Grit dog
Black Diamond, WA
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ognend wrote:Cummins12V98 wrote:Forget the 14k!!! Go by what your rear axle weighs ready to tow subtracted from your RAWR. That's basically your payload. Buy proper tonnage to cover your 6 tires, now you are good to go.
What do you mean by "buy proper tonnage to cover your 6 tires"? Thanks!
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2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
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ShinerBock
LVTX
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Two of the main differences between the two are frame and engine power.
The difference in the frame is mainly due to ease of up-fitting beds and such. It is a lot harder to up-fit and cut into a fully boxed frame versus a c-channel frame. Not to mention that part of a fully boxed frame's strength comes form it being fully boxed so cutting into it may weaken it significantly. The c-channel frame may be thicker(and heavier), but that does not mean the fully boxed frame is not as strong. It is just easier to modify the c-channel frame which is why many many C&C trucks are fully boxed up front and c-channel in the back.
In regards to the power difference, this is due to emissions certifications. A complete pickup goes through what is called a chassis dyno certification since the truck is complete. This certification is less stringent and more power can be had. For C&C trucks, they go through a engine dyno certification since the truck is not complete when it leaves the factory. A lot of people think it has to do with duty cycles, but it is only due to different emissions requirements and certifications.
There might be a few other differences as well depending on the make and model.
* This post was
edited 08/27/21 12:30pm by ShinerBock *
2014 Ram 2500 CTD
Highland Ridge Silverstar 378RBS
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Cummins12V98
on the road
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ognend wrote:Cummins12V98 wrote:Forget the 14k!!! Go by what your rear axle weighs ready to tow subtracted from your RAWR. That's basically your payload. Buy proper tonnage to cover your 6 tires, now you are good to go.
What do you mean by "buy proper tonnage to cover your 6 tires"? Thanks!
On your registration you pay for a weight that your truck can weigh up to. Weigh yourself fully loaded if your trucks 6 tires weigh more than your tonnage add coverage.
2015 RAM LongHorn 3500 Dually CrewCab 4X4 CUMMINS/AISIN RearAir 385HP/865TQ 4:10's
37,800# GCVWR "Towing Beast"
"HeavyWeight" B&W RVK3600
2016 MobileSuites 39TKSB3 highly "Elited" In the stable
2007.5 Mobile Suites 36 SB3 29,000# Combined SOLD
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blt2ski
Kirkland, Wa
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Some states like here in Washington you buy tonnage in 2000 lb increments on ALL trucks. Be it a midget Toyota or a Kenworth.
Your legal to paid for tonnage.
My new to me 1500, sons 1500 and other sons Toyota Tacoma are licensed to 8000 lbs. We can get pulled over tomorrow above our door sticker up to 8000 and have no issues. My Navistar is licensed to 26000, I've been pulled over multiple times in the 22-26k relm, no issues, even tho door sticker is 18200. I ce at 27xxx. No over wieght ticket, given a 10 day up registration to 28000. A $15 payment.
Check how Virginia licences trucks. You may be able to buy a 16k plate registration, you just gained another legal ton of payload!
Marty
92 Navistar dump truck, 7.3L 7 sp, 4.33 gears with a Detroit no spin
2014 Chevy 1500 Dual cab 4x4
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JIMNLIN
Oklahoma
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Joined: 09/14/2003
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ognend wrote:Cummins12V98 wrote:Forget the 14k!!! Go by what your rear axle weighs ready to tow subtracted from your RAWR. That's basically your payload. Buy proper tonnage to cover your 6 tires, now you are good to go.
What do you mean by "buy proper tonnage to cover your 6 tires"? Thanks!
My state, as some members have reported their states, has no tonnage...or some type of gross vehicle weight for registering a non commercial vehicle.
"good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment" ............ Will Rogers
'03 2500 QC Dodge/Cummins HO 3.73 6 speed manual Jacobs Westach
'97 Park Avanue 28' 5er 11200 two slides
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ognend
Virginia
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Joined: 06/25/2011
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Re: Tonnage - I am registered for 25000 lbs. In Virginia my understanding is you register up to the GCW you intend to carry/tow. The way I understood it, my truck weighs 8800lbs, my horse trailer can weigh up to 7000lbs (its GVWR) so that's 16,000lbs (I also have a 7,000 GVWR farm trailer for hay/equipment) and also my truck camper (4200 lbs wet weight) so total 20,000lbs or so. Is this what you guys are referring to? Did I understand it correctly?
