Good Sam Club Open Roads Forum: Around the Campfire: Texas winterizing...
Open Roads Forum Already a member? Login here.   If not, Register Today!  |  Help

Newest  |  Active  |  Popular  |  RVing FAQ Forum Rules  |  Forum Posting Help and Support  |  Contact  

Search:   Advanced Search

Search only in Around the Campfire

Open Roads Forum  >  Around the Campfire  >  General Topics

 > Texas winterizing...

Reply to Topic  |  Subscribe  |  Print Topic  |  Post New Topic  | 
Page of 6  
Prev  |  Next
JRscooby

Indepmo

Senior Member

Joined: 06/10/2019

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 02/23/21 04:06pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

STATE? "No, I take no responsibility at all" says the one that claimed his predecessor was responsible for everything.

* This post was last edited 02/25/21 10:43am by an administrator/moderator *   View edit history

wa8yxm

Davison Michigan (East of Flint)

Senior Member

Joined: 07/04/2006

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 02/23/21 04:20pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

cougar28 wrote:

I don't understand why all the house flooding because of busted water lines. Do people not think anymore.


You and I, especially as we are RVers but in my case due to growing up on a dairy farm. Know that pipes can freeze and multiple ways to prevent it from happening.

Sadly that makes US special... Many have no clue and simply do not know how to let water flow (Works only for a short dip in degrees) or blow out the lines (Get rid of the water,,, If the air freezes don't worry about it).

Nobody ever taught them about busted pipes.


Home was where I park it. but alas the.
2005 Damon Intruder 377 Alas declared a total loss
after a semi "nicked" it. Still have the radios
Kenwood TS-2000, ICOM ID-5100, ID-51A+2, ID-880 REF030C most times


BCSnob

Middletown, MD

Senior Member

Joined: 02/23/2002

View Profile



Posted: 02/25/21 10:16am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

BCSnob wrote:

Who is at fault here; the ones who offered these plans or those who purchased them?


Texas Lt Governor says it’s the consumers fault for their high power bills.
Link

Yosemite Sam1

Under the pines.

Senior Member

Joined: 03/28/2018

View Profile



Good Sam RV Club Member

Offline
Posted: 02/25/21 10:19am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

And kids and senior dying -- and people getting hungry?

I remember this "Let 'em die!" and "You are on your own!" slogans.

Can they at least throw some compassion and paper towels to dry the tears for these suffering Texans?

* This post was edited 02/25/21 10:40am by an administrator/moderator *

Fizz

Ottawa, Canada

Senior Member

Joined: 07/28/2003

View Profile



Posted: 02/25/21 10:32am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

We wintered twice in the Florida panhandle.
Both winters had a period of frost.
Every radio, TV station kept warning folks of the the 3 P's

PETS
PLANTS
PIPES

For a lot of people today if it's not Tweeted or on Facebook it doesn't exist.

MEXICOWANDERER

las peñas, michoacan, mexico

Senior Member

Joined: 06/01/2007

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 02/25/21 12:04pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

My experience
California 1987
At a friend's machine shop reading a six color pamphlet hawking upcoming deregulated power.

I couldn't believe what I was reading. The gyppo company was offering tiered rates at "current market rates" The Market Rates would be released from Oversight by the California Utilities Commission. In other words "wide-open-no ceiling".

People do not spend millions of dollars in advertising to lose money. I knew from corresponding costs of utility power from the Pacific Intertie that the current public power kWh price that public price was a little fat but not predatory.

So how was TARLICK ENERGY going to buy power from current suppliers (Then Diablo Canyon and SMUD's nuclear plants were under intense pressure to close), and the Pacific Intertie, and render its investors a profit?

Like today's PG&E morph, it didn't fit. It couldn't fit. It was a con. A blatant Ponzi Scheme with retail consumers clutching their ankles.

In 1989, 22 years ago, it all fermented. Power costs increased 5000% during the winter. Misery was widespread but short-lived due to California's propensity for liberal government control.

Since then demand digital meters have boosted non-constant kWh consumption. Hobby garage enthusiasts found out the hard way that striking an arc or starting a one horsepower split phase motor raises kWh price (sometimes) dramatically. The premium price tag lasts for hours and hours so all power may incur a 150% premium. Power companies argue the premium is justified. Grids and distribution must be designed and maintained for worst case (California not Texas).

A year or so ago, I was amused when Comision Federal de Electricidad, tried soliciting new digital demand meter replacement in residential areas under the overt guise of "Super Modern and Precise". The change would be voluntary not mandated for existing meters. New construction or upgrades from existing 30-amp 127 volt service drops means getting a demand meter. Commercial businesses who MUST provide their own 3 phase transformers were not given an option. Mechanical meters are a thing of the past.

Mere use of a refrigerator, boosts expenses into the next tier of kWh calculation. The posted price of power remains unchanged due to political ramifications down here. But total consumption is warped. I have an incredibly expensive 3-phase power analyzer in Michoacan. I connected it to MY POWER but because of branch circuits it was visible from the service drop.

CFE saw it. An automobile came and CFE threatened to sever my power even though the device is 100% inductive. No disconnections on MY service. UNAUTHORIZED DEVICE they pronounced.

