Solar charging a plugin hybrid car

[Gjac]

I have read most of the solar and li battery threads but have never seen how they would ever be cost effective in the way I camp. Having said that I was wondering if solar panels on top of a MH be effective at charging a plugin hybrid or electric car while towing? For example would 4 hrs of travel in sunlight be enough to put 50 miles back into the car's battery? How much solar would be required to do this? Or is this jut not practical?

[Boon_Docker]

mr_andyj wrote:

How is this at all related to RV's?

Close it.

Might help to read the OP.

[time2roll]

mr_andyj wrote:
How is this at all related to RV's?

The secret is in the OP.

[mr_andyj]

It's neat to be able to charge a car on free sunlight and go drive, but yes, the cost of the solar array will be a huge investment.
To charge my two camper batteries back with 200 watts will take all day.
To charge a car on that 200 watts will be not practical.
To charge car overnight on solar is not possible without a second set of batteries that stored the day's sun that you can then transfer to car at night.
To charge at work while the sun is out, not likely, you will need a big solar array, much bigger than can fit on the car.
If you are solar and on the grid then you sell power to the electric company by day, then buy electricity from them at night to charge your car then you could break even or even make money with a big enough array.
The cost of the array will change your numbers if calculated in...

How is this at all related to RV's?

Close it.

[Gjac]

time2roll wrote:

Gjac wrote:
What do you pay per KW hr in Ca? In CT currently I pay 28 cents/ KV. That is not half of gasoline. Right now it is cheaper to drive my Rav4 that gets 40 mpg's than an EV or plugin that I have to charge at 28 cents/KW.

My TOU rate varies from 16 cents to 62 cents per kWh. The trouble is I also have solar. I sell back a lot of the production at the higher rates and buy more at the lower rates. I just received my 12 month true up and my cost for the year is $62.41. That is 4,534 net kWh for the year at less than 2 cents per kWh. Crazy.

Marginal cost is 16 cents per kWh and the EV goes maybe 4 miles each kWh. Cost to go 100 miles is about $4, maybe $5. This is a nice car not an econobox.

Yes I still burn gas to take the RV trailer out. If I need to get to a distant destination I am in an airplane.

Yes 28 cents is a lot to pay.

I take it the solar is on your house? Are you renting the system and pay a monthly fee or did you buy it outright? Most systems in Ct are rented and the company maintains them and replaces them when the lose capacity. If you keep your trips close to home it makes economic sense, however I am told fast charging systems on the road are costing up to 45 cent/KW which doesn't make sense yet. Gas would have to go up to $5.50 to break even, which could happen very soon.

[time2roll]

Gjac wrote:
What do you pay per KW hr in Ca? In CT currently I pay 28 cents/ KV. That is not half of gasoline. Right now it is cheaper to drive my Rav4 that gets 40 mpg's than an EV or plugin that I have to charge at 28 cents/KW.

My TOU rate varies from 16 cents to 62 cents per kWh. The trouble is I also have solar. I sell back a lot of the production at the higher rates and buy more at the lower rates. I just received my 12 month true up and my cost for the year is $62.41. That is 4,534 net kWh for the year at less than 2 cents per kWh. Crazy.

Marginal cost is 16 cents per kWh and the EV goes maybe 4 miles each kWh. Cost to go 100 miles is about $4, maybe $5. This is a nice car not an econobox.

Yes I still burn gas to take the RV trailer out. If I need to get to a distant destination I am in an airplane.

Yes 28 cents is a lot to pay.

[Gjac]

time2roll wrote:

mr_andyj wrote:

time2roll wrote:

mr_andyj wrote:
If you want real mpg's then go back to the late 80's and find a small Honda car with the high efficiency motor, and drive for best mpg. I got 45 around town and 70 on the highway in one. No modern car can get close that I know of, not without cheating by using pre-charged batteries.

https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/topten.jsp

That is cheating using a battery, you still pay money to charge it. We are talking about gas. If you want to cheat, just chain the car to a semi and turn motor off. You can go a long way with no gas like that..

Yes you must pay to charge. The cost to charge is about half that of gasoline and you still get the stated economy. I have been cheating the oil companies for a decade now and have no hard feelings about that.

The OP started this talking about charging a hybrid vehicle from solar.

What do you pay per KW hr in Ca? In CT currently I pay 28 cents/ KV. That is not half of gasoline. Right now it is cheaper to drive my Rav4 that gets 40 mpg's than an EV or plugin that I have to charge at 28 cents/KW.

