Good Sam Club Open Roads Forum: Tech Issues: Contradictions with EV’s
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 > Contradictions with EV’s

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Bobbo

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Posted: 11/20/21 07:15am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

3 tons wrote:

time2roll wrote:

If you can get past all the environmental and political junk..... EVs are fun to drive.


Admittedly, I’ve never driven one (but would love to!), but after once having gotten the opportunity to drive a diesel / traction motor locomotive (a switch engine, with over 1.25 million pounds in tow!!), the traction motor torque was incredible (and no transmission!).

I believe EV’s must be truly outstanding to drive, and that ultimately EV’s should stand alone on their own unfettered and fact-based merits…It’s in this light that I restrict my own criticisms to taxpayer funded subsidies (i.e. narrative-based wealth redistribution schemes), and ‘assertions’ surrounding a ‘net’ reduction in carbon…JMHO

3 tons

It is not so much the subsidies that I detest. We have been subsidizing different things for decades. Subsidizing the Covid vaccines GREATLY shortened the development time, as an example. The laws and executive orders mandating the switch by a specific date are what I rail against. Make the EVs a better option than the ICE vehicles and let the market decide. Banning new ICE vehicles on a certain date is political theater in its entirety.


Bobbo and Lin
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pianotuna

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Posted: 11/20/21 07:39am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

valhalla360 wrote:

pianotuna wrote:

Quite misleading.

....

There are at least 2 Bev's that have integrated solar panels. For my own particular use pattern, I would essentially never have to plug in unless I were on a trip of over 300 miles.


True, slapping solar panels on a car provides almost no useful range, while adding weight, cost and carbon costs


I would not call 21 miles per day "no useful range". I live in a small city. Heck, I don't even drive every day.

Sion from Sono.

The Lightyear one provides 450 miles of total range, and about 30 to 40 miles of solar range per day (in the summer, just to be fair).


Regards, Don
My ride is a 28 foot Class C, 256 watts solar, 556 amp-hours of Telcom jars, 3000 watt Magnum hybrid inverter, Sola Basic Autoformer, Microair Easy Start.

Cummins12V98

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Posted: 11/20/21 08:00am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

steveh27 wrote:

My Toyota Yaris hatchback gets 40 mpg on the highway. I think i'll keep it going.


My Harley Davidson gets 40 mpg at 1,000# including me but my RAM tows a combined 35k and gets 9 mpg. I would say the RAM is very efficient and probably pollutes less.


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Posted: 11/20/21 08:24am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

larry cad wrote:

I'm sorry, I don't get it! I was taught many years ago that trees need CO2 to produce oxygen. When did that change?

"Carbon dioxide is indeed plant food and more plant food means more plants, more forests"

When did CO2 become our enemy? Weird!


It’s one of those too much of a good thing scenarios. We need water to survive, but if I submerge you in it it becomes a problem after a couple minutes.

Just sayin. [emoticon]

Timmo!

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Posted: 11/20/21 08:25am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

How many thousands of gallons of water are required to extinguish BEV fires?

How many lbs of heavy metals are released while BEV's roast like marshmallows? (Per Tesla advice of letting BEV fires burn out naturally).

Oh what tales we weave....

pianotuna

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Posted: 11/20/21 09:16am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Timmo! wrote:

How many thousands of gallons of water are required to extinguish BEV fires?

How many lbs of heavy metals are released while BEV's roast like marshmallows? (Per Tesla advice of letting BEV fires burn out naturally).

Oh what tales we weave....


How many ice fires last year? 150,000. I think EV fires are much less of a problem.

Dealerships don't love BEV technology because there is so little to fix. No more oil changes, longer lasting brakes, and the like.

Timmo!

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Posted: 11/20/21 09:28am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

pianotuna wrote:

Timmo! wrote:

How many thousands of gallons of water are required to extinguish BEV fires?

How many lbs of heavy metals are released while BEV's roast like marshmallows? (Per Tesla advice of letting BEV fires burn out naturally).

Oh what tales we weave....


How many ice fires last year? 150,000. I think EV fires are much less of a problem.

Dealerships don't love BEV technology because there is so little to fix. No more oil changes, longer lasting brakes, and the like.


How is replacing "bad" ICE vehicles with an equivalent "bad" BEV progress? Especially at a significant financial premium?

We don't know what we "don't know". What is the salvage/recycle plan when replacing BEV lithium batteries (sourced from open pit mining operations) at the "end of life"--or every 10 or so years?

For us that have been around, do remember the promises made by the "alternative energy" elites about clean nuclear energy...problem was not the operations of nuke plants, but what to do with the nuke waste. What is the disposal plan for expired lithium batteries?

Many of us have seen this movie before.

3 tons

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Posted: 11/20/21 09:50am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

larry cad wrote:

I'm sorry, I don't get it! I was taught many years ago that trees need CO2 to produce oxygen. When did that change?

"Carbon dioxide is indeed plant food and more plant food means more plants, more forests"

When did CO2 become our enemy? Weird!


It’s just another one of those loosely substantiated and simplified narratives that gained sufficient grant funded traction to achieve wider ‘low fruit’ mass acceptance, thus the incubation of well meaning, ardent devotees (minus homework), while entirely dismissing (what’s gifted BTW the earth with it’s heavy elements nickel and above…) which is cosmic ray heating of the oceans and other contributing stellar factors…The now embedded ‘carbon warming’ theory, elevated to fact (carbon, a simplistic ‘one size fits all’ boogyman of convenience) is just one of a panoply of other peer-to-peer ideas (e.g. the coming Ice Age in the 70’s)…Truth is that the earth’s atmosphere is a yet to be understood complexity of complexities, and the simplicity called ‘carbon warming’ is only relative (despite conical sanction) to that which has preceded, and over some arbitrary span of time, thus the finding of redwood tree stumps at the arctic circle…But (by popular demand), discussions of a different paradigm have become pointless, recall “it’s a settled science, nothing to see here” - JMHO

3 tons

steveh27

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Posted: 11/20/21 10:58am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

test

time2roll

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Posted: 11/20/21 11:45am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

3 tons wrote:

time2roll wrote:

If you can get past all the environmental and political junk..... EVs are fun to drive.


Admittedly, I’ve never driven one (but would love to!), but after once having gotten the opportunity to drive a diesel / traction motor locomotive (a switch engine, with over 1.25 million pounds in tow!!), the traction motor torque was incredible (and no transmission!).

I believe EV’s must be truly outstanding to drive, and that ultimately EV’s should stand alone on their own unfettered and fact-based merits…It’s in this light that I restrict my own criticisms to taxpayer funded subsidies (i.e. narrative-based wealth redistribution schemes), and ‘assertions’ surrounding a ‘net’ reduction in carbon…JMHO

3 tons
I agree that additional incentives are unneeded. I believe it would be best to let the original plan come to an end as originally provided.

Although at some point I could see an additional pollution tax added to ICE vehicles or to the fuel they burn. Way too soon at this point but as EVs reach 50%+ of sales I could see this happening.


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