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 > GM's 2020 tow rating question for all

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ACZL

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Posted: 08/28/19 07:47am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

GM as we know recently announced their '20 tow ratings which is about time they upped things. Anyways, what get's me is how their SRW can now tow 18,000. Seems odd that there can be that much of a jump for a SRW to tow, so what did they do to achieve it?

For the longest time though, as it's been discussed here that anything over 15,000 was dually territory. How many folks want to tow 18K with a SRW?


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JIMNLIN

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Posted: 08/28/19 08:05am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

JMO but folks over on the commercial side have been doing it for several years now.

I also think GM woke up like Dodge/Ram did and now cater to that industry.

Keep in mind the 18k tow rating isn't just for a 5th wheel trailer but includes trailers of all types (not just rv's).

I think the TH crowd will be using the new SRW with their large triaxle trailers.


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Cummins12V98

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Posted: 08/28/19 08:09am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Pin weight is where you may have issues. Gooseneck trailers and triple axle 5er's are what they may be able to tow since they are closer to the 15% range.

What did they do??? Well they put a trans in that could handle the weight on the SAE test plain and simple.


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4x4ord

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Posted: 08/28/19 08:31am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I've been towing a heavy tandem dually gooseneck trailer for years with a SRW and it has worked fine with only 15% pin weight. With the gooseneck the weight can be positioned over and slightly ahead of the trailer axles A tandem axle rv, however, has the axles in the center of a long tetter todder. When so much weight can be a long ways back of the axle 15% pin weight is not enough to provide a stable tow.


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ShinerBock

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Posted: 08/28/19 09:16am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Cummins12V98 wrote:


What did they do??? Well they put a trans in that could handle the weight on the SAE test plain and simple.


If they had DRW trucks with the same trans that was rated to tow 23k before, then why would the trans be the weak link for a SRW to tow 18k? That doesn't make sense.

Grit dog

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Posted: 08/28/19 10:04am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

"For the longest time though, as it's been discussed here that anything over 15,000 was dually territory. How many folks want to tow 18K with a SRW? "

See the 1/2 vs 3/4 vs 1T debacle...I mean thread, for your answer.

Jeez, the mfgs are trying to appeal to the chicken little sky is falling, live n die by the yellow sticker crowd and now y'all are questioning the authorita!


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twodownzero

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Posted: 08/28/19 10:19am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

ACZL wrote:

GM as we know recently announced their '20 tow ratings which is about time they upped things. Anyways, what get's me is how their SRW can now tow 18,000. Seems odd that there can be that much of a jump for a SRW to tow, so what did they do to achieve it?

For the longest time though, as it's been discussed here that anything over 15,000 was dually territory. How many folks want to tow 18K with a SRW?


Pretty hard to get to 18k without busting the 4k pound payload limit. Any 5er over 14-15k is going to be pushing it. "Tow rating" doesn't mean anything if your truck can't hold up the pin/tongue weight while doing so.

IdaD

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Posted: 08/28/19 10:43am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

twodownzero wrote:

ACZL wrote:

GM as we know recently announced their '20 tow ratings which is about time they upped things. Anyways, what get's me is how their SRW can now tow 18,000. Seems odd that there can be that much of a jump for a SRW to tow, so what did they do to achieve it?

For the longest time though, as it's been discussed here that anything over 15,000 was dually territory. How many folks want to tow 18K with a SRW?


Pretty hard to get to 18k without busting the 4k pound payload limit. Any 5er over 14-15k is going to be pushing it. "Tow rating" doesn't mean anything if your truck can't hold up the pin/tongue weight while doing so.


Shockingly, people tow things other than campers. It's pretty easy to manipulate how much pin weight you've got on a gooseneck utility trailer by where you place the load relative to the trailer axles.


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Huntindog

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Posted: 08/28/19 01:47pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

ShinerBock wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:


What did they do??? Well they put a trans in that could handle the weight on the SAE test plain and simple.


If they had DRW trucks with the same trans that was rated to tow 23k before, then why would the trans be the weak link for a SRW to tow 18k? That doesn't make sense.
LOL. True That.
12V has a vendatta against the Allison... Has for years.

What GM did was not as simple as a beefier tranny.
In fact, if that was the case, then a simple ring and pinion swap would have allowed for a higher tow rating... That is What Ford and Ram did.

I actually had this discussion with a long time(since retired)GM employee, when the Tow ratings first started going up with the use of lower R&P ratios. I asked why GM would not put 4.10s in behind the D/A, like they do for the gas motors. He said that they tried that, and the pinion gears kept failing. Having rebuilt a few differentials, I under stand the relationship between lower gears and a smaller (weaker) gear contact patch.

So why were Ford and Ram sucessful with thier trucks doing that.... This is easy. In spite of GMs lower HP and TQ, it was putting more power to the rear axle than the others.

The proof is in a couple of indisputable facts. GM was (still is?) the only one to use the SAE certified dyno testing procedure.This how they ended up with an odd (397) HP number, whereas the others always have a nice round ADVERTISEDnumber.
Further proof is GMs dominance in the many hill climb tests. This cannot happen with less power.

As for just what was done to increase the 2020 ratings. it was a multiprong approach. First the 10 speed trans allowed for the necessary gear multiplication at low/start speeds to take place in the trans instead of the rear end. They also were able to use a 3.42 (stronger) gearset instead of the 3.73s, and then they also upsized the rear end and drive shaft. Further cooling system enhancements such as redesigned oil coolers and larger fans were also used. They also beefed up the frame.

So much to 12Vs chagrin, the charge he has been making about the Allison being too weak.... Is not supported by the evidence



Huntindog
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JTrac

Oklahoma

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Posted: 08/28/19 03:44pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I don't think Ford has announced it yet but I saw something on one of the truck forums that the 2020 F350 single rear wheel will have a 12,400 GVWR, up from the previous 11,500. I figured they would try to beat GM with their 12,100 rating. Haven't seen anything on tow ratings. My personal opinion is they are all great trucks and it's kind of fun to watch the "my truck is bigger than yours" game. One good thing, it does open up some options for those who are on the dually vs. single fence.


JimT
2013 Excel Winslow 34RKM, 2017 Ford F350 King Ranch, 6.7 PS, 4X4 dually

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