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When is a 3/4 ton needed?

H2oSprt
Explorer
Explorer
Current trailer:

From manufacturer (haven’t weighed)
Hitch Weight 528 lbs
Dry Weight 4233 lbs
Cargo Weight 3295 lbs


I currently use a 2015 expedition el, (family of 5) with heavy duty tow and sumo springs, it does ok. Mirrors suck and the rear sags a few inches even with an equalizer hitch. I don’t get sway and it seems ok, however we are taking our first long multi state trip and I’ve got a bit of anxiety about being at the limits. Am I over thinking this?
15 expedition El ecoboost

2008 Jayco 12hw
41 REPLIES 41

Grit_dog
Nomad III
Nomad III
blt2ski wrote:
Towing ANYTHING, having proper chassis to handle trailer behind it weight wise. ALSO one needs the proper drivetrain for how you use the rig too! Are you literally under 50-55mph local roads? Steeper grades, IE greater than say 15%! Are you on an interstate wanting to hold 60mph on a 2-3% freeway grade?
Their is not a single truck made in an LDT form currently, that you can order to suit your needs. It's down to a one size fits all. That size, no matter the chassis, may not fit your usage!
I have no problem admitting, current tow rating gcwr specs suck in how I use my trucks pulling hauling etc. Geared way check too tall!

Marty


You just aren’t willing to spend the money to get the right truck. No one makes a 200hp straight 6, high gvw, double low range 4.88 geared C2500.
BUT I betcha an Aisin trans 4.10 geared pickup will not stall out in the mighty mountains of Kirkland!
2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29 - Sold.
Couple of Arctic Fox TCs - Sold

azwildcat99
Explorer
Explorer
Too funny. The OP has a high wall pop-up and it divulged into all this.

OP - I think you mistated your weights. Here is a link to the brochure for your stated trailer.

https://www.jayco.com/tools/archive/2008-select-ct/

As to your original question, it depends on the setup. I had a 07 CCSB Sierra with the 5.3 and a 9000gvwr (6500 dry) 27ft trailer. That combo sucked even with a properly adjusted WDH. Switching to a 07 2500 Duramax was awesome and not so much for the power but the stability was night and day. Power was great too. I now have a HW popup like yours (2010 Niagara) that we tow with our 07 Exp and it's great. A little sag, but no issues.
2007 GMC Sierra 2500HD CCSB 4X4 D/A
2012 Heartland Prowler 27P BHS
Honda EU2000i

blt2ski
Moderator
Moderator
Towing ANYTHING, having proper chassis to handle trailer behind it weight wise. ALSO one needs the proper drivetrain for how you use the rig too! Are you literally under 50-55mph local roads? Steeper grades, IE greater than say 15%! Are you on an interstate wanting to hold 60mph on a 2-3% freeway grade?
Their is not a single truck made in an LDT form currently, that you can order to suit your needs. It's down to a one size fits all. That size, no matter the chassis, may not fit your usage!
I have no problem admitting, current tow rating gcwr specs suck in how I use my trucks pulling hauling etc. Geared way check too tall!

Marty
92 Navistar dump truck, 7.3L 7 sp, 4.33 gears with a Detroit no spin
2014 Chevy 1500 Dual cab 4x4
92 Red-e-haul 12K equipment trailer

burningman
Explorer
Explorer
If the truck is empty and you can spare 6000 extra on the drivers that’d work.

About towing RV trailers, going down the road there’s a general rule of thumb, you’re always happier with more truck than you need than you are with less truck than you need.
You can tow a pretty huge trailer with a half-ton (which includes Suburbans, Expeditions, etc.) but you’re just better off with something stouter.
2017 Northern Lite 10-2 EX CD SE
99 Ram 4x4 Dually Cummins
A whole lot more fuel, a whole lot more boost.
4.10 gears, Gear Vendors overdrive, exhaust brake
Built auto, triple disc, billet shafts.
Kelderman Air Ride, Helwig sway bar.

blt2ski
Moderator
Moderator
Burning man,
I normally did not deal with trailers over 15k, 26k total. With that said. Iirc, three tandem axles, on probably a tilt flatbed, one can put 44k or 45k and still be legal. Put excavator far enough forward such that the trailer has 6000+ lbs of hitch weight. One should meet the federal and state bridge laws. Also assuming, the TV has enough payload to handle the HW and still meet bridge laws also!

Marty
92 Navistar dump truck, 7.3L 7 sp, 4.33 gears with a Detroit no spin
2014 Chevy 1500 Dual cab 4x4
92 Red-e-haul 12K equipment trailer

VernDiesel
Explorer
Explorer
When is an HD needed? With respects to a TT if you are going to regularly tow / camp with something with a camp ready weight of more than 8k you would be better served by a HD. Unless you are too lazy to get a WDH and set up your axle & tongue weights by scale results then you might decide to lower that to 7k.
Transportr TT & boats RAM EconoDiesel Factory TBC, Tow mirrors, Hitch camera, Axle to frame air bags, Tune w turbo brake, Max tow 9,200 CGAR 7,800 CVWR 15,950 axle weights 3,340 steer 2,260 drive Truck pushed head gasket at 371k has original trans at 500k

ksss
Explorer
Explorer
You might want to educate yourself on Idaho Bridge law. Believe me been through enough ports to know.

