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curt12914

Bombay NY (5 miles from Quebec, 15 from Ontario)

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Posted: 04/11/21 10:20am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Lowes Deep Cycle Batteries

Check out Lowes for Deka batteries (which in my opinion are one of the best batteries).

I am not going to tell you they are inexpensive, but Lowes has decent prices for Deka batteries.


2021 F-350 Platinum 4X4 PSD SRW 2016 Montana 3950FL (2) Honda EU2000i's
...and a few (twenty-some, but other than my wife, no one is counting) antique Allis Chalmers tractors

Gjac

Milford, CT

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Posted: 04/11/21 10:47am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I bought mine from Sam's Club in 2007 for $74 apiece. They are still going strong after 14 years of dry camping. One thing to be aware of is Sam's and Costco change who they buy from over the years. Mine were either Duracell's or Energizers. I replaced 3 Costco batteries on my cars under warranty and many complain the Costco 6 v GC are dying prematurely. I would stick with Sam's club if they still sell these two batteries brands.

Gdetrailer

PA

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Posted: 04/11/21 11:15am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

kfp673 wrote:

Thanks for all the replies. I have a few responses to comments made throughout these posts.
- To be clear, I am comparing 2 6V vs 2 12 v not a single 12v. I have room for either on my tongue
- The Costco option does not appear to be an option for me. My Costco no longer carries them. Said they can order but when you read on-line the reviews are horrible for that Interstate 6V battery.
- I have not Checked wall-mart or auto parts stores. Where I have found 6V in stock local to me was a battery plus location selling Energizer, a golf cart company selling Trojan, and an interstate store. The price ranges for those 3 locations for a single 6V was $128 for Energizer / Interstate up to $200+ for trojan. NAPA online is $120. I am just not seeing anything below that. I was comparing that to a 90 Ah 12V Interstate for $120 each. This is where I came up with similar AH for similar money with 2 12V . 180 Ah with 12V vs 240Ah with 6V. By the way, we are fine paying a little more, I just wanted to make sure I was not missing something since I read so many posts talking about <$100 6V batteries.
I had my mind set on going with 6V this time around but was just surprised on the prices as I had always head they are cheaper. And, I was very surprised to see such terrible reviews on the Costco website for the Interstate 6V. I do have a tendency to discharge the battery quite far when we boondock, especially if we have to run the furnace, so points made in this thread of deeper discharge might be the important focus point for our situation

Thanks again everyone. I know this topic is beating a dead horse, but it was the Value / Cost angle I wanted to look at here.


One has to be careful reading the reviews.

I toss out all the top reviews AND all of the bottom negative reviews and read the MIDDLE reviews.

Reviews are high subjective and that is a problem, one persons expectation of said item will be far different from someone elses expectation and there a lot of shill reviews on top of that.

Some folks also just abuse things and expect it to survive.. get mad when it doesn't and then writes scathing shill reviews..

YES, $90 GC2 batteries DO EXIST, however, that price may not be "available everywhere". Your not the first person that has showed up on this forum with this same issue.. I am a bit shocked because my closest city which is 20 miles away from me is so far in the dung heap for retail stores it isn't funny.. We operate on a Walmart, Target, Sam's club, a small grocery chain, Home Depot and Lowes, Tractor Supply and a Rural King.. The one large indoor mall that is still existing now has only 30% of its capacity used and those are little "one off" trinket stores..

But, yet, I can walk into my local Sam's club and right on the shelves IS those $90 6V GCs.

I can also walk into my local Rural King and buy their house branded Rural King GC2s for about the same price as the Sam's Club GC2s.

I am having a difficult time wrapping my head around the idea that you live in such a bad place (I didn't think anything could be worse than my area), sounds like you are in rural Vermont (yeah, been there, don't plan to go back, too expensive).. You are sure you live in PA?

Perhaps, broaden your search area and make a "daytrip" to a different Costco or if you know someone with a Sam's membership and are near a Sams club have them pick them up for you..

pianotuna

Regina, SK, Canada

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Posted: 04/11/21 11:16am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

mr_andyj wrote:

I cannot think of a single reason to use two 12 vs 2 6's.


High draw of 200 amps works much better on twin 12 volt batteries. I use a 3000 watt inverter, and I push it hard.


Regards, Don
My ride is a 28 foot Class C, 256 watts solar, soon to have SiO2 batteries, 3000 watt Magnum hybrid inverter, Sola Basic Autoformer, Microair Easy Start.

DrewE

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Posted: 04/11/21 12:24pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

kfp673 wrote:


- I have not Checked wall-mart or auto parts stores. Where I have found 6V in stock local to me was a battery plus location selling Energizer, a golf cart company selling Trojan, and an interstate store. The price ranges for those 3 locations for a single 6V was $128 for Energizer / Interstate up to $200+ for trojan. NAPA online is $120. I am just not seeing anything below that. I was comparing that to a 90 Ah 12V Interstate for $120 each. This is where I came up with similar AH for similar money with 2 12V . 180 Ah with 12V vs 240Ah with 6V. By the way, we are fine paying a little more, I just wanted to make sure I was not missing something since I read so many posts talking about <$100 6V batteries.


