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 > New camper coming has nitrogen filled tires

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Thermoguy

Graham, WA

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Posted: 07/17/20 01:37pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

philh wrote:

Thermoguy wrote:

Actually I think Nitrogen is a benefit. n.

Nitrogen doesn't expand and contract as much as typical air from a compressor due to moisture, so, when your tires get hot, the Nitrogen tire does not expand as much, or have as much of a pressure change.

Horsepucky.

Automotive tires don't get hot enough for moisture to have any impact tire pressure.

You'd have to get the AIR temperature inside the tire above 212F before moisture has an impact. At 212F, you're in deep doodoo already.


Horsepucky - I like that...

But, my experience is with a car that has had 2 sets of tires, one with nitrogen and one without. I got better performance and longer life out of the tires with nitrogen - both the same tire by the way. I was surprised how much less mileage I got after replacing the stock tires with the same tire as the OEM (Michelin) , also had one that had a constant leak no one could fix. Now, new tires from Costco - different tire but filled with nitrogen at no cost.

I'm not sure that it would matter on a trailer tire. I certainly would not seek it out for a trailer. But with a low profile performance tire, I think it is worth the effort and even worth a few bucks.

But, that's just from my experience, your's may be different.

dodge guy

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Posted: 07/17/20 02:00pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Huntindog wrote:

dodge guy wrote:

wanderingbob wrote:

Think about it , it would be near impossible to purge a tire on a rim , could not be done even with a vacumn pump .So your empty tire is sitting there 100 per cent full of air , then they add a little nitrogen to bring it up to pressure . And then charge you or not !


Actually at the least shop I worked at we had a Nitrogen machine for filling tires. You filled them with regular air to seat the bead. Then used the machines vacuum function to suck all the air out. It would collapse the tire. Then you filled it with pure Nitrogen. Done properly it works. But for everyday use it’s unnecessary.
I think that bead lock rims would be required to keep the bead from unseating when suctioning.
There may be some tires with very stout construction where it might work..... As for collapsing the tire.... That probably isn't good for it.

Now if you were to use nitrogen to seat the bead, and then let most of it escape, then refill it with nitrogen.... That may get it close to 100%


You would think so. And so did I. But after the first set of tires I did I never worried about one coming off the bead. Standard wheels have a small lip in the inside of the rim that keeps the tire from unseating. Once it’s seated it takes a blowout to unseat. And even at that sometimes they stay on.


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wanderingbob

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Posted: 07/17/20 06:20pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

The real problem with putting nitrogen in tires or anything is it unbalances the rest of the environment . Some times when I take a breath the ratio of oxy to nitrogen is out of balance and I think I have caught Covid 19 or the plague or sumptin . Please mark your vehicle that is got nitrogen and I will social distance . Seventy years ago I could run several miles and not get out of breath, now I get out of breath pushing the button on my lift chair . And it is all yus guys stealing nitrogen outta my air .

philh

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Posted: 07/17/20 06:29pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Thermoguy wrote:

also had one that had a constant leak no one could fix. Now, new tires from Costco - different tire but filled with nitrogen at no cost.

Why didn't you replace air with N2 in the leaking tire?

rbpru

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Posted: 07/17/20 10:00pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Fill your tires with nitrogen if it makes you happy. It is only money.

It seems to me air has a good track record with tires over the last 100 years or so. [emoticon] [emoticon]


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Huntindog

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Posted: 07/18/20 03:57am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Thermoguy wrote:

Huntindog wrote:

An often mentioned benefit is that nitrogen molocules are larger than oxygen.... So it does not leak thru the pores of the tire as fast.... probably true but..... Regular air is about 68% nitrogen, so according to this theory every time air is added to the tire the nitrogen % should increase.... IOW, even those that do not initailly have their tires filled with nitrogen soon end up with close to the same percntage as those that do! In short; their is very little benefit to having this done. Especially if one takes into account that the nitrogen filled tires are never 100% filled with nitrogen! That would require suctioning out all of the air before adding the nitrogen.... Which is impossible.


