Family of 6 future tow vehicle.

[anw7405]

I'm just looking for some opinions here.

Current situation is:
2005 GMC yukon XL 2500 8.1 big block with 180,xxx miles.
2017 coachman Freedom express 320bhds probably around 9.5k -10k loaded up ready to camp.

We live in Oklahoma and really want to start venturing out west in another 2 years or so. That equals Rocky Mountains and others as well. The 8.1 handles the 37' TT pretty good around here and small mountains but I'm not sure its up to multiple long trips in the high elevation mountains. What to do?

option #1 Keep the 8.1 and slap a Raylar intake modification and A tune. big Hp and Tq gains for about $1700 or so. Probably close to 500 WTQ.
pros: 3 row seats and comfort, low price
cons: not forced indution

option#2 Get a 2011-2012 cummins or duramax truck.(before DEF)
pros: plenty of power
cons: cost of purchase, cost of ownership, and cramped with 6 people.

option#3 A diesel excursion.
pros: 3 rows of seats, and forced induction, should be able to get OK power out of the 6.0 or the 7.3.
cons: cost of purchase, cost of ownership, an older truck

Thoughts? What would you do?

[Wishin]

anw7405 wrote:

Wishin wrote:
I would just stick with what you have. At a minimum I'd go back to stock size tires. My 8.1L Suburban has 4.10 gears and we've been a lot of places and rarely can't go the speed limit. Eisenhower Pass, we got stuck behind someone and slowed down. Once it got below 4000 RPM in 2nd gear, there was not speeding back up. Vail Pass we kept it over 4200 RPM in 2nd and it maintained speed to the top (65 mph?). It was a pretty loud trip to the top however. Might be more enjoyable to just slow down. The previous owner put a CAI on it, I replaced the oiled K&N cone filter with a dry Amsoil cone to make sure I was getting good filtering. I'm sure it makes it noisier, not sure if it has more power.

Good luck. Give what you have a try if you ask me. If I used mine for only towing, I'd seriously consider gearing it down even more. 4.56 gears? Not sure what is available. It would be nice if 4th gear was more usable and 3rd gear got me over almost any hill. Right now 3rd will go most anywhere but occasionally 2nd is needed. No wind and flat, 4th works good. I did upgrade from the stock 245/75R16 tires (30.5") to 265/65R18 rims/tires this year (31.5"). I still had the stock size tires when we were out west last time.

How heavy is your trailer?

7500-8000 lbs is my guess. I have weighed the tongue and it is 1200-1300. It is as loaded as a trailer can be for its size, every compartment is full and we always carry water. I should weigh it sometime. I've upgraded the axles and tires so I'm safe to well beyond the 7800 lb GVWR.

[jerem0621]

parker.rowe wrote:
It's a gasser, so from what I hear 3500lbs is about the limit anyway.

80% rule is in effect... so it’s really 2,800 lbs. ha ha ha

[parker_rowe]

carringb wrote:

parker.rowe wrote:
Gm does still make an HD Suburban, but it only comes with a 6.0 V8 and us normal civilians can't buy it.

Not that I would want to, I think they start at 90K or so! For them dollars it better have a diesel. And 20K cash in the glovebox.

Edit: I lied...starts at $80,000
https://www.gmfleet.com/chevrolet/suburban-hd-heavy-duty-suv.html

But the 3,500# towing capacity is gonna limit your trailer options!

With 4400lbs of payload I take that tow rating with a grain of salt.

It's a gasser, so from what I hear 3500lbs is about the limit anyway.

[carringb]

parker.rowe wrote:
Gm does still make an HD Suburban, but it only comes with a 6.0 V8 and us normal civilians can't buy it.

Not that I would want to, I think they start at 90K or so! For them dollars it better have a diesel. And 20K cash in the glovebox.

Edit: I lied...starts at $80,000
https://www.gmfleet.com/chevrolet/suburban-hd-heavy-duty-suv.html

But the 3,500# towing capacity is gonna limit your trailer options!