* This post was
edited 08/27/21 02:08pm by ognend *
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2021 Chevrolet 3500 DRW Cab&Chassis crew cab 4x4 6.6L gas with 9ft4" flatbed
2013 Palomino HS-2910 Max truck camper
2007 Double D all steel 2-horse bumper pull trailer
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ognend
Virginia
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Joined: 06/25/2011
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ShinerBock wrote:Two of the main differences between the two are frame and engine power.
The difference in the frame is mainly due to ease of up-fitting beds and such. It is a lot harder to up-fit and cut into a fully boxed frame versus a c-channel frame. Not to mention that part of a fully boxed frame's strength comes form it being fully boxed so cutting into it may weaken it significantly. The c-channel frame may be thicker(and heavier), but that does not mean the fully boxed frame is not as strong. It is just easier to modify the c-channel frame which is why many many C&C trucks are fully boxed up front and c-channel in the back.
In regards to the power difference, this is due to emissions certifications. A complete pickup goes through what is called a chassis dyno certification since the truck is complete. This certification is less stringent and more power can be had. For C&C trucks, they go through a engine dyno certification since the truck is not complete when it leaves the factory. A lot of people think it has to do with duty cycles, but it is only due to different emissions requirements and certifications.
There might be a few other differences as well depending on the make and model.
By power difference - is this what they mean by "de-tuned"? I know Ford's 7.3L gasser is "de-tuned" from 430HP to 385HP but I always thought that the engine is actually the same, it is just that the HP is measured across different torque range? From what I understand on the Chevy 3500 Cab/Chassis, there is no such thing as "de-tuned" engine. Did I misunderstand all this? Thanks!
As for frame difference - I can't figure out if you are saying that yes, C/C is heavier that "standard" 8ft dually (all other things equal) because of the frame, or not? ![[emoticon]](https://forums.goodsamclub.com/sharedcontent/cfb/images/wink.gif "wink")
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rosewood1
alabama
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chevrolet offers a box delete option on the 3500 dually.that is a dually without pickup box do not know if it is different in a cab and chassis but itis different on rams or fords
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rjstractor
Maple Valley, WA
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Joined: 01/20/2003
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ShinerBock wrote:In regards to the power difference, this is due to emissions certifications. A complete pickup goes through what is called a chassis dyno certification since the truck is complete. This certification is less stringent and more power can be had. For C&C trucks, they go through a engine dyno certification since the truck is not complete when it leaves the factory. A lot of people think it has to do with duty cycles, but it is only due to different emissions requirements and certifications.
I was among those who erroneously thought the difference was due to duty cycle. I understand that the chassis dyno cert used on complete trucks is different than the engine dyno cert used on incomplete trucks. My question is, if a pickup with X power rating and a cab and chassis truck with Y (lower) power rating were compared side by side using a chassis dyno, will they produce the same amount of power at the wheels?
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ognend
Virginia
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Joined: 06/25/2011
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rjstractor wrote:ShinerBock wrote:In regards to the power difference, this is due to emissions certifications. A complete pickup goes through what is called a chassis dyno certification since the truck is complete. This certification is less stringent and more power can be had. For C&C trucks, they go through a engine dyno certification since the truck is not complete when it leaves the factory. A lot of people think it has to do with duty cycles, but it is only due to different emissions requirements and certifications.
I was among those who erroneously thought the difference was due to duty cycle. I understand that the chassis dyno cert used on complete trucks is different than the engine dyno cert used on incomplete trucks. My question is, if a pickup with X power rating and a cab and chassis truck with Y (lower) power rating were compared side by side using a chassis dyno, will they produce the same amount of power at the wheels?
I spoke to the fleet manager of the very large dealer I bought my cab/chassis truck from - he said that, at least for the Chevy/GMs, the same engine/rating is in both a 3/4 ton truck and a 3500 cab/chassis one, no "detuning" going on on the gasser side (6.6L engine).
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