New Ram 1500 and it's mild hybrid system

[Acei]

Actually, this has more to do with it's battery and how it can be used.

Does anyone know if the lithium battery built into this system can power the accessories within the vehicle?

Looks like that battery can store up to 430wh and since there's a separate lead acid battery, I would guess you can completely drain that lithium battery without any worries.

This could be very useful for those who camp a lot if the 48v lithium battery converts to 12v and directly hooks into accessory power ports.

[Groover]

ib516 wrote:
As a new RAM 1500 is likely in my future, I'm interested too, but like any new technology, if I were buying tomorrow, I'd just buy the 5.7L Hemi and let them tweak he mild hybrid system for a year or two first.

Same here. If fuel prices keep going up we may be seeing a lot more people developing an interest in hybrids. I will definitely look for it in my next truck, but it has to actually be useful.

[ib516]

As a new RAM 1500 is likely in my future, I'm interested too, but like any new technology, if I were buying tomorrow, I'd just buy the 5.7L Hemi and let them tweak he mild hybrid system for a year or two first.

[ib516]

NJRVer wrote:

Me Again wrote:

Acei wrote:
Actually, this has more to do with it's battery and how it can be used.

Does anyone know if the lithium battery built into this system can power the accessories within the vehicle?

Looks like that battery can store up to 430wh and since there's a separate lead acid battery, I would guess you can completely drain that lithium battery without any worries.

This could be very useful for those who camp a lot if the 48v lithium battery converts to 12v and directly hooks into accessory power ports.

Lithium batteries do not like to be completely discharged. Chris

Never had a problem discharging all my tool batteries.

That's because you can't. Even when the tool battery appears to be "dead" meaning it won't put out a single bit of power, it's not actually dead. It's just at the low voltage cut off. Cordless tool batteries are just filled with 3.7V 18650 lithium cells. They have protection built in where they won't discharge lower than what is safe, and the tool battery likely has a BCM (battery control module) in addition to that because lithium batteries are very dangerous if not treated right. Many videos on YouTube about replacing 18650s inside tool batteries that show the guts.

[Groover]

The last I heard most batteries don't like to be discharged in less than 5 minutes or recharged in less than 10. If that is true for the Ram system that means that your are limited to 5,000 watts (about 6hp) of assist and half that on braking. Also, from what I have heard it is only used in first and second gear when the truck is probably traction limited anyway so it adds nothing to performance. The bottom line in my opinion is that it needs five to ten times the battery capacity to be truly useful.

[Acei]

rjstractor wrote:

Acei wrote:
It does say there is a DC to DC converter from 48 to 12. Wouldn't this be connected to the vehicle's 12v system?

Even if the 48V system was available in a "key off" scenario, the 430 watt/hours of capacity-about 1/3 of a standard RV battery- is too little to be of any real use.

If rv, yes. But if you are looking to recharge laptop and cells, this should be very useful... It's worth about 10 Surface pro laptop batteries...

Also, isn't that lead acid battery only good for 50% of its total capacity?

All I'm saying is that for that cost, you get a nice sized lithium battery and a powerful alternator that can recharge the battery fast when you need it.

I don't think I would get this as an option if they don't provide a way to tap the lithium power through 12v plugs while the car is turned off...

[Perrysburg_Dodg]

NJRVer wrote:

Me Again wrote:

Acei wrote:
Actually, this has more to do with it's battery and how it can be used.

Does anyone know if the lithium battery built into this system can power the accessories within the vehicle?

Looks like that battery can store up to 430wh and since there's a separate lead acid battery, I would guess you can completely drain that lithium battery without any worries.

This could be very useful for those who camp a lot if the 48v lithium battery converts to 12v and directly hooks into accessory power ports.

Lithium batteries do not like to be completely discharged. Chris

Never had a problem discharging all my tool batteries.

X2 I run all of my Porter Cable tools (all of them use 18V 30ah lithium batteries) completely dead. Are these batteries different from what is in the Ram? My biggest question would be how much will a replacement battery cost and when or if Ford and GM will jump into the this also?

