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 > Canada/US Border still shut...

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dedmiston

The West

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Posted: 05/24/20 08:49pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Grit dog wrote:

WTH does the border being closed due to the Rona have to do with pepper spray?


Did you read the entire thread?


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lakeside013104

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Posted: 05/25/20 03:02am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Grit dog wrote:

dodge guy wrote:



Maybe it’s because of how they are doing their testing? Canada’s health care is completely different than ours. So they don’t need to pad the numbers for $$$$$.


Bingo!


Just what I have thought about this situation for some time now.

Go figure.

Lakeside

lakeside013104

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Posted: 05/25/20 03:30am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

JaxDad wrote:

I know a couple of border agents on both sides of the border

I asked about that very concept of multiple terms meaning the same thing being used in multiple questions. I was fascinated by the answer. It turns out tha style of questioning was developed by behavioural scientists.

Having asked the same question 1,000 or perhaps 10,000 times, one gets the feel of what a 'normal' answer is. Some answers to questions asked are so far from what is considered 'normal' answers, the hairs on the back of your neck will stand up, thus causing further inspection of the person.

The first reason is they use certain questions more to gauge our reactions to them than because they want a certain answer. Questions like “Do you have any guns, knives, hand grenades or bazookas?” Will illicit a laugh from honest innocent people because they take it as a joke. But a nervous criminal with a guilty conscience may react very differently.

The second reason though made me really wonder. I was told II would be surprised at how many people say “no” to guns and a subsequent search turns up a rifle or shotgun and the people say “you only asked about guns, not rifles”. By using every possible term a sharp lawyer can’t later say ‘my client just didn’t understand the question’.


Yes or no questions are not designed to get accurate answers, but they do give openings to ask further questions.

"Got any 'guns' today Sir?" NO

"How many firearms in this vehicle today, Sir?" Oh, I don't have any firearms.

"What is the purpose you are traveling with firearms today, Sir?" Oh, I was going hunting in Texas, etc.

Getting more than a one word answers allows the Officer more time to detect any illicit responses if there are any. Asking the same general question in different manners allows the Officer time to form a decision whether to 'release' or 'refer' the subject.

Interesting post.

Lakeside


JaxDad

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Posted: 05/25/20 05:59am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

lakeside013104 wrote:

JaxDad wrote:

I know a couple of border agents on both sides of the border

I asked about that very concept of multiple terms meaning the same thing being used in multiple questions. I was fascinated by the answer. It turns out tha style of questioning was developed by behavioural scientists.

Having asked the same question 1,000 or perhaps 10,000 times, one gets the feel of what a 'normal' answer is. Some answers to questions asked are so far from what is considered 'normal' answers, the hairs on the back of your neck will stand up, thus causing further inspection of the person.

The first reason is they use certain questions more to gauge our reactions to them than because they want a certain answer. Questions like “Do you have any guns, knives, hand grenades or bazookas?” Will illicit a laugh from honest innocent people because they take it as a joke. But a nervous criminal with a guilty conscience may react very differently.

The second reason though made me really wonder. I was told II would be surprised at how many people say “no” to guns and a subsequent search turns up a rifle or shotgun and the people say “you only asked about guns, not rifles”. By using every possible term a sharp lawyer can’t later say ‘my client just didn’t understand the question’.


Yes or no questions are not designed to get accurate answers, but they do give openings to ask further questions.

"Got any 'guns' today Sir?" NO

"How many firearms in this vehicle today, Sir?" Oh, I don't have any firearms.

"What is the purpose you are traveling with firearms today, Sir?" Oh, I was going hunting in Texas, etc.

Getting more than a one word answers allows the Officer more time to detect any illicit responses if there are any. Asking the same general question in different manners allows the Officer time to form a decision whether to 'release' or 'refer' the subject.

Interesting post.

Lakeside


Incorrect.

You seem to have missed my comment following the portion you highlighted. “ The first reason is they use certain questions more to gauge our reactions to them than because they want a certain answer.”.

You don’t have to say even that one single word for a trained observer to get a read on you based on your physical reaction to the question itself.

Grit dog

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Posted: 05/25/20 10:25am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

dedmiston wrote:

Grit dog wrote:

WTH does the border being closed due to the Rona have to do with pepper spray?


Did you read the entire thread?


Did you answer a question with a question? Lol


"Yes Sir, Oct 10 1888, Those poor school children froze to death in their tracks. They did not even find them until Spring. Especially hard hit were the ones who had to trek uphill to school both ways, with no shoes." -Bert A.

Alan_Hepburn

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Posted: 05/25/20 12:31pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

The last time we crossed the border I had the Canadian Customs guy chuckling - we asked the usual questions about firearms, then asked what firearms I had at home: so I started listing off my collection: a Brown Bess flintlock pistol in .72 caliber; a Kentucky caplock rifle in .45 caliber; an 1851 Navy Colt pistol in .36 caliber - he stopped me and said he's never had someone with a collection like that before, laughed and waved us through!


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lakeside013104

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Posted: 05/25/20 03:52pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

JaxDad wrote:

lakeside013104 wrote:

JaxDad wrote:

I know a couple of border agents on both sides of the border

I asked about that very concept of multiple terms meaning the same thing being used in multiple questions. I was fascinated by the answer. It turns out tha style of questioning was developed by behavioural scientists.

