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4x4van

California

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Posted: 10/22/19 12:55pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

drsteve wrote:

Love these threads, there's always someone who thinks sanitation is no big deal because they haven't died yet.
And there's always someone who thinks that dumping your black tank requires a full hazmat suit and decontamination facilities.

BTW, I've seen it mentioned here a couple of times that "manufacturers recommend sanitizing RV water tanks every 6 months..." Hmmm...I've never seen that recommendation from an RV manufacturer. I've owned 3 RVs over the past 30 years, all 3 purchased used...and I've sanitized the freshwater system maybe twice...just because the water got a bit stale after sitting a couple of months.


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down home

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Posted: 10/22/19 01:47pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I'm old and diabetic and some other things.As a kid lived with Gran Ma most summers and other times.No lectricity and no pumbing.Water was from a well or springs up the hills.I drank from the same tin dipper as others...and none ever had a cold or other illness. generally.Nothing quit as refreshing as a cool drink of water from that tin dipper on a hot summer day. Stepped on a nail and it went all the way through. Soaked in in coal erl and next day a bit sore but didn't slow me down. Dirt: I was always in it,the garden or walking the woods and the road to Thoma's store to buy more.22s or town and bathing in the creek was normal and preferred in summer.
However there is more than one cemetery in the mountains of relatives who died in their 20s.Average age seemed to be about 24. I have administered more than one Whole Life policy that was paid up at age 35. Average age at death was in the forties!That was the 19th and first part of the 20tth century.In that very rural area they died and the pathogens eventually died out with them. N one new moved into thee area until the late sixties.
Diseases were aplenty.The reason Mom's family and many rural families survived the Spanish flu and countless other diseases was that no one moved into the area until late 60s bringing diseases with them. And Mom's family back before her Ancestors,native Americans washed every day, in the clean creeks and rivers and ponds, or with hide buckets of water.
And they did not use animal or human manure despite whoever else may have.
The contagions breed and are nourished in rich soils, the richer the better.
Today, when the winds come from the southwest ll the way from the fields in La, Tx, Miss and South Alabama, our home gets dirty from it and people get sick at those times.I grow tired of washing the home down. I have even been caught in a mud rain just at the foot off where our drive is now.
All those fertilizers, herbicides and poisons, bacteria and germs and soot from burning fields in the top layers of soil that are blown directly onto our front porch and others are loaded with them.
Dirt, that is clean dirt so to speak had the potential to give us germs and bacteria but a lot less than today.
Keeping clean, including washing our hands, when handling the sewer hoses etc is something we would have done back then if we had such things as RVs. Inviting disease is not macho by not washing our hands or wearing gloves,or even removing our shoes when we enter our RVs. Dirt now had a higher potential to contain pathogens. And someone who had the flu or worse, and used the dump station before us,has left some time bombs for us, to the degree they were or not clean, and one of the reasons we choose RV parks with full hookups. And...one thing to consider is that more germs are spread by aerosols germs lingering, in the air blown off the stuff on the ground...and at septic dumps.
Ass an example the Spanish flue.

* This post was edited 10/22/19 02:05pm by down home *

am1958

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Posted: 10/22/19 02:35pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

drsteve wrote:

That's what a lot of folks don't understand. Our immune systems routinely deal with LOW levels of bacteria, the trouble begins when levels are so high they overwhelm the capabilities of even a healthy immune system.

It makes sense to err on the side of caution.


No, it doesn't make sense. If the immune system works against low levels but can be overwhelmed then any decrease in the effectiveness of the immune system increases the likelihood of the system itself becoming overwhelmed therefore there is a fine line between "erring on the side of caution" and disaffecting your immune system.

No, I don't eat food soiled with dog poop nor do I live in a poophole but the level some people here go to to avoid contact with any and every form of bacteria - including destroying beneficial bacteria - is quite ridiculous.

ppine

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Posted: 10/22/19 04:54pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Another point to be made is that humans and domestic animals and wildlife have very different gut flora. Most of the bacteria in your dog's gut does not contain pathogens communicable to humans. Same with most wildlife species, especially vegetarian prey species. There are exceptions and there can be alternative hosts like ground squirrels that can carry plague. The transfer of human fecal matter contamination is typically much more of a hazard than fecal matter from animals.

dieseltruckdriver

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Posted: 10/22/19 07:03pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

After reading through the entire thread and laughing at several posts, I have to admit, I don't use the "cute" little booties, I don't use gloves, but I do wipe my hands with a sanitizing wipe when I am done.

I also had a question.

Why is everyone so afraid of using their fresh water tank. I never leave home without it being full. I never use water hookups, and my water pressure is always consistent.

I have seen people stretch several hoses to reach a water spigot a couple sites away at a spot meant to be a fill so they could avoid using the tank. I do not get it. Note, these are NOT water hookup sites.

I do know that if that is being done and I need to refill water, their hose will be disconnected and left laying on the ground while I refill. Luckily I haven't ever had to do that.


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WTP-GC

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Posted: 10/23/19 05:52am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

ppine wrote:

Third World countries have tremendous health problems because the water and waste streams are not entirely separated. That is exactly what we are talking about here. Bad practices by people that don't know or don't care about fecal contamnation of fresh water.

I was teaching some high school kids about water quality last week on the Carson River. Fecal coliform bacteria is one of the main parameters we measure. At 5 ppm no problem At 100 ppm it can be a big problem. Use caution. People are stupid.

