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TT Upgrade Suggestions: TV: 2019 Nissan Armada

campbikemom
Explorer
Explorer
Hi all! I have been lurking on various camper forums for a bit and would like some input. I know a lot will be based on personal preferences, but I’m having a hard time narrowing down an exact floorplan and manufacturer/brand so I would love to hear everyone’s experience.

We have a 2019 Nissan Armada SL as our tow vehicle. I know that folks who frequent RV forums are borderline rabid about buy the tow vehicle that meets the needs of the camper you want, but I think that is unrealistic for anyone that doesn’t have money growing on trees. Price, features, and needs of the family come first, then finding the best camper to match the tow vehicle (in my opinion). For us, the Armada hit the most marks.

Would like to keep a new camper price around $20,000 or less, which will price us out of most fiberglass trailers. 20-30 nights a year does not justify spending more for us.

Basic facts about the Armada:
Max towing: 8500 lbs
Max tongue weight: 850 lbs.
Payload: We’ll say 1500 (there is a range up to about 1750, but we’ll just go with the low end)

Basic facts about our family:
Family of 4 (kids are currently 6 and 4) plus a German Shepherd. We started out as tent campers/backpackers. Then went to a 1980’s Jayco popup towed by a Pilot. We decided to push the limits and get a small hardside (2017 Starfcraft AR-One 19BHLE that has a GVWR right around 4400lbs) knowing we were going to be putting the Pilot through hell and it would be a short-term solution (it struggled, as expected. This year we traded in the Pilot and got the Armada. We are fairly basic campers and primarily use the camper for storage, washing dishes, sometimes cooking (usually use the fire), showering. We’ll never have a TV in a camper and usually only spent time inside when the weather is cold and damp (we are in NY, though, so the good weather camping season isn’t very long). We do a lot of state park camping and usually do not have hookups of any kind. To date we’ve always filled up water when we got to our location, but now that we have a beefier tow vehicle we might even entertain boondocking. We are mostly long weekend campers, but part of that has been restricted by the Pilot in the past. But we usually save our longer trips and vacation time for cross country and international. We also are bike racers and bringing a camper along to races (even if they are day races) is nice if the weather is ****.

Things I would like to see improved on over our current floorplan:
- More seating. When it’s a “stay inside” day it’s very cramped on the dinette and I hate sand in the bed ?
- Larger fridge. The under the counter fridge fills up very quickly and realistically we can only do 3 days of food with drinks in a cooler.
- Bathroom sink and medicine cabinet.
- Would like to have windows that open on top and bottom bunks (know you can add them, but getting them upfront would be great)
- I also like dinette storage that has pull out bins versus lifting the seat up.
- If we go with a slide, I do not like elevated slides . I like them to be as flush with the camper floor as possible.
- An oven would be great to have although I’m pretty good baking in the dutch oven on the fire.

I know Starcraft in general has mixed reviews, but we have had great luck with this particular camper. I am also super impressed with the amount of storage they have managed to cram into such a small space. Although I pack smartly, I’ve never felt like I have to make hard choices on what to bring or have to use the Pilot as significant overflow. I have definitely noticed that in camper brands in general some models have good reviews and others you can’t find a good review about.

When we bought the 19BHLE we really liked the 26 non-slide bunk house models and said at the time that we wanted that to be our next camper, especially since the price is almost the same as what we picked up our current camper for. However, almost all of these campers across brands do not have a pantry or storage when you first open the door (e.g. a floor cabinet to the left of the door). Our current camper is so tiny I cannot imagine LOSING storage that I really like. There are a couple exceptions to the pantry, like the Shasta 26BH. But the Shasta lacks ANY window in the top bunk and does not have an oven. Also, now that our kids have gotten bigger it seems like this floorplan is pretty cramped. This floorplan is usually around a GVWR of 6000-6500lbs or less and is a hair under 30’.

I REALLY like the Jayco SLX 298BH, but that floorplan has already been retired and we probably won’t be buying until next year. We also wanted to stick to 30’ or under, but this trailer has a ton for the weight and overall size in my opinion. It lacks a medicine cabinet and a window that opens in the top bunk, but with all the extra storage I felt like these were minor quibbles. But 32’ is a long trailer! GVWR of 6250lbs, hitch weight of 555lbs.

