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Buying a Used Travel Trailer

hjcihak46
Explorer
Explorer
I'm seriously considering my first trailer purchase. For practical reasons I need to at least consider buying a used one instead of a new one. I buy used cars and high end photo equipment without a problem, but I admit my knowledge of TT is pretty limited.

Any opinions on buying a used TT from a dealer? From a private owner?

Thanks for any help.
49 REPLIES 49

SoundGuy
Explorer
Explorer
hjcihak46 wrote:
Now, have I miscalculated any of the above or overlooked anything I ought to have considered?


GrandpaKip wrote:
To give you an idea of dry weight, hereโ€™s my experience with my present camper. The factory sticker proclaimed a weight of 3820 pounds leaving the factory. On the way home, I stopped at the cat scales. The camper weighed 4150 pounds without me putting a thing in it.

That Passport has a published weight of 3711 pounds. Unless you have seen the actual sticker, that is probably under the leaving the factory weight. Then, there is the real weight when leaving wherever you buy it.

I have not read of anyone that has not had this experience.


Another example ...

My own trailer has a published dry weight of 3535 lbs ...



... but it's stickered dry weight as it left the factory was 280 lbs heavier ...



... and this is before anything was added to the trailer. Install a battery, fill the two 20 lb propane tanks, fill the water heater tank, and with a few gallons of water in the fresh water holding tank my so-called 3535 lb trailer weighed ~ 4000 lbs before I added anything else. Averaging ~ 4800 lbs loaded & ready to camp it's almost 1300 lbs heavier than it's so called advertised dry weight of 3535 lbs. :E
2012 Silverado 1500 Crew Cab
2014 Coachmen Freedom Express 192RBS
2003 Fleetwood Yuma * 2008 K-Z Spree 240BH-LX
2007 TrailCruiser C21RBH * 2000 Fleetwood Santa Fe
1998 Jayco 10UD * 1969 Coleman CT380

GrandpaKip
Explorer
Explorer
hjcihak46 wrote:
Well folks, here's what I've learned.

My 2008 Nissan Xterra has a GVWR of 5400 lbs. and a GCWR of 9658 lbs.

I weighed it this morning loaded as it would be if I were towing a travel trailer (full gas tank, all my photo gear in the back, spare tire, tools, and 1 passenger (me), and it tipped the scale at 4830 lbs. I calculate that as meaning it could handle a hitch weight of up to 570 lbs although the Xterra is only rated by Nissan for 500 lbs.

The good news is I've been looking at a 24 foot Keystone Passport Ultralight (Mod. 195RB) and, fully loaded, it would top out at 5200 lbs. However, since I will be traveling alone I can't imagine adding more than 500 lbs of cargo just for me. That would make the TT's loaded weight at around 4211 lbs.

The big question mark now is the Xterra's trailer frontal area is limited to no more than 60 sq. ft. The 195RB is either going to just make that or just miss it. So far, I haven't been able to pin down that statistic. Guess I'll have to take a tape measure to a dealer and check it for myself.

Now, have I miscalculated any of the above or overlooked anything I ought to have considered?

To give you an idea of dry weight, hereโ€™s my experience with my present camper. The factory sticker proclaimed a weight of 3820 pounds leaving the factory. On the way home, I stopped at the cat scales. The camper weighed 4150 pounds without me putting a thing in it.
That Passport has a published weight of 3711 pounds. Unless you have seen the actual sticker, that is probably under the leaving the factory weight. Then, there is the real weight when leaving wherever you buy it.
I have not read of anyone that has not had this experience.
Kip
2015 Skyline Dart 214RB
2018 Silverado Double Cab 4x4
Andersen Hitch

Gdetrailer
Explorer III
Explorer III
hjcihak46 wrote:
Well folks, here's what I've learned.

My 2008 Nissan Xterra has a GVWR of 5400 lbs. and a GCWR of 9658 lbs.

I weighed it this morning loaded as it would be if I were towing a travel trailer (full gas tank, all my photo gear in the back, spare tire, tools, and 1 passenger (me), and it tipped the scale at 4830 lbs. I calculate that as meaning it could handle a hitch weight of up to 570 lbs although the Xterra is only rated by Nissan for 500 lbs.

The good news is I've been looking at a 24 foot Keystone Passport Ultralight (Mod. 195RB) and, fully loaded, it would top out at 5200 lbs. However, since I will be traveling alone I can't imagine adding more than 500 lbs of cargo just for me. That would make the TT's loaded weight at around 4211 lbs.

The big question mark now is the Xterra's trailer frontal area is limited to no more than 60 sq. ft. The 195RB is either going to just make that or just miss it. So far, I haven't been able to pin down that statistic. Guess I'll have to take a tape measure to a dealer and check it for myself.

Now, have I miscalculated any of the above or overlooked anything I ought to have considered?


Newbee mistake.

Acutally, you WILL be shocked just how much additional weight in "stuff" you WILL "add" to the trailer.

No one ever travels and camps with an empty trailer.

I will also reiterate that if you are going from SALES BROCHURES you will also be mistaken on the empty weight.

