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 > Test charging stop for large EV’s, busses, trucks, mohos.

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Reisender

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Posted: 04/22/21 07:20am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Another step forward for charging infrastructure.

There is also a short video.

https://electrek.co/2021/04/21/daimler-electric-truck-charging-station/

BB_TX

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Posted: 04/22/21 07:37am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

In 20 years they will be as common as fuel stations. Then over time, fuel stations will begin to disappear, not completely, but significantly less of them.

Horsedoc

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Posted: 04/22/21 07:40am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Not one answer to the questions that should be on everyone's mind..
How long to charge a heavy duty truck?
What does it cost?
If this place saves on petro chemical fuels, where does the energy come from that generates the power to do the charging?

Reisender

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Posted: 04/22/21 07:52am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Horsedoc wrote:

Not one answer to the questions that should be on everyone's mind..
How long to charge a heavy duty truck?
What does it cost?
If this place saves on petro chemical fuels, where does the energy come from that generates the power to do the charging?


Well, the article mentions a 1 megawatt rate which is about three times faster than at currently available vehicle charge stations. But that is changing fast. So assuming the 1 megawatt is achievable probably a couple hours for a 1 megawatt pack. Who knows.

Cost at current fast chargers is around 26 cents to 45 cents so multiply that by the pack size and go from there. It costs me 8 bucks to fill up at home, around 20 bucks to fill up at a supercharger. If a truck has a pack 10 times bigger than mine at those rates about 200 bucks.

Where the energy comes from depends on the country, region, province, state etc. In our province it’s from Hydro. Etc etc.

Not an expert. [emoticon].

BB_TX

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Posted: 04/22/21 08:06am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Horsedoc wrote:

..........
If this place saves on petro chemical fuels, where does the energy come from that generates the power to do the charging?

People tend to ignore the fact that it takes a lot of energy to move oil across country to refineries, refine that oil into gasoline and diesel, and then deliver it nation wide to service stations. All of that also requires fossil fuels to get that fuel to us so we can burn it. [emoticon]

valhalla360

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Posted: 04/22/21 09:38am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Reisender wrote:

Horsedoc wrote:

Not one answer to the questions that should be on everyone's mind..
How long to charge a heavy duty truck?
What does it cost?
If this place saves on petro chemical fuels, where does the energy come from that generates the power to do the charging?


Well, the article mentions a 1 megawatt rate which is about three times faster than at currently available vehicle charge stations. But that is changing fast. So assuming the 1 megawatt is achievable probably a couple hours for a 1 megawatt pack. Who knows.

Cost at current fast chargers is around 26 cents to 45 cents so multiply that by the pack size and go from there. It costs me 8 bucks to fill up at home, around 20 bucks to fill up at a supercharger. If a truck has a pack 10 times bigger than mine at those rates about 200 bucks.

Where the energy comes from depends on the country, region, province, state etc. In our province it’s from Hydro. Etc etc.

Not an expert. [emoticon].


Assuming the battery pack can absorb that much power, Can you get a power feed that is roughly 8500amps (@120v) per charger at a rural truck stop? (Obviously, they would go to higher voltage but it gives people a feel for the amount of power required to feed such a large charger.) A truckstop with say 40 stations, is going going to need something on the order of 40MW power supply (or about 340,000amps @120v).

Keep in mind, unlike a 200-300amp household service, where you almost never actually draw the full rated amps (rarely do you exceed 50%), you can expect to regularly be pulling the full rated amps at charging stations.

To give an idea of how much that is, the average coal power plant in the USA can put out around 650MW. If it provided for nothing else, it could support only 14 truck stops (as described above) and nothing else.

This is also different from the fast charging model for cars where most charging is slow charging done at home over night with only occasional partial charges (to keep the time waiting down) done at fast charging stations. Long haul truckers will be using this as the primary charging method and will most often need to do a full charge.

I can see local delivery trucks being very viable as they cover limited miles and usually wind up at a yard with 10+hrs to recharge overnight. The result being you can overlap between the local building power that is under utilized at night with lower charge rates making it much less difficult to get enough power to make it viable.
Long haul trucking is a different ballgame. They needs lots of power on demand and long charge times cut into times they can be making miles which is what translates to profits.


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PartyOf Five

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Posted: 04/22/21 10:08am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

While I don't question any of the numbers above, I also don't question the business sense of these & so many other companies - if its not going to work, they're not going to invest $1 into it. Success (according to the masses at least) goes to those who make the most money, and the ones who lead this race are generally the ones who can think beyond the box.

With wind, solar, and other power forms becoming popular, it could be reasonable that that coal plant has fewer customers, or that it's customers need less power - enabling more charging stations at the truck stop.

From Wikipedia: In 2019 there were 241 coal powered units across the United States which generated 23% of the United States electricity in 2019, an amount of electricity similar to that from renewable energy or nuclear power... Installed capacity was about 236 GW.
So if you have 5 coal plants per state today, then each serves a couple hundred miles- is there a need for 14 truck stops within each one's service region?


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rk911

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Posted: 04/22/21 10:09am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

BB_TX wrote:

Horsedoc wrote:

..........
If this place saves on petro chemical fuels, where does the energy come from that generates the power to do the charging?

People tend to ignore the fact that it takes a lot of energy to move oil across country to refineries, refine that oil into gasoline and diesel, and then deliver it nation wide to service stations. All of that also requires fossil fuels to get that fuel to us so we can burn it. [emoticon]


which is why pipelines are more efficient. we won't consider an electric vehicle much less a MH until two things occur:

a full re-charge takes the same amount of time it takes to refuel now...about 10-min for a 4-wheeler and maybe 20-min for the MH.

the range between charging is roughly the same as what we're seeing now...about 150-mi for the cars and 300-350 in the MH.

and of course the charging stations need to be where we are. American ingenuity being what it is i 'spose those conditions might occur before my wife and i leave this Earth but it'll be a race.


Rich
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time2roll

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Posted: 04/22/21 10:14am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

rk911 wrote:

we won't consider an electric vehicle much less a MH until two things occur:

a full re-charge takes the same amount of time it takes to refuel now...about 10-min for a 4-wheeler and maybe 20-min for the MH.
What if the electric fuel was half the cost as gas/diesel? What if the cost was 1/4?


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rk911

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Posted: 04/22/21 10:20am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

time2roll wrote:

rk911 wrote:

we won't consider an electric vehicle much less a MH until two things occur:

a full re-charge takes the same amount of time it takes to refuel now...about 10-min for a 4-wheeler and maybe 20-min for the MH.
What if the electric fuel was half the cost as gas/diesel? What if the cost was 1/4?


i don't see out-of-pocket cost as important as compared to convenience.

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