Good Sam Club Open Roads Forum: 2006 Grayhawk Ford e450 v-10: Power increase
Open Roads Forum Already a member? Login here.   If not, Register Today!  |  Help

Newest  |  Active  |  Popular  |  RVing FAQ Forum Rules  |  Forum Posting Help and Support  |  Contact  

Search:   Advanced Search

Search only in Tech Issues

Open Roads Forum  >  Tech Issues

 > 2006 Grayhawk Ford e450 v-10: Power increase

Reply to Topic  |  Subscribe  |  Print Topic  |  Post New Topic  | 
Page of 3  
Prev  |  Next
blownstang01

Upstate NY

Senior Member

Joined: 06/06/2016

View Profile



Good Sam RV Club Member

Offline
Posted: 08/14/19 08:43am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

MEXICOWANDERER wrote:

I have an 11-ton diesel that pulls Donner Summit in 12th gear and 75 mph. That said don't ask about price, near-insane amount of time and effort. My experience with exhaust headers is

They char everything around them
They leak
Run the rig through a splat of cold water and snap-po a crack
Triple jointed tools needed to change spark plugs
Oh joy! A $130 set of Jacobs super-insulated spark plug wires is in your future
Mouse milk improvement in power.


jcobs


I hear what you're saying, and you're old school. But, headers on a Ford V-10 are no where near the plugs and wires. The Banks headers and exhaust really wake the V-10 up (We installed a ton of them), but Bank's sure is proud of his products. Hard to swallow $2,500-$3,000 on headers and exhaust, plus installation, IMO.

ccchuck

The Shoals, AL

Senior Member

Joined: 06/07/2003

View Profile





Offline
Posted: 08/14/19 10:54am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

re: 5 Star Tune..
would like to hear from anyone who has installed it on a class c.

* This post was edited 08/14/19 11:00am by ccchuck *


RVing since '74..


blownstang01

Upstate NY

Senior Member

Joined: 06/06/2016

View Profile



Good Sam RV Club Member

Offline
Posted: 08/14/19 12:41pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

ccchuck wrote:

re: 5 Star Tune..
would like to hear from anyone who has installed it on a class c.


I have it on mine. Really helped the transmission, firmer more positive shifts, and less gear hunting. It definitely has more power too, how much ? Negligible maybe, you won't necessarily feel it in the seat of your pants but once you get to a familiar hill or highway, you'll realize that yes it has more power. Mileage was improved maybe slightly, .5 mpg or so, but absolutely scoots up the hills better. A good tune will absolutely not decrease engine life, Mike @ 5-Star knows these coaches and has the tune dialed in. Personally , I doubt you'll regret it.

Edit: Also, if you ever decide to upgrade the exhaust, air intake, etc, Mike can email you an updated tune to reflect the changes.

Gjac

Milford, CT

Senior Member

Joined: 08/16/2006

View Profile



Good Sam RV Club Member

Offline
Posted: 08/14/19 01:09pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I have a 1995 454 TBI eng in a 15,000 lb Class A and have done the following to improve performance. I measured performance by 40-60 mph times. When I first bought the MH it took 22 secs to go from 40 -60 mph. A tune up, plugs wires distributor cap brought it down to 19 secs. Headers, FF mufflers and CAI reduced it to 14 secs. Headers would add about 80 HP to the older 454's and 460's the newer V-10's will probably be less. Check on the Banks web site for your year eng and type for HP increase. Advanced timing from 4 degrees BTDC(stock) to 9 degrees BTDC further reduced time to 12 secs. Also transmission no longer downshifts at the slightest hill and engine temps were reduced only rarely the fan clutch come on any more except on very steep hills out west. My stock engine only produced 230 HP, the mods brought it up to a little over 300 hp. Nothing increased the MPG except installing a Vacuum gauge and watching it. 8.5 mpgs went to 8.7 mpgs if I use it when traveling. If you don't know what your baseline performance is before any mods you won't know what the increase will be and it is hard to tell just by noise or "seat of the pants dyno". So before spending a lot of money be careful when asking your friends about their mods if the just tell you it sounds or feels like better performance.

pnichols

The Other California

Senior Member

Joined: 04/26/2005

View Profile



Good Sam RV Club Member


Posted: 08/14/19 01:52pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

ccchuck wrote:

DrewE wrote:

pauldub wrote:

Push harder on the gas pedal and let the engine scream, really.


x2 on this. The Ford V10 needs to rev to produce power, more so than many truck engines, and with ten cylinders it sounds like it's about to self-destruct...but it isn't, and it can operate like that as long as is needed.

That said, you of course are not going to get car-like acceleration out of a class C motorhome...even little economy car-like acceleration.


wow... ok - any other advice?


Hmmm ... what really would you like to improve?

i.e. - Do you need/want more horsepower than your V10 puts out at it's maximum of 305 HP ... or is it's 305 HP maximum probably OK ... but you just don't like the way you have to use the engine to tap it's horsepower?

Note that many of the diesel engines that power and/or pull RVs have horsepower maximums considerably less than 305 HP. It's just that these diesel engines have high crankshaft torque at whatever HP they are putting out ... and that they put out this torque and HP at lower crankshaft RPM values due to the inherent characteristics of diesel engine technology.

The only torque that counts is the torque on the drive wheels' axles, and how you develop this torque is by converting any raw horsepower that the engine is putting out at any given engine RPM into drive axle torque through use of gearing between the engine's crankshaft and the drive axles.