[parker_rowe]

Gm does still make an HD Suburban, but it only comes with a 6.0 V8 and us normal civilians can't buy it.

Not that I would want to, I think they start at 90K or so! For them dollars it better have a diesel. And 20K cash in the glovebox.

Edit: I lied...starts at $80,000
https://www.gmfleet.com/chevrolet/suburban-hd-heavy-duty-suv.html

[theoldwizard1]

carringb wrote:

theoldwizard1 wrote:

And what everyone is saying is that there is no vehicle that will haul 2 adults and 4 growing (teenage) children and tow your trailer.

Sure there is ...

E-series van production ended in 2014.

Lantley wrote:
There are no longer any newer vehicles available with the passenger space and performance of a 8.1 Burb or a V-10 or PSD X.

More importantly, built on a 3/4 tom chassis !

The V-10 is still around and will likely soon be replaced by a more powerfull V8. It was just leaked that GM is working on a big brother to the current 6.0L that will likely be 400hp/450lb-ft.

The Allison transmission can handle the torque as can the the Ford 6R140.

[Lantley]

carringb wrote:

theoldwizard1 wrote:

And what everyone is saying is that there is no vehicle that will haul 2 adults and 4 growing (teenage) children and tow your trailer.

Sure there is!:
https://portland.craigslist.org/clc/cto/d/2010-ford-e350-4x4-extended/6718454223.html

https://bend.craigslist.org/cto/d/e350-sportsmobile/6727445992.html (this one would need a 2nd row captains chair added, to meet seating needs, but is easy enough to DIY with parts from ExpoVans.com)

https://denver.craigslist.org/cto/d/1998-ford-e350-4x4-73-camper/6720600987.html

There maybe other vehicles, but none significantly better than the 8.1
that the OP already owns.
Many Suburban and Excursion owners saw this day coming. There are no longer any newer vehicles available with the passenger space and performance of a 8.1 Burb or a V-10 or PSD X.
The vehicles mentioned above are just as old,expensive and no better than what the OP already owns.

[carringb]

theoldwizard1 wrote:

And what everyone is saying is that there is no vehicle that will haul 2 adults and 4 growing (teenage) children and tow your trailer.

Sure there is!:
https://portland.craigslist.org/clc/cto/d/2010-ford-e350-4x4-extended/6718454223.html

https://bend.craigslist.org/cto/d/e350-sportsmobile/6727445992.html (this one would need a 2nd row captains chair added, to meet seating needs, but is easy enough to DIY with parts from ExpoVans.com)

https://denver.craigslist.org/cto/d/1998-ford-e350-4x4-73-camper/6720600987.html

[theoldwizard1]

anw7405 wrote:
Right. There is no half ton on the market that can handle the payload I need.

And what everyone is saying is that there is no vehicle that will haul 2 adults and 4 growing (teenage) children and tow your trailer.

Not legal, but you could get a 3/4 pickup, with a truck cap and bolt a bench seat in the back and make the older kids ride back there !

[LIKE2BUILD]

anw7405 wrote:

LIKE2BUILD wrote:

....The CARRYALL platform did not get the Allison 1000 transmission. I think the 8.1L got a 4L85E transmission....
Oh, one more thing. Are you still using the OEM receiver? If so, ditch that flimsy thing and get a good Class V Receiver.

I learn something new everyday. I thought I had a 4L80e tranny. I did replace the OEM receiver with a beefy Curt XD.

Yep, a nice surprise for you.

Good man Charlie Brown replacing the receiver. I had an '04 Chevy 2500HD and always felt my WD hitch didn't seem set up right with a lot of porpoising as I went over bridges and bumps. After I switched to a Curt Magnum V receiver everything changed. The connection between truck and trailer felt rock solid, like a complete single unit.

[intheburbs]

I'm a little late to the party, but I'd say stick with what you have. You've got the king of the hill of SUV tow vehicles.