Just Curious - how often are you adding air to your tires? I can go years and never add air. If you are adding air regularly, you might have a different issue you should look into.
Once a year. In the spring when the temps are cooler here in Phoenix. As the temps go up into the summer, the pressure rise that goes along with the temp rise offsets the natural pressure loss that ALL tires experience.

The main difference I have seen is that since I switched to LTs in 2006, is that I get to add air several times to my tires as they now last long enough for me to do so.... When I ran STs, my tires generally lost pressure suddenly and were unable to be topped off. This always happened before their second birthday. So my ST tires never got a very high percentage of nitrogen in them.

Do you think that may have been the reason they failed?[emoticon]



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CapriRacer

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Posted: 07/18/20 05:47am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Thermoguy wrote:

....Nitrogen doesn't expand and contract as much as typical air from a compressor due to moisture ......


Sorry, but ALL gases behave pretty close to the Ideal Gas Law: PV = nRT. That is, they build up pressure when they heat up. That includes nitrogen and water vapor!

The only exception is when you have liquid water in the tire - and even then, it eventually disappears (migrates outside the tire due to the Law of Partial Pressure of Gases.)


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tomman58

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Posted: 07/18/20 07:01am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Huntindog wrote:

Thermoguy wrote:

Huntindog wrote:

An often mentioned benefit is that nitrogen molocules are larger than oxygen.... So it does not leak thru the pores of the tire as fast.... probably true but..... Regular air is about 68% nitrogen, so according to this theory every time air is added to the tire the nitrogen % should increase.... IOW, even those that do not initailly have their tires filled with nitrogen soon end up with close to the same percntage as those that do! In short; their is very little benefit to having this done. Especially if one takes into account that the nitrogen filled tires are never 100% filled with nitrogen! That would require suctioning out all of the air before adding the nitrogen.... Which is impossible.


Just Curious - how often are you adding air to your tires? I can go years and never add air. If you are adding air regularly, you might have a different issue you should look into.
Once a year. In the spring when the temps are cooler here in Phoenix. As the temps go up into the summer, the pressure rise that goes along with the temp rise offsets the natural pressure loss that ALL tires experience.

The main difference I have seen is that since I switched to LTs in 2006, is that I get to add air several times to my tires as they now last long enough for me to do so.... When I ran STs, my tires generally lost pressure suddenly and were unable to be topped off. This always happened before their second birthday. So my ST tires never got a very high percentage of nitrogen in them.

Do you think that may have been the reason they failed?[emoticon]


I have always needed air every say 3 months. Maybe only 5 or 8 pounds but still. It might have something to do with weight and temperature swings. The air needed thing has occurred on all my trailers and tires except this one with nitrogen, but after 2 years I add a couple of pounds when going out.


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GrandpaKip

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Posted: 07/18/20 07:37am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

wanderingbob wrote:

The real problem with putting nitrogen in tires or anything is it unbalances the rest of the environment . Some times when I take a breath the ratio of oxy to nitrogen is out of balance and I think I have caught Covid 19 or the plague or sumptin . Please mark your vehicle that is got nitrogen and I will social distance . Seventy years ago I could run several miles and not get out of breath, now I get out of breath pushing the button on my lift chair . And it is all yus guys stealing nitrogen outta my air .

I think you might be on to something here. I’ve noticed the same thing.


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st clair

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Posted: 07/18/20 11:52am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Nitrogen as mentioned before, is used because it will not expand like ambient air when heated. On a trailer that experiences a lot of sidewall flex this will keep the tire psi from increasing, which makes the ride harsher. Trailers typically have terrible suspension, very little travel, so the tire is a big part of the suspension system.
On RV's that are carrying a lot of weight a tire can heat up a lot and I have seen psi regularly go from 80 to 140. With Nitrogen this jump would be much less. I have seen tires blow up due to the increased psi, and a 140 psi tire blowing up will do some damage for sure.
As tires age, even before their 6 year due date, they tolerate changes in psi less and less.

I am not advocating using N, but this is a real benefit.

Racing uses it and they use nitrogen in their air shocks for the same reason. Shocks get very hot when used, so the N will keep psi more stable.

For campers it is a bit overkill, but if I had a choice I would take N every time, so leave it in there as long as possible

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