What the above means is -> you must tap whatever of your V10's horsepower is needed to push along your particular RV at any particular speed on any particular road grade. How you call into play your V10's horsepower is to rev it up to whatever RPM is needed to produce whatever horsepower is needed so as to convert this horsepower (using the proper gears) into the needed torque on the drive wheels.

For the V10, more RPM is needed than what we are used to from good old truck V8 gas engines and diesel engines. We have to just get used to the sound ... along with any anxiety that our V10 may break while making it's horsepower!


Phil, 2005 E450 Itasca Spirit 24V

rentman99

Memphis, TN

New Member

Joined: 08/20/2019

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 08/20/19 08:53pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I also purchased the 5 Star Super Tune, and I LOVE it! Noticeable increase in power and shifts LIKE IT'S SUPPOSED TO! I'm usually pulling a ski boat and the downshifting was ridiculous. Even when not towing, the slightest upgrade would cause the downshifting.

The Super Tune is money well spent. You'll definitely see results.

pnichols

The Other California

Senior Member

Joined: 04/26/2005

View Profile



Good Sam RV Club Member


Posted: 08/20/19 11:56pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

rentman99 wrote:

I also purchased the 5 Star Super Tune, and I LOVE it! Noticeable increase in power and shifts LIKE IT'S SUPPOSED TO! I'm usually pulling a ski boat and the downshifting was ridiculous. Even when not towing, the slightest upgrade would cause the downshifting.

The Super Tune is money well spent. You'll definitely see results.


Hmmm ... even in Tow/Haul mode?

I drive our V10 powered motorhome a lot with it's Tow/Haul mode invoked - since our E450 chassis is "hauling" a lot of weight all the time - and in this mode the shifting is a lot more controlled and nicely reduced from what it is when not using this mode.

I wonder what state vehicle clean air regulations are not being met with any changes to stock engine settings.

map40

Florida

Senior Member

Joined: 01/15/2005

View Profile



Posted: 08/21/19 05:48am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

rentman99 wrote:

I also purchased the 5 Star Super Tune, and I LOVE it! Noticeable increase in power and shifts LIKE IT'S SUPPOSED TO! I'm usually pulling a ski boat and the downshifting was ridiculous. Even when not towing, the slightest upgrade would cause the downshifting.

The Super Tune is money well spent. You'll definitely see results.

The V10 with the 5 or 6 speed tranny are designed to protect the components. The downshifting is done to prevent excessive wear in the transmission. With the factory specs that powertrain combination is rated for 300K miles (several of my motorhomes are proof of that, reaching numbers close to that without major breakdowns). The tuner changes the settings provided by Ford engineers. Can it give you different performance? Yes. Is it better? Depends what you call better. If the tranny is not downshifting as before, it is being put through unnecesary stress. If you are OK with shortening the lifespan of your powertrain, then it is OK.
To sum it up, You don't get more horsepower for free. No physical changes mean no changes. The tuners will affect the lifespan of your powertraing. Modifications to the airflow system will provide power increase without reducing the lifespan, but now you have more heat (headers) or risk of contaminated air (K&N filter).
I still have several friends in Dearborn that designed that engine. They are not dumb people, believe me. If there is a way to get more power out of the engine without a compromise, they would have done it. Actually, they did. The 3 valve per cilynder design is rated to 362HP.
I would leave it as it is...


Alfa SeeYa, 2015 Jayco XL31, 2015 Itasca XL31, 2012 CA 25, 2008 CA 28. RV with most millage: 312K miles on a V10
Life rocks when your home rolls

rentman99

Memphis, TN

New Member

Joined: 08/20/2019

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 08/21/19 07:09am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

"Depends what you call better."

Driveabilty. Downshifting to 4k rpm every 3-4 miles was miserable.

We're not talking NO2 boost here, just better power management. I wouldn't expect Ford engineers to be able to ship one ECM program that is perfect for all drivers/applications.

You seem concerned about the transmission stress. I'd much rather pull a transmission than an engine. In the bigger picture, I think proper maintenance like clean fluids and changing the filters regularly is the best thing you can do for engines/transmissions.

"You don't get more horsepower for free." Eh, I'm not so sure Ford had my RV at the top of they're list when optimizing the ECM patterns. It's not all about HP anyway.

I get what you're saying about after market mods, but when you have users posting improvements w/o increasing fuel consumption (sometimes even improvements), you're really just talking about better power management.

pnichols

The Other California

Senior Member

Joined: 04/26/2005

View Profile



Good Sam RV Club Member


Posted: 08/21/19 01:52pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I agree completely with what Marcos ("map40") said above.

I trust the Ford engineers way, way, way, more than after-market engineer/technicain software tinkerers.

BTW engine horsepower, and torque on the drive axles ... are all that count, and as such I don't mind at all my V10's necessary high RPM ... to generate the necessary horsepower, to spin the necessary gears, to create the necessary torque on the two rear drive axles.

I hope that my trust gets me 300K+ miles of engine life.

Reply to Topic  |  Subscribe  |  Print Topic  |  Post New Topic  | 
Page of 3  
Prev  |  Next

Open Roads Forum  >  Tech Issues

 > 2006 Grayhawk Ford e450 v-10: Power increase
Search:   Advanced Search

Search only in Tech Issues


New posts No new posts
Closed, new posts Closed, no new posts
Moved, new posts Moved, no new posts

Adjust text size:

© 2019 CWI, Inc. © 2019 Good Sam Enterprises, LLC. All Rights Reserved. | Terms of Use | PRIVACY POLICY | YOUR PRIVACY RIGHTS