They couldn't care less that the analyzer showed less than 04% total kWh error between their meter and my equipment. This was "peeping-tom" insulting.

But when I checked several 30-amp 127-volt services with demand meters I found that incidental surges "Refrigerator starts" boosted demand meter consumption by 17% and it did not return to base price for hours. Mexican homes in my community are incredibly basic. Refrigerators and fans comprise the largest consumption percentage. CFE refused to take back the digital meters claiming they had no inventory and old meters had to be recalibrated which would be an impossibility.

I do not know because I do not and did not follow the history of deregulation in Texas. But it is a wealthy well-educated state. For the public to claim ignorance of the working demonstration of unbridled deregulation in California is to me, both depressing and amazing. No public outcry? Not a squeak? No complaints about 100,000 words in No .5 font detailing what they were signing up for? Not one whisper? Sheeple?

Would you enter into a contract for an automobile or mortgage that clearly stated "APR subject to current market rates?" Vulnerable mentalities rejoice when they learn the "Market Value" of their home zoomed without giving thought to open-ticket threat of property tax rate increases.

Young people who rejoice today at low-cost electrical car fuel costs, haven't a clue. It's bait. Fossil fuel costs are largely market driven. There is no true market force for the cost of electricity. If you argue go back to the beginning of this article. With vanished petroleum energy alternative, cost for home energy becomes legislated. Principal cost for industry and agriculture become 100% legislated.

Points to ponder.

Yosemite Sam1

Under the pines.

Senior Member

Joined: 03/28/2018

View Profile



Good Sam RV Club Member

Offline
Posted: 03/02/21 01:20pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

The full horror of what happened in Texas is starting to come out.

The most tragic are those kids and seniors freezing to death.

And the impact of a deregulated utilities (they are meant to provide public service, duh!).

Hopefully the people of Texas and their leadership have learned their lessons this time -- well, it's called crazy when they kept on repeating the same mistakes and insisting on it when it proven it failed several times in the past.

Just advised a techie son to refuse the offer of a job and relocation in Austin after what happened.

sayoung

Tx

Senior Member

Joined: 09/17/2012

View Profile



Good Sam RV Club Member

Offline
Posted: 03/02/21 03:51pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

My electricity or natural gas had absolutely NO interruption. Y'all explain how to plan for temps as much as 63 d F below avg & make it reliable at 105 or hotter which we have more warm days than any cold ones . I've been running my AC for nearly a week now.

* This post was edited 03/02/21 04:02pm by an administrator/moderator *

BCSnob

Middletown, MD

Senior Member

Joined: 02/23/2002

View Profile



Posted: 03/02/21 04:33pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

sayoung wrote:

My electricity or natural gas had absolutely NO interruption. Y'all explain how to plan for temps as much as 63 d F below avg & make it reliable at 105 or hotter which we have more warm days than any cold ones . I've been running my AC for nearly a week now.

It seems the industry knew how to winterize the Texas power plants after the 2011 freeze. Here is an industry article from 2014 on how to winterize.

Prepare Your Gas Plant for Cold Weather Operations

This quote from the 2014 article was proven to be overly optimistic.

Quote:

ERCOT Makes Preparations
The next unexpected cold weather blast should mean less bad news for ERCOT generators, because in ERCOT, and all NERC regions, winter preparation planning is now a regulatory requirement. Winter preparation surveys must be completed by generators, as are emergency operations and resource weatherization plans. Generators must submit their severe weather preparation plans by affidavit.

ERCOT also performs spot reviews of generator plans, makes site visits to verify plans, and conducts unannounced black start unit testing. The surveys include information on backup fuels available and how long a unit can operate on the backup fuel. This is an important consideration, as 89 of the 130 units with dual-fuel capability experienced a trip, failure to start, or derate during the February 2011 severe weather event. Only four units successfully switched to backup fuels. The surveys also must identify primary and alternate gas pipeline fuel supplies. Finally, the surveys require generators to estimate derating and forced outage rate based on two extreme temperature scenarios.


MEXICOWANDERER

las peñas, michoacan, mexico

Senior Member

Joined: 06/01/2007

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 03/02/21 06:12pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Texas was a multiplex cascade failure. That is what engineers are for. Direct them to design and implement a grid interconnect for a specified environment. Multiple NG plants studded throughout the system can bear quite a load if industry has a plan for load shedding. One does not run to a NG plant turn the key and start it up. It allows for boilers turbines and cooling towers to warm up. Many of these functions can be automated. Cost of this is borne as recurrent operations.

I cannot see where California would not incur the same effect with similar outcome.

Reply to Topic  |  Subscribe  |  Print Topic  |  Post New Topic  | 
Page of 6  
Prev  |  Next

Open Roads Forum  >  Around the Campfire  >  General Topics

 > Texas winterizing...
Search:   Advanced Search

Search only in Around the Campfire


New posts No new posts
Closed, new posts Closed, no new posts
Moved, new posts Moved, no new posts

Adjust text size:




© 2021 CWI, Inc. © 2021 Good Sam Enterprises, LLC. All Rights Reserved.