Don

[rjstractor]

Acei wrote:
It does say there is a DC to DC converter from 48 to 12. Wouldn't this be connected to the vehicle's 12v system?

Even if the 48V system was available in a "key off" scenario, the 430 watt/hours of capacity-about 1/3 of a standard RV battery- is too little to be of any real use.

[mich800]

valhalla360 wrote:
Sounds similar to the early Prius hybrids.

Great if you are primarily using the truck as a "grocery getter".

But probably not much of a benefit while towing. The problem is the boost time is likely limited to tens of seconds or at most a couple minutes. So great driving in stop & go traffic to work or if you need a little surge to pass quickly on a 2 lane road...but climbing a 5 mile grade, your available power is what the ICE generates.

A plug-in parallel hybrid with a tow-haul mode would be interesting but I suspect there isn't enough of a market for it as the vast majority of 1/2 ton pickups do no significant towing.
- Example: If you have a 20mile electric range and you are allowed to manage it, you could hold off burning thru the battery until you get to the base of a long climb and then use the battery power to assist the ICE getting up the grade. That might allow a basic V6 to compete with a V8 in terms of tow ratings.

It's not a hybrid. I don't think they are marketing it a such. The primary function is to smooth out the stop/start feature and aid going from MDS to full power. They do state it can give some extra torque to the engine if needed but in no way operates the way any hybrid vehicle does. The vehicle never operates solely under battery power.

It looks like they may use the "hybrid" terminology but I think this is just adding to confusion on what it does. I would say it has more in common with an electric supercharger than modern hybrid vehicles.

[Acei]

It does say there is a DC to DC converter from 48 to 12. Wouldn't this be connected to the vehicle's 12v system?

[Groover]

As I recall the lithium battery is 48V so the power cannot directly run anything and the motor/generator if connected directly to the front pulley so it would have to spin the gas engine to do anything. I would say that the answer to your question is that it cannot run other systems. Even its ability to capture kinetic energy and return it to the ground seems to be very limited.

[valhalla360]

Sounds similar to the early Prius hybrids.

Great if you are primarily using the truck as a "grocery getter".

But probably not much of a benefit while towing. The problem is the boost time is likely limited to tens of seconds or at most a couple minutes. So great driving in stop & go traffic to work or if you need a little surge to pass quickly on a 2 lane road...but climbing a 5 mile grade, your available power is what the ICE generates.

A plug-in parallel hybrid with a tow-haul mode would be interesting but I suspect there isn't enough of a market for it as the vast majority of 1/2 ton pickups do no significant towing.
- Example: If you have a 20mile electric range and you are allowed to manage it, you could hold off burning thru the battery until you get to the base of a long climb and then use the battery power to assist the ICE getting up the grade. That might allow a basic V6 to compete with a V8 in terms of tow ratings.

[rjstractor]

Acei wrote:
Actually, this has more to do with it's battery and how it can be used.

Does anyone know if the lithium battery built into this system can power the accessories within the vehicle?

Looks like that battery can store up to 430wh and since there's a separate lead acid battery, I would guess you can completely drain that lithium battery without any worries.

This could be very useful for those who camp a lot if the 48v lithium battery converts to 12v and directly hooks into accessory power ports.

430 wh is not much power to work with. A run-of-the-mill lead-acid RV battery is about 100 amp/hours which is roughly 1200 wh. From what I saw in this video the system's main purpose is to provide auto start/stop capability and to essentially act as an electronic "flywheel" to capture some braking energy and put it back to the drive wheels when needed. The engineer claimed a 10% increase in fuel economy.

[ScottG]

time2roll wrote:
I doubt the RAM will have a DC/DC converter to produce 12 volts like a vehicle that runs just on battery power. If the engine runs 100% of the time there will be an alternator that supplies 12 volt power.

Either way there would be a BMS to protect the lithium from over charge or over discharge.

The eng wont run all the time, it will have start/stop technology.

[time2roll]

I doubt the RAM will have a DC/DC converter to produce 12 volts like a vehicle that runs just on battery power. If the engine runs 100% of the time there will be an alternator that supplies 12 volt power.

Either way there would be a BMS to protect the lithium from over charge or over discharge.