Regarding option 2 - I have a family of 5, and we never even remotely considered a pickup. That third row is invaluable. I couldn't imagine 6 on a long road trip, even in a mega cab Ram.

Regarding option 3 - The problem with a diesel Excursion is the weight of the engine, and the impact on payload. Especially the 7.3. With a family of 6, I'm thinking you need as much payload as possible, and the 2500 Suburban is the better choice.

I've towed my behemoth (8600 lbs) out West several times, including Powder River Pass (9666') and the Eisenhower Tunnel. And I only have the 6.0. The 8.1, especially with some light mods, should do everything you need it to do, even in the Rockies. Stick with it, and don't have any doubts.

Our rig, stopped at Powder River Pass, on our way to Yellowstone:

[anw7405]

Wishin wrote:
I would just stick with what you have. At a minimum I'd go back to stock size tires. My 8.1L Suburban has 4.10 gears and we've been a lot of places and rarely can't go the speed limit. Eisenhower Pass, we got stuck behind someone and slowed down. Once it got below 4000 RPM in 2nd gear, there was not speeding back up. Vail Pass we kept it over 4200 RPM in 2nd and it maintained speed to the top (65 mph?). It was a pretty loud trip to the top however. Might be more enjoyable to just slow down. The previous owner put a CAI on it, I replaced the oiled K&N cone filter with a dry Amsoil cone to make sure I was getting good filtering. I'm sure it makes it noisier, not sure if it has more power.

Good luck. Give what you have a try if you ask me. If I used mine for only towing, I'd seriously consider gearing it down even more. 4.56 gears? Not sure what is available. It would be nice if 4th gear was more usable and 3rd gear got me over almost any hill. Right now 3rd will go most anywhere but occasionally 2nd is needed. No wind and flat, 4th works good. I did upgrade from the stock 245/75R16 tires (30.5") to 265/65R18 rims/tires this year (31.5"). I still had the stock size tires when we were out west last time.

How heavy is your trailer?

[Wishin]

I would just stick with what you have. At a minimum I'd go back to stock size tires. My 8.1L Suburban has 4.10 gears and we've been a lot of places and rarely can't go the speed limit. Eisenhower Pass, we got stuck behind someone and slowed down. Once it got below 4000 RPM in 2nd gear, there was not speeding back up. Vail Pass we kept it over 4200 RPM in 2nd and it maintained speed to the top (65 mph?). It was a pretty loud trip to the top however. Might be more enjoyable to just slow down. The previous owner put a CAI on it, I replaced the oiled K&N cone filter with a dry Amsoil cone to make sure I was getting good filtering. I'm sure it makes it noisier, not sure if it has more power.

Good luck. Give what you have a try if you ask me. If I used mine for only towing, I'd seriously consider gearing it down even more. 4.56 gears? Not sure what is available. It would be nice if 4th gear was more usable and 3rd gear got me over almost any hill. Right now 3rd will go most anywhere but occasionally 2nd is needed. No wind and flat, 4th works good. I did upgrade from the stock 245/75R16 tires (30.5") to 265/65R18 rims/tires this year (31.5"). I still had the stock size tires when we were out west last time.

[anw7405]

mkirsch wrote:

vjstangelo wrote:
We took our V10 Excursion loaded up from VA to WY 3x with no problems. The 8.1 should be fine, probably better than the Rx since it has the Allison transmission. The issue is would you trust a vehicle with 180k miles headed into the deserted west? I see Ford is coming out with a new 7.3 gas motor and if they install that into the Expedition, it may be a winning combo for you. I think any Ex out there will have similar miles as your burb.

I'm hearing more and more that this 7.3 is an ugly rumor, no substance to it.

Also the Expedition doesn't have the payload capacity for this application, even if you completely ignore the payload ratings. Needs an 8-lug vehicle for four growing children and a ~9000lb trailer. An Expy could tow the trailer OR haul the kids, but not both.

Right. There is no half ton on the market that can handle the payload I need.