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 > Ford running out of diesel engines

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Groover

Pulaski, TN

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Posted: 07/10/20 07:50am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Production of the Powerstroke is down 50% due to Covid in Mexico.

Mexico issues

This could help explain the news on the F600.

theoldwizard1

SE MI

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Posted: 07/10/20 09:10am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Groover wrote:

Production of the Powerstroke is down 50% due to Covid in Mexico.

Mexico issues

This could help explain the news on the F600.

Personally, I think demand for the Powerstoke is going to drop off now that the new 7.3L gas and 10 speed are available, especially fleet buyers.

Diesels only make sense if you are carrying a very heavy load AND you are driving >50,000 miles/year. The initial cost and maintenance really hurt the "total cost of ownership". In my area diesel cost more than gasoline and you still have to buy DEF.

Cummins12V98

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Posted: 07/10/20 09:32am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Sounds like they need to go back to the Cummins for the 650 and up.


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Grit dog

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Posted: 07/10/20 10:58am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

theoldwizard1 wrote:

Groover wrote:

Production of the Powerstroke is down 50% due to Covid in Mexico.

Mexico issues

This could help explain the news on the F600.

Personally, I think demand for the Powerstoke is going to drop off now that the new 7.3L gas and 10 speed are available, especially fleet buyers.

Diesels only make sense if you are carrying a very heavy load AND you are driving >50,000 miles/year. The initial cost and maintenance really hurt the "total cost of ownership". In my area diesel cost more than gasoline and you still have to buy DEF.


Haha, not, they're still apples and oranges.
Taking nothing away from the new 7.3 gasser, it's a nice setup, but totally not earth shattering. I've had production cars with the same or more power for over 10 years. It's just a little bump up from "last years" model, figuratively speaking.
Now, come up with a big forced induction gasser that can close the gap some more and that may steal diesel sales....but the mfgs would have to stuff dual 40 gal saddle tanks in them to make it from gas station to gas station!


"Yes Sir, Oct 10 1888, Those poor school children froze to death in their tracks. They did not even find them until Spring. Especially hard hit were the ones who had to trek uphill to school both ways, with no shoes." -Bert A.

ShinerBock

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Posted: 07/10/20 12:28pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I don't think this has much to do with not offering it in the F600. The medium/heavy duty market is very cyclical meaning you generally have a several years where you can't build enough trucks followed by a few years where they just sit on the lot. Regardless of how backed up we are, we still at least offer all engines and products on the truck specs even if they are not currently available and build date is over a year out. We would leave it up to the customer on whether they wanted to wait or go with another option that put the build date sooner. The only reason why we would not offer something to be ordered from a year model is if it has some sort of block on it due to a safety recall, not yet certified, and so on.

wanderingbob

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Posted: 07/10/20 01:04pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Initial cost sounds like a big deal until you go to sell your used diesel , A five year old diesel will bring you back $4500 or 5,000 more when you go to sell .

Kampfirekid

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Posted: 07/10/20 10:10pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

wanderingbob wrote:

Initial cost sounds like a big deal until you go to sell your used diesel , A five year old diesel will bring you back $4500 or 5,000 more when you go to sell .


That’s great! You spent $10k on the diesel motor in the first place. Now you’re only $5,000 to $5,500 in the hole. [emoticon]

I’ve only logged about 2.75 million miles, mostly in Ford Powerstrokes, and with today’s prices and poor fuel economy, there is no way a diesel will pay for itself or return money to offset the costs over any gas counterpart unless you tow heavy daily.

For fun, i’m trying a 3.0L Stroke in an F150. I basically pulled a deal to get the truck where the Diesel engine was a pittance over the EcoBoost. At 25-28mpg, and diesel costing a solid 25 cents a gallon less than gas here, I’m not losing money, but I can’t say I’m laughing all the way to the bank... even at 40k+ miles a year (average, pre-Covid).