We have also been considering the floorplans that have smaller slides like the Jayco SLX 242BS, Starcraft Autumn Ridge 26BHS. Those seem to be around a GVWR of 7000-7500 lbs, have a hitch weight in the mid-600’s, and are around 30’. Yes, this last group is probably pushing the *ideal* circumstances for hauling, but most of these should still be doable if we are smart about how we travel (not filling water up unless absolutely necessary and then only doing it part-way, etc.). However, I would love to hear from people who were in a similar spot and either regretted it or felt it was fine.

Additionally, if anyone has any opinions or input on having a small dinette plus a couch versus having one big u-shaped dinette I would appreciate any feedback. I know our single small dinette is not cutting it, but having a slide and a large u-shaped dinette might be “just right.” I have looked at a million floorplans and these are the ones that I am leaning towards, but if you have any other floorplan suggestions based on what I’ve described I would love to hear them. There is something about appliances in the slide I don’t love, but I also don’t’ have a solid reason for disliking this setup.
22 REPLIES 22

GrandpaKip
Explorer
Explorer
campbikemom wrote:
GrandpaKip wrote:
Grit dog wrote:
camperbikermom, as you can see, the "weight cop" vultures are circling hard already at your mere mention of towing a mid size trailer with a full size SUV. Even though your post and questions did not even allude to wanting anyone's opinion.
All I can offer is don't get too caught up in that and maybe you'll get some good info on the type of camper to buy. Keep the weight reasonable and ignore the folks that meter out how many paper plates they put in the pantry based on their sherline scale reading!

So, are you saying that anyone that is trying to match their TV to a trailer should not understand or do the basic math?
What is the problem with making sure you are within the specs for your vehicle?
When determining the type of camper somebody wants, isn’t making sure that the TV is not being overloaded by that choice somewhat important?
I really don’t care what the TV is, as long as people are informed and know the capabilities and the limitations of said TV. Same goes for the camper.
A lot of wasted time looking at campers that are not a good fit with a certain TV can be avoided.


Grit dog can correct me if I'm wrong, but the "basic math" still leaves a pretty big range. Some people insist you need to stay on one end of the spectrum, and others like to live dangerously. In my case, it's an almost 2500 lb range that would leave us within the recommendations.

You will end up with a range between the minimum tongue weight and the maximum. And those will give you an idea of the gross weights of trailers to look at. Personally, I go for 12%, which has worked well for us and leaves a comfortable cushion. Our previous truck was maxed out on payload and 1000 pounds under max tow weight. Never had a problem with that setup.
I would also recommend looking at the cargo carrying capacity of the trailers you are considering. Just for 2 of us, we added about 800 pounds to the dry weight. That’s a scaled weight I got on the way home with it empty. The listed dry weight was about 300 pounds less.
Have fun with your search.
Kip
2015 Skyline Dart 214RB
2018 Silverado Double Cab 4x4
Andersen Hitch

campbikemom
Explorer
Explorer
Campina, thanks so much for the input on the murphy bed. I'm especially keen on reading that you can have a 5" topper on top of the existing mattress. After thinking about it that might actually be the perfect solution. 75% of the time when we are camping the bed would probably never get put up and then when we are taking it to bike races for the day the bed can stay up and won't be in the way. Still leaning towards a slide, though just for the extra floor space. My kids are still at the age where the floor is the primary play area - whether it's indoors or outdoors.

campinia
Explorer
Explorer
campbikemom wrote:
campinia wrote:
We bought a Passport 239ML SL SERIES earlier this summer for our family of 4 of which two are teens and not little anymore! The weight, size, and wants that you expressed seem to all be covered with this camper unless you really want a slide. It would pull well behind the Armada I think. MSRP is listed as $21,900, but, you should be able to get it for 18-19K.


We have been weighing the pros and cons of a slide. They add so much weight, but the added floor space in nice. We've been throwing around the idea of a murphy bed the last week or so. How do you like yours? In my advanced age of late 30's I've gotten to be a princess and the pea with camping mattress comfort haha.

I recently came across this just archived Jayco floor plan, the 24BHM and I've become a bit obsessed with it. Unfortunately, it looks like it was a one and done and it already archived.