A third again more capacity for the same price is not, in my book, "similar Ah for similar money." I suppose it's partly a question of perspective, what similar capacity means.





Gdetrailer

PA

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Posted: 04/11/21 02:03pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

pianotuna wrote:

mr_andyj wrote:

I cannot think of a single reason to use two 12 vs 2 6's.


High draw of 200 amps works much better on twin 12 volt batteries. I use a 3000 watt inverter, and I push it hard.


One of the issues is most folks skimp on the interconnect cables on 6V batteries, using too light of a ga of wire results in a pretty high voltage drop across that interconnect.

If you used standard automotive size cables as interconnects that is where the issue is. Typical automotive cables are 4 ga at best like THESE..

You might find some in 2 ga but 4 ga will be more common.

I used 1/0 wire as an interconnect and I have no issues with heavy startup surge loads from my home fridge conversion on the GC2 batteries even when the batteries are at 50% DOD.

The interconnect cable becomes part of the batteries "internal resistance" and the GC2s often get a bad rap for having a high internal resistance and some of that is most likely from using to low of a ga of interconnecting jumpers.

GC2s are a pretty darn hardy battery, they have to be as they were designed to be used all day on golf courses and that may mean more than 12hrs per day per charge so they tend to get worked extremely hard and deeply discharged but yet stand up to a full "season" of golfers..

philh

Belleville MI

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Posted: 04/11/21 02:49pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

you're only talking a few inches of distance. According to the charts, you don't need anything like 2 or 4g

pianotuna

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Posted: 04/11/21 03:26pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Gdetrailer,

All you have said is correct--but the REAL difference is that two six volts in series have 6 cells and two twelve volts in parallel have 12 cells. So the load per cell is 50% less with a pair of 12 volt cells. There are other factors too.

Boon Docker

Mountain Foothills of Southern Alberta

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Posted: 04/11/21 03:27pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Yes phlih, very minimal resistance. Would be hard to measure. 4g copper wire has a resistance of .284 ohms per 1000 feet.

Gdetrailer

PA

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Posted: 04/12/21 07:50am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

pianotuna wrote:

Gdetrailer,

All you have said is correct--but the REAL difference is that two six volts in series have 6 cells and two twelve volts in parallel have 12 cells. So the load per cell is 50% less with a pair of 12 volt cells. There are other factors too.


Piano, what you state has "some" merit, however with 12V batts to fit 6 cells into the case, you now have to REDUCE the size and amount of grids along with the amount of electrolyte within each cell. Parallel operation also means your interconnects can be lighter since they are only needing to handle half the current.

The big downside to parallel operation is not "everything" is "shared", due to manufacturing and material tolerances the batteries will never "share" the current load 100% equally, resulting in one battery discharging or recharging at a different rate. You can get them close but in the end one battery will be slightly weaker and that weaker one will ultimately kill the other battery by over discharging and undercharging.

The 12V batteries due to thinner and lighter plates are also NOT designed for very deep draw downs, typically rated at only 50% DOD but for max LIFE only 20% of their capacity should be used..

On edit, forgot to mention 12V batteries with smaller and less plates per cell, the internal resistance of each cell goes up.. Yep, in reality the 12V battery jars actually will have a higher internal resistance! You are only getting away with it working since your are paralleling and reducing the OVERALL internal resistance slightly but in doing so you have now limited the max draw down depth of discharge you can use..

GC2 batteries on the other hand with larger and thicker grids are designed from the ground up to handle extremely deep discharges, their life ratings are based on up to 80% capacity being able to be used..

20% usable capacity (12V marine) vs 80% usable capacity (6V GC2 pair) per pound and dollar 6V GC2s basically net you much more usable capacity for the money..

Obviously your situation is a bit different with whatever you are doing with a 3KW load (AC unit?) but in your case, if the internal resistance is bothersome to you, then the fix would be AGM GC2s (extremely low internal resistance)or if you have the room 4 FLA GC2s setup in two series pairs that are paralleled. That combination would give you far more usable capacity than 8 12V group 27 Marine batteries..

For my situation, so far, have never had my inverter shut down or go into alarm during my home fridge startup and that is at a min of 100A surge and by morning the batteries have been drawn down to 50% of capacity.. I don't see any "advantage" to swap to 12V batteries as that would mean I would need to add at least 4 if not 6 more 12V batteries to the mix. That is a lot of money and weight that I am not needing to add to the trailer..

The big key is USABLE capacity for the cost!

* This post was edited 04/12/21 07:57am by Gdetrailer *

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