* This post was edited 07/10/20 10:20pm by Kampfirekid *


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Me Again

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Posted: 07/10/20 11:04pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Well there is more than going up a hill with a load and a diesel, although they do that easily. With a diesel exhaust brake they come down a hill better than any gasser will do in tow/haul and engine compression. Also to build a gas engine that approaches the reliability of a diesel is going to close that price difference somewhat. And the gasser is going require expensive smog control features. The advent of the V10's was for smaller displacement per cylinder to help control smog.


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Huntindog

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Posted: 07/11/20 04:05am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Kampfirekid wrote:

wanderingbob wrote:

Initial cost sounds like a big deal until you go to sell your used diesel , A five year old diesel will bring you back $4500 or 5,000 more when you go to sell .


That’s great! You spent $10k on the diesel motor in the first place. Now you’re only $5,000 to $5,500 in the hole. [emoticon]

I’ve only logged about 2.75 million miles, mostly in Ford Powerstrokes, and with today’s prices and poor fuel economy, there is no way a diesel will pay for itself or return money to offset the costs over any gas counterpart unless you tow heavy daily.

For fun, i’m trying a 3.0L Stroke in an F150. I basically pulled a deal to get the truck where the Diesel engine was a pittance over the EcoBoost. At 25-28mpg, and diesel costing a solid 25 cents a gallon less than gas here, I’m not losing money, but I can’t say I’m laughing all the way to the bank... even at 40k+ miles a year (average, pre-Covid).
What is your definition of 'tow heavy"?

Last time I checked, no gas motor was rated to tow as much as a diesel..... And I am not talking about a few hundred pounds..... It ain't even close.



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patperry2766

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Posted: 07/11/20 05:39am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Huntindog wrote:

Kampfirekid wrote:

wanderingbob wrote:

Initial cost sounds like a big deal until you go to sell your used diesel , A five year old diesel will bring you back $4500 or 5,000 more when you go to sell .


That’s great! You spent $10k on the diesel motor in the first place. Now you’re only $5,000 to $5,500 in the hole. [emoticon]

I’ve only logged about 2.75 million miles, mostly in Ford Powerstrokes, and with today’s prices and poor fuel economy, there is no way a diesel will pay for itself or return money to offset the costs over any gas counterpart unless you tow heavy daily.

For fun, i’m trying a 3.0L Stroke in an F150. I basically pulled a deal to get the truck where the Diesel engine was a pittance over the EcoBoost. At 25-28mpg, and diesel costing a solid 25 cents a gallon less than gas here, I’m not losing money, but I can’t say I’m laughing all the way to the bank... even at 40k+ miles a year (average, pre-Covid).
What is your definition of 'tow heavy"?

Last time I checked, no gas motor was rated to tow as much as a diesel..... And I am not talking about a few hundred pounds..... It ain't even close.


There is roughly a 1500 lb difference trailer weight wise between a 6.4 Hemi with a 4.10 and a 6.7 CTD with 3.42's per the 2018 info that I have.

The getting more back at trade in time...duh. No brainer, you dropped 7-9K more for an engine, what do you expect? Diesels will be preferred but that in no way means that a good, clean gasser is gonna sit on a used car lot forever like a bastard stepchild.

Since I bought my truck 15 months ago, this is the first time that diesel prices have been the same/lower than gas. Typically it's been .25-.40 cents more so that eats up most of the potential savings of better diesel MPG.

Oil changes are 2x gas. Fuel/water filters need to be changed out at $100 a pop with me buying the parts off Amazon and doing the work myself. Have changed out 2 sets already with 35K on the vehicle. $300 at the dealership.

I have an `18 CTD CC 4x4. Bought in 5/2019 so at the time Ram was offering stupidly incredible rebates/dealer discounts to get prior year stuff off the lot. Didn't want a 4x4 and would have preferred gas, but I walked out with my current truck for less than what a comparable gas 1/2T would cost.

Would I do it again? At this point in my life with my current needs and without the significant dealer discounts...NO. A gasser would serve my needs just as well and you CAN buy an EPA approved in bed gasoline transfer tank, just as you can for a diesel so you won't be having to stop at every gas station along the way.

Do I love the truck and glad that I do have it....absolutely.


Courage is the feeling you have right before you fully understand the situation

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