We have had 4 Travel trailers in the last 10 years. We had a jayco just like your starcraft. Then we went to a 27 ft bunkhouse with dinette slide, more maintenace and worries about leaks then I wanted. We went bak down to an 18 foot bunkhouse with permanent front bed, too small. We saw this murphy bed model and It was perfect. The murphy folds right up and has a full size queen mattress, not rv short queen. You can put a 5” memory foam topper and still have bedding and pillows and it still folds up. I love it because you can have a nice couch to watch tv on during the day. I am late 40’s and wife early 40’s andvwe fo appreciate having a full walk around queen at night!

https://www.jayco.com/tools/archive/2019-jay-feather/24bhm/
2017 Chevy Silverado Crew Cab LT 2500HD Z71 4X4 6.0 Gasser
2018 Keystone Passport Ultra Light 175BH
Champion 3100W Inverter Generator
2018 Pescador Pro 10 Fishing Kayak
2018 Old Town Topwater 106 Fishing Kayak

campbikemom
Explorer
Explorer
GrandpaKip wrote:
Grit dog wrote:
camperbikermom, as you can see, the "weight cop" vultures are circling hard already at your mere mention of towing a mid size trailer with a full size SUV. Even though your post and questions did not even allude to wanting anyone's opinion.
All I can offer is don't get too caught up in that and maybe you'll get some good info on the type of camper to buy. Keep the weight reasonable and ignore the folks that meter out how many paper plates they put in the pantry based on their sherline scale reading!

So, are you saying that anyone that is trying to match their TV to a trailer should not understand or do the basic math?
What is the problem with making sure you are within the specs for your vehicle?
When determining the type of camper somebody wants, isn’t making sure that the TV is not being overloaded by that choice somewhat important?
I really don’t care what the TV is, as long as people are informed and know the capabilities and the limitations of said TV. Same goes for the camper.
A lot of wasted time looking at campers that are not a good fit with a certain TV can be avoided.


Grit dog can correct me if I'm wrong, but the "basic math" still leaves a pretty big range. Some people insist you need to stay on one end of the spectrum, and others like to live dangerously. In my case, it's an almost 2500 lb range that would leave us within the recommendations.

campbikemom
Explorer
Explorer
Jebby14 wrote:
no murphy bed. I have a queen up front, triple bunks in the rear and a dinette that drops to a double. no need for me to convert stuff and given we don't spend time in the camper (I like camping I cook outside I hangout outside I am close to my tenting roots) it works for us. I really wouldn't want to be much heavier even though I have ~450lbds more payload.


Oh sorry, I just googled your floor plan it it looks like the current version has a murphy bed instead of a queen so I was going off of that.

I would say that your model (which is a slightly bigger version of what we have now) works great for maybe 50-75% of the time. We're trying to bridge the gap of the rest of the time:
- shoulder season camping when we have days on days of 40's and rain
- torrential downpours and high winds that last hours
- gravel bike races in the early spring and cyclocross races in the fall when our camper is acting as a base camp for our teams and the family in crappy weather.
- black fly season in the Adirondacks. If you've camped there in late May and early June you would understand hahaha

Mostly just want more moving around room and seating for the days when we are spending more time inside than what is typical.

Total first world problems.

Jebby14
Explorer
Explorer
looking at that link I was posting for floor plan. the image of the camper its self is of a smaller model. my door is forward of the axles. sorry for the crappy pictures.









Q: Whats brown and sticky???

A: A Stick....

Jebby14
Explorer
Explorer
no murphy bed. I have a queen up front, triple bunks in the rear and a dinette that drops to a double. no need for me to convert stuff and given we don't spend time in the camper (I like camping I cook outside I hangout outside I am close to my tenting roots) it works for us. I really wouldn't want to be much heavier even though I have ~450lbds more payload.
Q: Whats brown and sticky???

A: A Stick....

campbikemom
Explorer
Explorer
Jebby14 wrote:
soungs like my flagstaff micro lite would be perfect. just bought this one super clean for 8k canadain in the spring

https://www.rvusa.com/rv-guide/2008-forest-river-flagstaff-micro-lite-travel-trailer-floorplan-23lb-tr3599


This is too close to what we have to bother upgrading. It's probably what we would have gone with originally had we had the Armada when we first bought a camper, but it doesn't get us enough extra to go with a floor plan like this, unfortunately. Although we do like being nimble so you never know!

