Do Performance Air Filters Actually Work?

[ShinerBock]

I know this has been beat to death here with most people stating that they don't add any horsepower without any dyno data to back it up.

Well Jason Fenske from Engineering Explained decided decided to see for himself instead just regurgitating what he heard from the internet, what a friend's brother's cousin told him, or what a salesman tried to sell him on.

Do Performance Air Filters Actually Work?

If anyone have dyno test refuting this then I would love to see it.

[Me_Again]

Groover wrote:
Wrong thread

Best answer yet!

[Groover]

Wrong thread

[ShinerBock]

Cummins12V98 wrote:

ShinerBock wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:
I don't think you will be running a 12V too long over 1300 sustained!

UH, I thought we were strictly discussing Performance Air Filters???

We were. Unlike those who brought up warranty, TnP was using EGT's as an example of another area where many of the "automotive engineers" here don't really know what will damage an engine yet like to spout out figures or tell you what is bad just like they do with air filtration.

My point is ALL threads morph from original post. No need to even comment on it!

I was just answering your question. No need to even comment on it!

[Cummins12V98]

ShinerBock wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:
I don't think you will be running a 12V too long over 1300 sustained!

UH, I thought we were strictly discussing Performance Air Filters???

We were. Unlike those who brought up warranty, TnP was using EGT's as an example of another area where many of the "automotive engineers" here don't really know what will damage an engine yet like to spout out figures or tell you what is bad just like they do with air filtration.

My point is ALL threads morph from original post. No need to even comment on it!

[ShinerBock]

Cummins12V98 wrote:
I don't think you will be running a 12V too long over 1300 sustained!

UH, I thought we were strictly discussing Performance Air Filters???

We were. Unlike those who brought up warranty, TnP was using EGT's as an example of another area where many of the "automotive engineers" here don't really know what will damage an engine yet like to spout out figures or tell you what is bad just like they do with air filtration.

[ShinerBock]

Ron3rd wrote:
The latest generation of Ram CTD's already come with a "cold intake" from the factory. It would be pretty hard to improve in its design.

Not exactly. The front flap is not always open and it only opens depending on the barometric pressure and temp. If you had an EDGE CTS2 or any other monitoring device then you will see that it is not open most of the time.

My intake also had a filter with almost twice the filter area as the stock unit which lowered CAC temps (especially under sustained load) and it also removed the silencer baffle in the intake piping between the stock filter housing and turbo.

[Cummins12V98]

I don't think you will be running a 12V too long over 1300 sustained!

UH, I thought we were strictly discussing Performance Air Filters???

[Ron3rd]

The latest generation of Ram CTD's already come with a "cold intake" from the factory. It would be pretty hard to improve in its design.

[ShinerBock]

Turtle n Peeps wrote:
Good points. Good points indeed.

Much like I have seen lots of people on here talk about very high EGT's. And when I ask what is high they state 1,300 F. I ask if they have ever run over 1,300? They state anything over 1,300 and you will melt a piston. I ask how do you know that if you have never ran over 1,300 degrees? Much like your point about filtration.

Exactly!

On that note, if it were 1,300F then my piston's would have been melted by now. That is actually the temp I set my CTS2 to warn me start to back off. I don't mind it getting to 1,300F, but I don't want it to stay there very long. Every engine is different though and what is high for one may be low for another. You also have to consider where the pyro sensor is located which will have different temps, post turbo or pre turbo. Pre turbo will be hotter than post turbo, and many stock sensors are located post turbo.

I had to add the pre turbo thremopcouple in my truck since the stock one was post turbo.

[Turtle_n_Peeps]

Good points. Good points indeed.

Much like I have seen lots of people on here talk about very high EGT's. And when I ask what is high they state 1,300 F. I ask if they have ever run over 1,300? They state anything over 1,300 and you will melt a piston. I ask how do you know that if you have never ran over 1,300 degrees? Much like your point about filtration.

[ShinerBock]

Turtle n Peeps wrote:

ShinerBock wrote:
Although if anyone does have data showing how much engine life is decreased by using one of these filters then I would love to see it.

I think that is a rhetorical question.

In other words:
#1. How much dirt gets by?

#2. What kind of dirt? Sand? Volcanic ash? Is it soft or hard?

I think you get the point.

I know you don't want to talk about filtration but here is a pretty good study about air filters and what they do....or don't do.

Enjoy.

Yes it was a rhetorical question.

Why? Because when I worked at Cummins we did this filtration testing in the test cells. Most here would probably be shocked of how much dirt would have to be ingested before causing any notable damage. If the acceptable limit of dirt for an engine is 4 grams without doing any harm, then what does it matter if the stock unit filters 1.5 grams and the aftermarket filters 2 grams?

Understandably, people fear what they do not know and many here cannot tell you that an aftermarket filter with X efficiency will damage an engine Y times faster than the stock filter with Z efficiency. Heck, most(if not all) don't even know what efficiency is acceptable for their engine, but they sure as hell will tell you what is not. If one does not know what is acceptable, then how can they know what is not?

Again, I understand people fearing what they don't know and most err on the side of caution, but how can one speak out as an expert on what is bad filtration when they don't even know what is acceptable filtration. This is why I didn't want to discuss filtration because all you get are a bunch of internet automotive engineers who really cannot tell you what will harm every engine out there(since they have different tolerances) with any supporting data and all they are doing is regurgitating what they heard from someone else. Hence the reason I wanted to keep the convo on power increases, not efficiency.

[Turtle_n_Peeps]

ShinerBock wrote:
Although if anyone does have data showing how much engine life is decreased by using one of these filters then I would love to see it.

I think that is a rhetorical question.

In other words:
#1. How much dirt gets by?

#2. What kind of dirt? Sand? Volcanic ash? Is it soft or hard?

I think you get the point.

I know you don't want to talk about filtration but here is a pretty good study about air filters and what they do....or don't do.

Enjoy.

[Ron3rd]

p220sigman wrote:
I don't know if they are better or not, but I wouldn't take the chance for what little gain, if any there is. Honestly, with the power today's trucks make in bone stock form, I'm fairly certain I wouldn't be able to tell if one was making 5 more HP.

X2. Couldn't have said it better myself.

[FishOnOne]

ShinerBock wrote:

Does anyone have any data showing how much engine life is lost due to the amount of dust gets by aftermarket filters so I can get an idea? Is it 1k miles, 10k miles, or even 100k miles lost using an aftermarket filter versus stock?

I'm sure our EGR engines get more soot particulates routed into the intake than a after market air filter allows particulates to pass into the intake.

As for your question I'm sure there's no real scientific report on the reduced engine life span based on particulates an AM filter passes into the intake vs a baseline OEM filter. Maybe flashman will know better.