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 > Question for DMV Doug on spayed

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colliehauler

Mc Pherson KS USA

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Posted: 10/24/19 11:32am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I have a 3 month old female Collie pup (Sasha). I have heard that waiting a little longer then 6 months is better for development and others said to do it at 6 months to help prevent health issues.

What is your opinion on this?

* This post was edited 10/24/19 02:30pm by colliehauler *

DownTheAvenue

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Posted: 10/24/19 11:57am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Doug is the expert, but having just visited this issue at the University of Georgia Vet School with a puppy that was diagnosed with an etopic urethra, waiting until after they have gone through one heat lessens the possibility of urine leakage but increases the risk of mammary gland cancer.

Old-Biscuit

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Posted: 10/24/19 12:01pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I am NOT Dr. Doug nor did I sleep at a Motel 6 ever.....BUT

Our Vet suggests females have it done before their first 'heat' cycle for best health results....typically 6-7 months old is first heat

Our Vet also will not perform spaying until AFTER pup is at least 3 month old

Males she advises not until at least 3 months old and anytime between 6-9 months although it can be done when older.

I didn't get 'clipped' until I was 42.....LOL


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BCSnob

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Posted: 10/24/19 12:45pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Someone needs to be the smart @!#
Why would you want to hit your pup with a spade (spading)?

Now here is something helpful (unfortunately there is no citation for these data)
https://www.acvs.org/small-animal/mammary-tumors

Mammary tumors are more common in female dogs that are either not spayed or were spayed after 2 years of age. The risk of a dog developing a mammary tumor is 0.5% if spayed before their first heat (approximately 6 months of age), 8% after their first heat, and 26% after their second heat. Cats spayed before 6 months of age have a 7-times reduced risk of developing mammary cancer and spaying at any age reduces the risk of mammary tumors by 40% to 60% in cats.

* This post was edited 10/24/19 12:53pm by BCSnob *

toedtoes

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Posted: 10/24/19 12:49pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Waiting until after a first heat is an old belief. My vets have all stated that the research shows the best health advantage by spaying before the first heat. They have always recommended spaying between 4 and 6 months old - with the personal specifics of the dog deciding when during that time frame. They are most always able to cite the research and the results.

There seem to be more vets nowadays suggesting later, but I've never heard them actually cite studies that validate their view.

DowntheAvenue's post is the first actual statement of the benefits of waiting that I've heard. If that is the proven difference, I would choose reducing the chance of cancer than reducing the chance of leakage. The latter is annoying, but the former is potentially deadly.

Oh, and it's "spayed" in the past tense. Not being a spelling nazi, just know it's a very common error so like to point it out.


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colliehauler

Mc Pherson KS USA

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Posted: 10/24/19 02:32pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

For the people who pointed out the spelling error I changed it. I used voice recognition on my tablet and did not go back and check it.

Old-Biscuit I actually searched out Motel 6 when not using the RV because of their pet policy. I was pleasantly surprised in the ones I stayed at.

Just trying to make the best decision for Sasha. I heard that waiting until 7 months or so helped with development. Others have brought up the risk of cancer. I have had two Collies that had Lymphoma and one that developed oral cancer. Cancer is a big concern for me. Good friend passed this summer due to esophageal cancer.

* This post was edited 10/24/19 02:45pm by colliehauler *

toedtoes

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Posted: 10/24/19 03:46pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

The cancers most connected with spaying are mammary, uterine and ovarian. Uterine and ovarian cancers are completely eliminated with a ovariohysterectomy as those organs are completely removed. Mammary cancer is significantly reduced.

dturm

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Posted: 10/24/19 03:59pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Mark points out the data that supports spaying before the first heat cycle. By far the most common tumors seen in intact female dogs are mammary tumors.

The current reasoning to delay spaying have to do with statistics that show an association with development issues (hip dysplasia) and the potential of increase incidence in other types of tumors (hemangiosarcoma, mast cell). While the association is statistically real, the causation is still not understood. There also may be an association with urinary incontinence later in life, cause not understood.

Even if early spaying (before the first heat) causes these things, the potential of life threatening breast tumors is real and so much more of a threat I still spay mine before their first heat.

Some rescue and humane groups spay at much younger age (like 2-3 months) and I don't like that. The stress of surgery and the difficulty of managing anesthesia at that age is a risk I don't like. Their reasoning is that they get 100% compliance if the spay is done before adoption rather than waiting and hoping the new owners with actually get the dog spayed later.

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dturm

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Posted: 10/24/19 04:10pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Mark, I read the acvs article you linked and agree with everything in it with the exception that they said
Quote:

More than a quarter of unspayed female dogs will develop a mammary tumor during their lifetime. The risk is much lower for spayed female dogs, male dogs, and cats of either gender. In female dogs, 50% of mammary tumors are benign and 50% are malignant. However, few of the malignant mammary tumors are fatal.

I've found that most of these require multiple surgeries and/or the ulcerate and drain to the point the owners elect euthanasia. In my opinion elective euthanasia due to a malignant tumor is just a fatal as the tumor causing organ failure and death.

colliehauler

Mc Pherson KS USA

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Posted: 10/24/19 04:41pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Dturm what age do you recomend? I was planning on 6 to 7 months old. I was concerned about the development issues. I had Sawyer (male smooth Collie) neutered at 6 months.

Just trying to make a informed decision in the best interest of Sasha.

I have always adopted older Collies usually around 8 years old so this is new to me.

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