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 > Europe plans charging network & hydrogen for heavy trucking

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MEXICOWANDERER

las peƱas, michoacan, mexico

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Posted: 04/20/21 01:07am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Working in an oil refinery I saw angry hydrogen and it wasn't pretty. In daylight it burns almost invisible and is difficult to extinguish. Hydrogen atoms are tiny. They demand dense alloy steel to minimize tunneling. Hydrogen lines under high temperature were ridiculously thick. Four inch OD two inch ID and they were forced to be replaced at intervals. That was with high pressure and high temperature.

BB_TX

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Posted: 04/20/21 08:33am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Jarlaxle wrote:

Hydrogen is an energy SINK-actually making is a usable fuel requires more energy than the hydrogen contains. It is also not at all energy-dense (BTU/gallon is about a third that of diesel fuel) and the molecules are so small that it tends to leak out of even sealed tanks.

It also takes a lot of energy to make gasoline and diesel. And they both create pollution when used as a fuel. Hydrogen requires energy to produce, but does not create any pollution when used as a fuel.

From https://afdc.energy.gov/fuels/hydrogen_basics.html

The energy in 2.2 pounds (1 kilogram) of hydrogen gas is about the same as the energy in 1 gallon (6.2 pounds, 2.8 kilograms) of gasoline.

Jarlaxle

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Posted: 04/20/21 09:47am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Yes...but the more important number is energy per VOLUME...where hydrogen fails utterly: it has exactly one-quarter the energy of gasoline (8MJ/L versus 32), and the numbers are even worse when compared to diesel fuel (~38).


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BB_TX

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Posted: 04/20/21 01:27pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Comparing a volume of gas to a volume of liquid is not exactly apples to apple.

Jarlaxle

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Posted: 04/20/21 05:59pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

BB_TX wrote:

Comparing a volume of gas to a volume of liquid is not exactly apples to apple.


That was liquid hydrogen.

JRscooby

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Posted: 04/21/21 05:02am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I think you might be indirectly pointing out another advantage to reducing the burning of fossil fuels. A lot of things we use daily are made out of the waste products of refining that fuel. We already know how to recycle many, if not all of those products. But the cost of the produce of recycling must compete with cost of a waste product. Sure, that will drive up the cost of plastic. But much of the plastic is used for things designed to use once then scrap. Much of that scrap is pollution. (A landfill is nothing but concentrated pollution). The increase in cost might make the manufactures go back to containers that can be reused.

* This post was edited 04/21/21 06:24am by an administrator/moderator *

Jarlaxle

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Posted: 04/21/21 09:36am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Naah.

noteven

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Posted: 04/21/21 12:03pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

That guy from Yerp Rudolph Diesel foisted his engine on the world and we are still dealing with that

RambleOnNW

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Posted: 05/01/21 06:34pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Europe is phasing out all diesel semi trucks by 2040. That is just 19 years from now:
https://www.greencarreports.com/news/113........rope-co2-neutral-manufacturing-in-the-us


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