Having asked the same question 1,000 or perhaps 10,000 times, one gets the feel of what a 'normal' answer is. Some answers to questions asked are so far from what is considered 'normal' answers, the hairs on the back of your neck will stand up, thus causing further inspection of the person.

The first reason is they use certain questions more to gauge our reactions to them than because they want a certain answer. Questions like “Do you have any guns, knives, hand grenades or bazookas?” Will illicit a laugh from honest innocent people because they take it as a joke. But a nervous criminal with a guilty conscience may react very differently.

The second reason though made me really wonder. I was told II would be surprised at how many people say “no” to guns and a subsequent search turns up a rifle or shotgun and the people say “you only asked about guns, not rifles”. By using every possible term a sharp lawyer can’t later say ‘my client just didn’t understand the question’.


Yes or no questions are not designed to get accurate answers, but they do give openings to ask further questions.

"Got any 'guns' today Sir?" NO

"How many firearms in this vehicle today, Sir?" Oh, I don't have any firearms.

"What is the purpose you are traveling with firearms today, Sir?" Oh, I was going hunting in Texas, etc.

Getting more than a one word answers allows the Officer more time to detect any illicit responses if there are any. Asking the same general question in different manners allows the Officer time to form a decision whether to 'release' or 'refer' the subject.

Interesting post.

Lakeside


Incorrect.

You seem to have missed my comment following the portion you highlighted. “ The first reason is they use certain questions more to gauge our reactions to them than because they want a certain answer.”.

You don’t have to say even that one single word for a trained observer to get a read on you based on your physical reaction to the question itself.


Your information is very good and I did not miss the part you wrote about gauging reactions. Body language or the lack of normal body language is very important, but please allow me to add to it:

A good investigator / interrogator uses the body language along with revealing, often open ended questions. The totality of the circumstances, both body language and answers given help the Officer make an informed decision.

I meant no criticism about your statement. I only wanted to add to and give a different slant on this topic.

Respectfully,

Lakeside

JaxDad

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Posted: 05/25/20 06:11pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

lakeside013104 wrote:

JaxDad wrote:

lakeside013104 wrote:

JaxDad wrote:

I know a couple of border agents on both sides of the border

I asked about that very concept of multiple terms meaning the same thing being used in multiple questions. I was fascinated by the answer. It turns out tha style of questioning was developed by behavioural scientists.

Having asked the same question 1,000 or perhaps 10,000 times, one gets the feel of what a 'normal' answer is. Some answers to questions asked are so far from what is considered 'normal' answers, the hairs on the back of your neck will stand up, thus causing further inspection of the person.

The first reason is they use certain questions more to gauge our reactions to them than because they want a certain answer. Questions like “Do you have any guns, knives, hand grenades or bazookas?” Will illicit a laugh from honest innocent people because they take it as a joke. But a nervous criminal with a guilty conscience may react very differently.

The second reason though made me really wonder. I was told II would be surprised at how many people say “no” to guns and a subsequent search turns up a rifle or shotgun and the people say “you only asked about guns, not rifles”. By using every possible term a sharp lawyer can’t later say ‘my client just didn’t understand the question’.


Yes or no questions are not designed to get accurate answers, but they do give openings to ask further questions.

"Got any 'guns' today Sir?" NO

"How many firearms in this vehicle today, Sir?" Oh, I don't have any firearms.

"What is the purpose you are traveling with firearms today, Sir?" Oh, I was going hunting in Texas, etc.

Getting more than a one word answers allows the Officer more time to detect any illicit responses if there are any. Asking the same general question in different manners allows the Officer time to form a decision whether to 'release' or 'refer' the subject.

Interesting post.

Lakeside


Incorrect.

You seem to have missed my comment following the portion you highlighted. “ The first reason is they use certain questions more to gauge our reactions to them than because they want a certain answer.”.

You don’t have to say even that one single word for a trained observer to get a read on you based on your physical reaction to the question itself.


Your information is very good and I did not miss the part you wrote about gauging reactions. Body language or the lack of normal body language is very important, but please allow me to add to it:

A good investigator / interrogator uses the body language along with revealing, often open ended questions. The totality of the circumstances, both body language and answers given help the Officer make an informed decision.

I meant no criticism about your statement. I only wanted to add to and give a different slant on this topic.

Respectfully,

Lakeside


Ok, understood. I hope you had a safe happy Memorial Day with those that matter in your life.

lakeside013104

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Posted: 05/26/20 02:55am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

JaxDad wrote:

Ok, understood. I hope you had a safe happy Memorial Day with those that matter in your life.


10-4 on that and right back at you.

Best of what life has to offer to you and yours.

Lakeside

campigloo

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Posted: 05/26/20 03:09pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Grit dog wrote:

spoon059 wrote:




The overwhelming majority of people that are wearing masks have a very false sense of confidence in the ability of the mask to protect them,


You win the grand prize today too!
It's the most amazing unintended social experiment, this Covid thing, that I've ever seen.

Good to see some folk with common sense and intelligence. Thank you for posting your whole post.


Always practice social conditioning. At this rate we may need it sooner than later; unfortunately.

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