/delivery propane cause he is an idiot)

[rockhillmanor]

CharlesinGA wrote:
Crawl under and find the data plate (might be visible without getting under). Probably a Manchester brand tank. Look for the ASME markings on the tank. This tells you it is a lifetime tank, just like that used at rural houses, and there is no life limit or inspection requirements for it. New rules do dictate that the tank serial number be readable to be filled.Charles

what should the plate show or is it just having the letters ASME denote its a lifetime tank?

[JaxDad]

Isaac-1 wrote:
Motorhome tanks are ASME lifetime certified tanks, not DOT tanks, the guy did not know what he was talking about.

see https://www.amerigas.com/amerigas-blog/2011/july/rv-propane-safety/

Not everywhere, but maybe they are where you are.

[CharlesinGA]

Crawl under and find the data plate (might be visible without getting under). Probably a Manchester brand tank. Look for the ASME markings on the tank. This tells you it is a lifetime tank, just like that used at rural houses, and there is no life limit or inspection requirements for it. New rules do dictate that the tank serial number be readable to be filled.

Charles

[vcbutton]

Yes. The tank is original. 2003 Coachmen

[vcbutton]

Yes. The tank is original. 2003 Coachmen