Sales brochures only give you an APPROXIMATE empty weight, typically the BATTERY AND PROPANE are not included in the brochure empty weight and the brochure weight is often without any factory "options"..

You ALSO need to take the WD hitch weight into consideration, some folk who wish to justify a badly overweight condition like to say the WD weight is "shared" by the trailer and vehicle.. In truth, it IS DEAD WEIGHT ADDED TO THE TONGUE.

WD systems are about 80 lbs - 100 lbs of weight so you NEED to allow for that.

Additionally, at 4211 lbs, at 15% you ARE not only way over your vehicles available cargo but also the HITCH weight.

4211 lbs at 10% hitch weight plus 100 lbs for WD puts you at 521 lbs on the hitch putting you OVER the vehicles hitch rating.

RETHINK, GO LIGHTER.

Something like 2,600 lbs empty which at 15% hitch gives you 390 lbs and add on WD gives about 490 lbs tongue, which gives you a whopping 10 lbs of hitch weight or 100 lbs of "gear" you can take..

Trust me, you DO NOT WANT TO TOW AT OR BELOW 10% TONGUE WEIGHT.. The results will be white knuckle driving..

hjcihak46
Explorer
Explorer
Well folks, here's what I've learned.

My 2008 Nissan Xterra has a GVWR of 5400 lbs. and a GCWR of 9658 lbs.

I weighed it this morning loaded as it would be if I were towing a travel trailer (full gas tank, all my photo gear in the back, spare tire, tools, and 1 passenger (me), and it tipped the scale at 4830 lbs. I calculate that as meaning it could handle a hitch weight of up to 570 lbs although the Xterra is only rated by Nissan for 500 lbs.

The good news is I've been looking at a 24 foot Keystone Passport Ultralight (Mod. 195RB) and, fully loaded, it would top out at 5200 lbs. However, since I will be traveling alone I can't imagine adding more than 500 lbs of cargo just for me. That would make the TT's loaded weight at around 4211 lbs.

The big question mark now is the Xterra's trailer frontal area is limited to no more than 60 sq. ft. The 195RB is either going to just make that or just miss it. So far, I haven't been able to pin down that statistic. Guess I'll have to take a tape measure to a dealer and check it for myself.

Now, have I miscalculated any of the above or overlooked anything I ought to have considered?

hjcihak46
Explorer
Explorer
rbpru wrote:
Well five pages, the OP should realize that things are rarely as simple as the adds show.

Yes, your half-ton will haul 9500 lbs. of logs, rocks or other such items but it is not going to haul a 9500 lb. TT if you want to carry your family, camp gear and food.

In the real world, a half-ton peaks out with a 5000 lbs. dry weight TT. Half of the weight of food, towels, pots, pans, chairs, tools and other must haves, end up as tongue weight which combined with family and TV gear, peaks out the max cargo long before the 9500 lb. Tow limit.

Don't take my word for it, go to the nearest truck w stop and get the true CAT scale numbers.

I was flabbergasted by my numbers.


Huh? What are you going on about? When did I write anything about having a "half-ton (that) will haul 9500 lbs?" That sounds like a pick-up truck. I don't own a pick-up truck.

rbpru
Explorer
Explorer
Well five pages, the OP should realize that things are rarely as simple as the adds show.

Yes, your half-ton will haul 9500 lbs. of logs, rocks or other such items but it is not going to haul a 9500 lb. TT if you want to carry your family, camp gear and food.

In the real world, a half-ton peaks out with a 5000 lbs. dry weight TT. Half of the weight of food, towels, pots, pans, chairs, tools and other must haves, end up as tongue weight which combined with family and TV gear, peaks out the max cargo long before the 9500 lb. Tow limit.

Don't take my word for it, go to the nearest truck w stop and get the true CAT scale numbers.

I was flabbergasted by my numbers.
Twenty six foot 2010 Dutchmen Lite pulled with a 2011 EcoBoost F-150 4x4.

Just right for Grandpa, Grandma and the dog.

Kansas_Farm_Gir
Explorer
Explorer
When you do get the TV issued figured out and are back to looking at trailers, don't forget to really take a good look at the roof of any used trailer you are interested in. Even though the roof is in good condition and the caulking is all good, they need to be inspected regularly. You may go through one rain with no problems only to find a leak the next time it rains. Case in point, checked roof in May, survived a snow storm that month with no leak, went through a couple hard rains in July but the one in Aug showed us a leak in the bath. It was stored under cover when not on the road. Luckily we were able to caulk it without interrupting our trip.

BarneyS
Explorer III
Explorer III
Nearest Cat Scale locations for Alexandria, VA.
There are usually other brands of scales at other truck stops like TA and Loves, in addition to grain elevators, landscape supply companies, and possibly others such as the recycling center you mentioned.
Barney
2004 Sunnybrook Titan 30FKS TT
Hensley "Arrow" 1400# hitch (Sold)
Not towing now.
Former tow vehicles were 2016 Ram 2500 CTD, 2002 Ford F250, 7.3 PSD, 1997 Ram 2500 5.9 gas engine

hjcihak46
Explorer
Explorer
O.K., after reading some additional material from Nissan, I've got to find a public weight scale so I can weigh my vehicle with a full tank of gas and all the cargo I expect to be carrying in it while towing a TT. Looks like there's one at the Ft. Belvior Recycling Center. Given my own schedule and the coming snowstorm, I probably won't be able to get this done until the middle of this week.

