Good Sam Club Open Roads Forum: Tow Vehicles: F450 vs F350 SRW payload
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 > F450 vs F350 SRW payload

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Grit dog

Black Diamond, WA

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Posted: 12/30/19 10:37am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

So, cause I kinda nerd out on this stuff, I read the 2020 specs as well and gleaned that the 450 pickup is a wide track 350 with bigger brakes, 19.5s, deeper gearing option and a heavier front axle rating on ford paper with the same rear axle rating on ford Specs.
But the M300 in the 450 has larger shafts, more splines and "may" be in the 16klb category vs the lighter duty M300 in the F350s which are 11,500lb rated.
You don't see the "big" S110 axle in the 450 p/u, becasue the newer M 300 axles are heavier duty already than the old 1 ton axles. Suspect the same for the front axle but didn't read up on it.
Ford basically built a wolf (class 4) in sheeps (class 3) clothing.
Rest of the drivetrain, rear springs and frame are the same as 350 which is much improved over the old super dutys.
The lesser payload of the 450 is only about the difference in the additional weight of the wheels maybe?
So the question, why not offer a billy [email protected] 450 pickup with an even heavier rear axle? Answer, because how much more than 15-16k could you possibly need in a pickup...

It seems to fil a niche and pulls some sales based partly on "marketing" and partly on the function of a, realistically, upgraded 350.
Hot shotters, big RV pullers/haulers and guys that gotta have the baddest cowboy Cadillac, this is your truck. Stays in the class 3 designation which saves some hassles with reg, insurance and driver requirements (not really on the driver req) and provides the most capability out of a "1 ton" on the market.

A big "pickup" like this is not targeted to most of the "commercial" market, as a pickup bed is just an expensive liability with less usefulness than a flatbed, waiting to get smashed, in most commercially used 1.5-2.5 ton trucks. And a straight frame is more easily customizable for the commercial market.
I say Ford did a very good job "creating" and "filling" a void in the market that costs them virtually zero additional tooling or expense.

* This post was edited 12/30/19 10:56am by Grit dog *


"Yes Sir, Oct 10 1888, Those poor school children froze to death in their tracks. They did not even find them until Spring. Especially hard hit were the ones who had to trek uphill to school both ways, with no shoes." -Bert A.

noteven

Turtle Island

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Posted: 12/30/19 01:21pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

What Grit said^.

Wide track steer axle & front leaf springs? 19.5 moccasins available...

Also does the 450 pickup have straight SAE 34” wide frame rails back of cab?

Kind of a “derated” F550 available as a pickup (complete vehicle) that flies under the “commercial vehicle” flag down at the dmv and insurance office?

My F350 chassis cab pops up as “commercial” on the computers....

blt2ski

Kirkland, Wa

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Posted: 12/30/19 02:18pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Depending on jurisdiction, anything over 10,000 gvw be it door placarded or paper paid for license can be construed as commercial. Hence a 35 series being listed as commercial

Marty


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NRALIFR

Truck Camping Out West

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Posted: 12/30/19 03:15pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

noteven wrote:

What Grit said^.

Wide track steer axle & front leaf springs? 19.5 moccasins available...

Also does the 450 pickup have straight SAE 34” wide frame rails back of cab?

Kind of a “derated” F550 available as a pickup (complete vehicle) that flies under the “commercial vehicle” flag down at the dmv and insurance office?

My F350 chassis cab pops up as “commercial” on the computers....


Wide track front axle and COIL springs.

The frame rails behind the cab on the F450 pickup are NOT the straight, flat, and narrower frame rails of the cab and chassis. The F450 pickup frame is designed for a pickup bed.

That’s why I like the F450 pickup. I think my TC looks better sitting IN a pickup bed vs ON a flatbed, plus I have no need for a flatbed. I also (after giving it considerable serious thought) don’t want any cab and chassis truck with a pickup bed installed. That forces too many things I don’t want, and limits trim levels available.

This may sound like heresy to some, but I don’t agree with the old saying of “You can never have too much truck”. Actually you can. I would rather haul my camper on an “overloaded” (wink, wink) F450 pickup than an F550 that is sprung to carry 2-3 times as much weight. Lightly loading a heavy truck like that is what ends up making a Link air ride system look good.

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PA12DRVR

Back in God's Country

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Posted: 12/30/19 06:27pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

"This may sound like heresy to some, but I don’t agree with the old saying of “You can never have too much truck”. Actually you can. I would rather haul my camper on an “overloaded” (wink, wink) F450 pickup than an F550 that is sprung to carry 2-3 times as much weight. Lightly loading a heavy truck like that is what ends up making a Link air ride system look good."

I max out my F550 with either dirt or boulders about twice a year...and for about a month I carry enough sand / equipment on it to have a decent ride. Other than that, the ride will beat you to pieces. If I had to do it over again, I'd probably end up with the same setup, but would have to look long and hard at the 450 pickup model.


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blofgren

Surrey, B.C.

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Posted: 12/31/19 10:35am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I would go for the F450 for sure over the F350 for the minimal price difference. Anyone know the difference in fuel economy between the two?


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Grit dog

Black Diamond, WA

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Posted: 12/31/19 12:10pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

^Agree, a very stout combo if it’s needed.
I’d expect mileage to be only slightly worse due to the rotational effort required for the bit heavier wheels, but I’d expect the 10 speed to make up for the 4.30s easily.

philh

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Posted: 12/31/19 02:48pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

blofgren wrote:

I would go for the F450 for sure over the F350 for the minimal price difference. Anyone know the difference in fuel economy between the two?

Since the mileage numbers are not published, we won't know...

Same engine and trans, essentially same body. I would bet the numbers are exactly the same.

carringb

Corvallis, OR

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Posted: 12/31/19 03:04pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

With the deeper 4.30 gears in the F450 it'll probably burn a little more fuel solo on the highway, but be the same when loaded. Under very heavy loading the 450 will probably use less fuel.


Bryan

2000 Ford E450 V10 VAN! 450,000+ miles
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NRALIFR

Truck Camping Out West

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Posted: 12/31/19 04:06pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Well, if it means anything, the overall lifetime average mpg on my 2016 is 10.6. The TC is on the truck about 98% of the time. Sometimes it’s higher when the truck isn’t working hard, sometimes it’s lower when it’s in regen and/or working hard. Best and worst mpg numbers are interesting to observe, but overall average mpg is what I keep track of. I also keep track of the miles between regens.

On the interstate we’re usually doing 65-70 mph (~2500 rpm). It can do that all day, and the ride is great, the cab is quiet, and the engine never sounds like it’s wound too high.

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