You cant pull that with the truck full or you would be overweight.
2020 Chevy 3500 CC 4X4 DRW D/A
2013 Fuzion 342
2011 RZR Desert Tan
2012 Sea Doo GTX 155
2018 Chevy 3500HD CC LB SRW 4X4 D/A
2015 Chevy Camaro ZL1

burningman
Explorer
Explorer
ksss wrote:
I pull a 20 ton excavator with a pintal hitch, three axle trailer that dry weighs about 10K with a 4 axle Mack dump truck, that Mack dry weighs about 24K. So this roughly follows Marty's rule of thumb, but the idea that the power unit cant weigh less than what is being towed is ridiculous.


Your trailer is overweight if you do that, that’s 50,000 pounds on three trailer axles, unless you have a heck of an axle spread.

I’m a heavy-truck guy too, mostly cranes, also dumps and flatbeds.
I’m not saying you can’t pull a trailer that’s heavier than the truck, just that it gets sketchy on a bumper hitch. You can’t say the lighter truck/heavier trailer combo drives better that the heavier truck/lighter trailer.
You never drive a dump truck with the truck box empty and the trailer full.
2017 Northern Lite 10-2 EX CD SE
99 Ram 4x4 Dually Cummins
A whole lot more fuel, a whole lot more boost.
4.10 gears, Gear Vendors overdrive, exhaust brake
Built auto, triple disc, billet shafts.
Kelderman Air Ride, Helwig sway bar.

FishOnOne
Explorer III
Explorer III
Me Again wrote:
2manytoyz wrote:
Just know the old nomenclature of 1/2 ton or 3/4 ton doesn't mean much anymore.



And how does the rear axle bearing setup on a 150/1500 compare to the 250/350/2500/3500?

What holds the axle into your differential on you F150? What surface do the bearings(AKA weight) ride on?


The F150 uses roller bearings compared to some others that use ball bearings in the rear differential.
'12 Ford Super Duty FX4 ELD CC 6.7 PSD 400HP 800ft/lbs "270k Miles"
'16 Sprinter 319MKS "Wide Body"

Grit_dog
Nomad III
Nomad III
^ Yes but this is rvnut.com, where a lot of the "experts" became experts by weekend warrior-ing campers 5x a year. Or they used to be experts but now forget what they used to do and due to reasons not directly related to towing have now become very conservative, or "weight cops" as a term someone coined here many moons ago.
2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29 - Sold.
Couple of Arctic Fox TCs - Sold

ksss
Explorer
Explorer
I pull a 20 ton excavator with a pintal hitch, three axle trailer that dry weighs about 10K with a 4 axle Mack dump truck, that Mack dry weighs about 24K. So this roughly follows Marty's rule of thumb, but the idea that the power unit cant weigh less than what is being towed is ridiculous.
2020 Chevy 3500 CC 4X4 DRW D/A
2013 Fuzion 342
2011 RZR Desert Tan
2012 Sea Doo GTX 155
2018 Chevy 3500HD CC LB SRW 4X4 D/A
2015 Chevy Camaro ZL1

Sport45
Explorer
Explorer
burningman wrote:
It’s about handling. Sure a one ton diesel has strong components.
But with a trailer that weighs as much or more on a bumper hitch several feet behind the rear axle, you should avoid feeling invincible on a wet street in a curve if something unscheduled happens.
There’s a reason guys buy 5th wheels and goosenecks.


I hope nobody feels invincible on a wet street or curve if something unexpected happens. Whether they’re dragging a trailer or not...
’19 F350 SRW CCLB PSD Fx4
'00 F250, CC SWB 4x2, V-10 3.73LS. (sold)
'83 F100 SWB 4x2, 302 AOD 3.55. (parked)
'05 GMC Envoy 4x2 4.2 3.73L.
'12 Edge 2.0 Ecoboost
'15 Cherokee Trailhawk

burningman
Explorer
Explorer
It’s about handling. Sure a one ton diesel has strong components.
But with a trailer that weighs as much or more on a bumper hitch several feet behind the rear axle, you should avoid feeling invincible on a wet street in a curve if something unscheduled happens.
There’s a reason guys buy 5th wheels and goosenecks.
2017 Northern Lite 10-2 EX CD SE
99 Ram 4x4 Dually Cummins
A whole lot more fuel, a whole lot more boost.
4.10 gears, Gear Vendors overdrive, exhaust brake
Built auto, triple disc, billet shafts.
Kelderman Air Ride, Helwig sway bar.

blt2ski
Moderator
Moderator
Back in the day before current manufactures max warranty/weight ratings. max trailer behind a given rig was suggested to be 2 x GRAW capacity. So if you have a 6000 lb RA, max trailer was 12K lbs. This has worked pretty well from my standpoint. Altho, I will admit to going above this upon occasion. But it is a good rule of thumb to follow.
With todays newer trucks, heavier chassis components for a given weight classification vs yesteryear, not sure that is this rule of thumb is fully warranted.

Marty
92 Navistar dump truck, 7.3L 7 sp, 4.33 gears with a Detroit no spin
2014 Chevy 1500 Dual cab 4x4
92 Red-e-haul 12K equipment trailer