I'll keep informed those of you who may be interested in my progress. Thanks for your suggestions and comments thus far.

FrankShore
Explorer
Explorer
Why is it that I keep seeing Ford 150's and 250's towing whole car carriers with a average of 5-7 cars on top? Yes, I said Ford 150!
2014 F-250
2014 Minnie Winnie 2351DKS (Traded In-Burnout-Use A Surge Protector!)
2015 Arctic Fox 22G (Great Trailer But Heavy - Traded In)
2018 Lance 1685 w/ Solar & 4 Seasons Package
1999 Beneteau 461 Oceanis Yacht
En Norski i en Fransk bรฅt - Dette mรฅ jeg se!

6door74
Explorer
Explorer
just used that worksheet and some round about guesses for my van and a trailer i'm looking at. I don't have the exact numbers available to me right now but this is a good tool for when I do. Thanks!
2006 E350 V10
Travel Trailer-TBD

Gdetrailer
Explorer III
Explorer III
SoundGuy. NICE SHEET!

Not many folks would go to this extreme effort to determine what they can tow.

I suspect after looking at the towing guide for the OPs vehicle that they MAY have enough cargo capacity for 5K loaded trailer PROVIDED they do not exceed 500 lb (IE 10%) hitch weight..

I do not recommend this since it really has the potential for an unstable tow putting the OP, their vehicle, their trailer AND other motorists at risk.

Granted, they did say 3,500 lbs empty, the problem I see with that is published dry weights are often LOW and don't include battery or propane and as I mentioned they can easily reach 500 lbs of tongue weight at 3,400 lbs at 15% tongue weight..

In effect putting them way over the max tongue weight for the vehicle once they start loading personal gear, water, and food into the trailer.

It IS entirely possible that the limiting factor might actually be the OEM hitch and hence the reason the towing guide specifically states a max of 500 lbs tongue weight.

We will never know, sadly since the OP does not wish to disclose any of the vehicles numbers like GVWR, Curb weight and or the cargo weight from the yellow sticker..

I wish the OP all the good luck they can get..

SoundGuy
Explorer
Explorer
To continue ...

I've been using my own customized version of this Towing Capacity Worksheet (in .xls format) for years now to accurately determine just what the various vehicles I've owned over the years can safely tow within their rated limits. This worksheet does exactly the same thing one can do manually with a calculator and the results are the same either way.





Shocking as it may seem this clearly shows that my 1/2 ton Silverado which has a real world payload capacity (as equipped) of 1400 lbs uses pretty well all of that capacity to tow a trailer weighing less than 5000 lbs. :E Shocking, I know, but yes this is sadly correct - payload capacity is and always will be the mitigating factor when determining just what any given vehicle can safely tow within it's rated limits. Back on Page 2 the OP said - "My tow vehicle is a 2008 Nissan Xterra 4WD. It has a 6cyl. 4 liter engine", in which case the situation will be even worse if for no other reason than lack of sufficient payload capacity. ๐Ÿ˜ž It's easy for keyboard pundits to claim otherwise but the numbers don't lie - if as you said earlier "First, I'm looking for something in the 22-24 foot range, & under 3500 lbs dry weight" I can absolutely guarantee you'll be sorely disappointed with the results, particularly if what you find in the used market also has a slide which will only add even more weight and worsen the situation even further.

Good luck with whatever you do choose. ๐Ÿ™‚
2012 Silverado 1500 Crew Cab
2014 Coachmen Freedom Express 192RBS
2003 Fleetwood Yuma * 2008 K-Z Spree 240BH-LX
2007 TrailCruiser C21RBH * 2000 Fleetwood Santa Fe
1998 Jayco 10UD * 1969 Coleman CT380

Gdetrailer
Explorer III
Explorer III
I looked at the on link given that has the 2008 towing guide for your vehicle.

While it states 5,000 lbs, it also states MAX OF 500 lbs hitch weight which gives me pause. That 500 lbs hitch weight can easily be reached at 3,400 lbs of trailer weight at 15% hitch weight without WD..

Additionally in extremely small print it does state that the 5,000 lbs is for a BASE MODEL of your vehicle.

What that means typically is 2WD, no options (other than the towing option) and absolute bottom, lowest trim package.

Adding 4WD, higher trim levels and any other options WILL reduce the max towing capacity.

So, depending on the exact configuration of your vehicle you might find yourself considerably lower towing capacity.

Something else which is often overlooked is trailer manufacturers tend to rate the dry weight A LOT LOWER than they actually weigh.

Often weights of battery, propane tanks (and propane) along with other optional items in the trailer ARE NOT INCLUDED in the published dry weights.. Battery and propane can add an extra 150 lbs easily to the hitch dry weight..

I will really suggest you consider a smaller than 22 ft trailer and you WILL need to be looking at the LITEWEIGHT MODELS.