Same question for you as the last post - how do you like your murphy bed? I am getting more into that idea daily, although I was also digging the idea of having a separate bedroom.

campbikemom
Explorer
Explorer
campinia wrote:
We bought a Passport 239ML SL SERIES earlier this summer for our family of 4 of which two are teens and not little anymore! The weight, size, and wants that you expressed seem to all be covered with this camper unless you really want a slide. It would pull well behind the Armada I think. MSRP is listed as $21,900, but, you should be able to get it for 18-19K.


We have been weighing the pros and cons of a slide. They add so much weight, but the added floor space in nice. We've been throwing around the idea of a murphy bed the last week or so. How do you like yours? In my advanced age of late 30's I've gotten to be a princess and the pea with camping mattress comfort haha.

I recently came across this just archived Jayco floor plan, the 24BHM and I've become a bit obsessed with it. Unfortunately, it looks like it was a one and done and it already archived.

https://www.jayco.com/tools/archive/2019-jay-feather/24bhm/

campbikemom
Explorer
Explorer
Thanks all for the input. The only reason I was "guessing" at the payload was that every time I remembered my husband had the car. But, I finally looked and it is 1543. I had previously calculated what our payload was -- as much gibberish as I typed into the first post I can't believe I left that out. But, with rounding up on everything (our weights, the bike weights,bag weights, etc.) we have about 700 lbs left over. I had already included the hitch setup in the weight.

Based on the minimum recommended range (10%) we could go up to 7000 loaded. If we went with the most conservative estimates (15%) we'd be stuck with the camper we have now as it comes to about 4600. Considering that, to date, we have NEVER towed with anything in our water tanks and really don't have plans to (other than maybe having some water to wash up at a day bike race, but those are always pretty close to home and we wouldn't be towing nearly as much stuff in the camper for a day trip) I am comfortable with being in the 10-12% range. Not that we are at all set on that; just trying to balance all the wants and needs.

Don't forget, we've been towing with a Pilot so we are quite cognizant of the stress put on cars with this particular hobby and are very weight-conscious. Even the biggest trailer we are considering is going to haul like a dream compared to what we have been dealing with!

Jebby14
Explorer
Explorer
oops missed the clicky
Q: Whats brown and sticky???

A: A Stick....

Jebby14
Explorer
Explorer
soungs like my flagstaff micro lite would be perfect. just bought this one super clean for 8k canadain in the spring

https://www.rvusa.com/rv-guide/2008-forest-river-flagstaff-micro-lite-travel-trailer-floorplan-23lb-tr3599
Q: Whats brown and sticky???

A: A Stick....

GrandpaKip
Explorer
Explorer
Grit dog wrote:
camperbikermom, as you can see, the "weight cop" vultures are circling hard already at your mere mention of towing a mid size trailer with a full size SUV. Even though your post and questions did not even allude to wanting anyone's opinion.
All I can offer is don't get too caught up in that and maybe you'll get some good info on the type of camper to buy. Keep the weight reasonable and ignore the folks that meter out how many paper plates they put in the pantry based on their sherline scale reading!

So, are you saying that anyone that is trying to match their TV to a trailer should not understand or do the basic math?
What is the problem with making sure you are within the specs for your vehicle?
When determining the type of camper somebody wants, isn’t making sure that the TV is not being overloaded by that choice somewhat important?
I really don’t care what the TV is, as long as people are informed and know the capabilities and the limitations of said TV. Same goes for the camper.
A lot of wasted time looking at campers that are not a good fit with a certain TV can be avoided.
Kip
2015 Skyline Dart 214RB
2018 Silverado Double Cab 4x4
Andersen Hitch

Grit_dog
Nomad III
Nomad III
camperbikermom, as you can see, the "weight cop" vultures are circling hard already at your mere mention of towing a mid size trailer with a full size SUV. Even though your post and questions did not even allude to wanting anyone's opinion.
All I can offer is don't get too caught up in that and maybe you'll get some good info on the type of camper to buy. Keep the weight reasonable and ignore the folks that meter out how many paper plates they put in the pantry based on their sherline scale reading!
2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29 - Sold.
Couple of Arctic Fox TCs - Sold