[time2roll]

mr_andyj wrote:

time2roll wrote:

mr_andyj wrote:
If you want real mpg's then go back to the late 80's and find a small Honda car with the high efficiency motor, and drive for best mpg. I got 45 around town and 70 on the highway in one. No modern car can get close that I know of, not without cheating by using pre-charged batteries.

https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/topten.jsp

That is cheating using a battery, you still pay money to charge it. We are talking about gas. If you want to cheat, just chain the car to a semi and turn motor off. You can go a long way with no gas like that..

Yes you must pay to charge. The cost to charge is about half that of gasoline and you still get the stated economy. I have been cheating the oil companies for a decade now and have no hard feelings about that.

The OP started this talking about charging a hybrid vehicle from solar.

[mr_andyj]

time2roll wrote:

mr_andyj wrote:
If you want real mpg's then go back to the late 80's and find a small Honda car with the high efficiency motor, and drive for best mpg. I got 45 around town and 70 on the highway in one. No modern car can get close that I know of, not without cheating by using pre-charged batteries.

https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/topten.jsp

That is cheating using a battery, you still pay money to charge it. We are talking about gas. If you want to cheat, just chain the car to a semi and turn motor off. You can go a long way with no gas like that..

[time2roll]

mr_andyj wrote:
If you want real mpg's then go back to the late 80's and find a small Honda car with the high efficiency motor, and drive for best mpg. I got 45 around town and 70 on the highway in one. No modern car can get close that I know of, not without cheating by using pre-charged batteries.

https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/topten.jsp

[mr_andyj]

The college kids do make those solar vehicles that run entirely on solar, but they are small go-cart sized, light weight, aero and have the frontal area of a sliver. Your vehicle is none of these things.

Of course you would get a little boost in distance, but off-set by added weight and reduced aerodynamics, and not at all cost effective.

If you want real mpg's then go back to the late 80's and find a small Honda car with the high efficiency motor, and drive for best mpg. I got 45 around town and 70 on the highway in one. No modern car can get close that I know of, not without cheating by using pre-charged batteries.

[Gjac]

time2roll wrote:
OK. The solar panels can be used to charge a plug-in vehicle. If the panels are on the MH, as mentioned in the OP, you can charge that vehicle every single day you are camped as long as the sun is on the roof of the RV. May need to use your ample house battery as a buffer and if it gets depleted the solar would charge that too. Yes it all works to the degree of commitment to the project.

Our fuel is already $4.25 a gallon. I also have 3 kW solar on my home that paid for itself in five years.

Wow $4.25/gal and I thought Ct was bad. What do you pay per KW hr in Ca? I think it is only a matter of time before we are forced to do something. If solar panels and Li batteries keep coming down and gas keeps going up we may have no choice. The real question is what will the solar battery project cost and how long would it take to break even. I remember paying $5.00/gal in Alaska in 2006, high gas prices did not stop my trip, but it did for many.

[valhalla360]

Another issue is will you be out and about mid day when solar is producing most of it's daily output?

If yes, you need to upgrade the RV battery bank and account for more losses.

[time2roll]

OK. The solar panels can be used to charge a plug-in vehicle. If the panels are on the MH, as mentioned in the OP, you can charge that vehicle every single day you are camped as long as the sun is on the roof of the RV. May need to use your ample house battery as a buffer and if it gets depleted the solar would charge that too. Yes it all works to the degree of commitment to the project.

Our fuel is already $4.25 a gallon. I also have 3 kW solar on my home that paid for itself in five years.

[Gjac]

time2roll wrote:

Gjac wrote:
I have read most of the solar and li battery threads but have never seen how they would ever be cost effective in the way I camp. Having said that I was wondering if solar panels on top of a MH be effective at charging a plugin hybrid or electric car while towing? For example would 4 hrs of travel in sunlight be enough to put 50 miles back into the car's battery? How much solar would be required to do this? Or is this jut not practical?

Is there a reason you cannot charge before you leave and after you arrive in addition to the 4 hour drive? Solar panels work all day.

Otherwise yes you are looking at close to 2000+ watts of solar on the MH. You would not be the first.

I would expect you would be topping up the toad every day as power is available. Probably also expand the MH house battery to save up the solar power for charging the toad faster when needed.

I don't go to FHU CG's so no way to plug in. I am just trying to think ahead, I know it is just a matter of time until gas is over $4.00/gal. I have a hybrid car now that gets over 40 mpg's I was thinking about a plugin hybrid that can be towed flat. Where I live electric costs are very high 23 cents/KW so when gas was $2.00/gal it was much cheaper to stay with my current car. At $3.40/gal is the break even point. I am told electric costs when traveling are between 22-45 cents per KW which is more costly than home charging. Like I said in my OP I have no need for solar on my MH because I always run out of water before battery power. But with the costs of solar coming down I was thinking solar might make sense for a plugin hybrid even at home when not camping.