Apples and oranges my friend. In this thread, we’re discussing minor potential contact with potable water and a waste product. In those third world countries, an entire community is pooping in a latrine, and downstream, people are gathering drinking water in buckets that have never been cleaned.


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mdcamping

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Posted: 10/23/19 07:55am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

pasusan wrote:

mdcamping wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:

Turn on spigot for few seconds, connect hose run for a few seconds, connect to RV.


yup


At a state campground in MA about 5 yrs back I was starting to finish up at a 2 way island dump station, guy pulls up on the opposite side in a New Class C, I glanced over noticed he was kind of nervous, well he opens his black tank valve and lets it rip! NO SEWER HOSE! I just got out of dodge fast! while leaving I did notice he was trying to wash it down with the non potable water spigot.

Mike

We just saw that at Liberty Harbor. It was a class C from overseas - I could tell because it was shaped weird and had a funky license plate.

They just pulled up close to the drain and opened the valve. No rinsing either. I wondered if that's the way they do it where they come from...

Luckily there was a good rain before we had to dump.


Yup, we were there about 5 yrs ago too, I noticed lots & lots of rental Class C's and overseas visitors. (guy next to me was from Germany as I helped him fix a problem with his fresh water hose)
I'm not surprised that happened as my guess most have little to no experience with a RV.

Mike


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JRscooby

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Posted: 10/23/19 08:33am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

dieseltruckdriver wrote:

After reading through the entire thread and laughing at several posts, I have to admit, I don't use the "cute" little booties, I don't use gloves, but I do wipe my hands with a sanitizing wipe when I am done.

I also had a question.

Why is everyone so afraid of using their fresh water tank. I never leave home without it being full. I never use water hookups, and my water pressure is always consistent.

I have seen people stretch several hoses to reach a water spigot a couple sites away at a spot meant to be a fill so they could avoid using the tank. I do not get it. Note, these are NOT water hookup sites.


I once watched people from half a dozen sites hook hose end to end, and filled all their tanks. Thought that was great.

Quote:

I do know that if that is being done and I need to refill water, their hose will be disconnected and left laying on the ground while I refill. Luckily I haven't ever had to do that.


I have seen that. First time, I ask how much longer to fill their tank, got growled at. Next time, unscrewed and dropped. (Tent, my "tank" was called "bucket") More growling, louder and longer. Next time Buckit. (At that time the Buck went on belt when pants went on butt). This time, I told him to call a Ranger, I would only listen with fist.

Ride S40T

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Posted: 10/23/19 09:59pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

4x4van wrote:

drsteve wrote:

Love these threads, there's always someone who thinks sanitation is no big deal because they haven't died yet.
And there's always someone who thinks that dumping your black tank requires a full hazmat suit and decontamination facilities.

BTW, I've seen it mentioned here a couple of times that "manufacturers recommend sanitizing RV water tanks every 6 months..." Hmmm...I've never seen that recommendation from an RV manufacturer. I've owned 3 RVs over the past 30 years, all 3 purchased used...and I've sanitized the freshwater system maybe twice...just because the water got a bit stale after sitting a couple of months.


There's an independent packet or notice I read that said to sanitize the tank every 6 mos but the big manual says every year. We tend to camp about every 2-4 weeks throughout the year (empty nesters) so the water in the tank doesn't sit long. From our manual:

Sanitizing the Fresh Water System
Keeping the fresh water system clean and free of any potential contaminations should be a top priority. Sanitizing the system before initial use and thereafter annually, or whenever water remains unused for prolonged durations, is recommended. This will help keep the water system fresh and discourage harmful bacterial or viral growth.
Keystone RV Company Owners Manual 4/1/2018

I'm a big fan of using the fresh water tank as well. We usually do 2-dayers Fri/Sat so we try to keep it simple at setup and get into the woods or off fishing. We did 3 trips of about 1,000 mi one-way and on those we just keep enough to pee on the road. No sense in beating up the tank bands with the extra weight, fuel mileage, etc.


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lakeside013104

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Posted: 10/28/19 03:53am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Ride S40T wrote:

Well, I started this thread. Glad I did. Great discussion and great points.

If someone is fine with folks before them being a bit less than sanitary and have been good - that's great. Wish them the best and uneventful camping.

For the rest of us who tend to lean toward keeping things a bit more sanitary (not phobic), that's great as well. There's a reason we use separate black water flush hoses and fresh water hoses, there's a reason the manufacturers recommend sanitizing the tank(s), there's a reason the nation's CDC recommends washing hands after well, everything...including intimate follies.

Just don't see the oopostition to using basic sanitary routines. What's the worst that comes from it? Think it's a waste of time? No problem. Do what you believe is good for you and the fam. It's not a phobia, it's based on science. As is the science of building a good immune system by not eliminating all germs.

The point of the post was to raise awareness. RV sales are reportedly up 300% over the past decade. That likely means many newbies to the game, like me. I did A LOT of research, watched every video possible, talked to friends who have RVs and read most all of the threads on this and other sites before our first trip last year - just to be sure we would do it right, have a good experience and yes, not break anything that cost major bucks. Not everyone is so diligent and as explained above, some may leave us unexpected gifts. And not singling out rookies like me, could be anyone who just doesn't care or someone who simply makes a mistake in what they're doing at a site. It happens.

Just shared for awareness. But the discussion has been great! Hope to see you down the road and I promise, WE WILL leave the campsite you're rolling in to very clean. No trash, no poop (ours or our dogs') and it will be better than we found it.


Great post and well explained. Welcome to the RVing world.

Lakeside

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