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 > The world of tow vehicles would be a better place if

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4x4ord

Alberta

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Posted: 01/15/22 01:00pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

If I could get 3.31 gears in a new F450 I think I’d be ready to give a dually a go. For many applications a 4.30 final drive makes poor use of a transmission with a first gear ratio of 4.615:1 and a 10th gear ratio of .632:1. I think there are likely many people who would buy a F450 to tow a 16000 to 24,000 lb fiver if they could be purchased with 3.31 or 3.55 gears…. Maybe some Ram and GM dually guys would even give the F-450 a serious look if a higher geared final drive was offered?


2022 F350 SRW Platinum short box 4x4.
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specta

utah

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Posted: 01/15/22 02:12pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

If they didn't cost soo much. LOL


Kenny
2011 Chevy 2500 HD 6.0L 4wd
1976 Ford F-250 6.4L 4wd
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Regular cab. The best looking trucks.


Michelle.S

Western NY till fall, then Sebring, FL

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Posted: 01/15/22 02:55pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Biggest problem with the F450 besides the rear-end is the fact it generally has a lower cargo capacity than an equally equipped F350 since the overall Truck is heavier.


2018 Chevy 3500HD High Country Crew Cab DRW, D/A, 2016 Redwood 39MB, Dual AC, Fireplace, Sleep #Bed, Auto Sat Dish, Stack Washer/Dryer, Auto Level Sys, Disk Brakes, Onan Gen, 17.5" "H" tires, MORryde Pin & IS, Comfort Ride, Dual Awnings, Full Body Paint

FishOnOne

The Great State of Texas

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Posted: 01/15/22 03:07pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

IdaD wrote:


You're describing the Titan XD. It sold like a turd in a candy shop.


Based on this description many here would qualify it as the best truck!


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blofgren

Surrey, B.C.

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Posted: 01/15/22 06:49pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Cummins12V98 wrote:

4x4ord said: "Or how about if you could get a Powerstroke under the hood of your Ram"

Must be a rough winter up there, you feeling alright???


LOL, too funny! I don't recall ever seeing a PSD transplanted into a Ram but many Cummins have been transplanted into Fords. One of my coworkers did it to his 2008 F350 when the 6.4L PSD toasted at just over 100k miles.


2013 Ram 3500 Megacab DRW Laramie 4x4, 6.7L Cummins, G56, 3.73, Maximum Steel, black lthr, B&W RVK3670 hitch, Retrax, Linex, and a bunch of options incl. cargo camera
2008 Corsair Excella Platinum 34.5 CKTS fifth wheel with winter package & disc brakes

valhalla360

No paticular place.

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Posted: 01/15/22 07:19pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

JRscooby wrote:

valhalla360 wrote:

JRscooby wrote:

The talk of picking engine to put in any brand off truck has been common in heavy trucks forever.
IMHO, a great improvement in TV market would be for the manufacturers to sell glider kit or complete trucks without engines, so a guy that spent all the money to buy a truck with half million mile engine can use the engine for it's lifespan. And to give you a reason I think this is good idea, I bought a '76 Pete with a 1693 Cat. Records on the engine showed that was the 3rd truck.


1) No manufacturer is going to purposely cut out a big part of the cost of a truck...including the associated profits.


I thought the OP was discussing a better world. But you are right, as long as people are willing to throw half the engine life away when they replace a pickup the manufacturer is happy to sell.

Quote:

2) The days of simple mechanical diesels are long gone. Over 20yrs (typical life of a truck), the technology is likely to be wildly different and limiting the chassie so it can plug and play with a 20yr old engine would be a huge hassle and likely to run up against emissions and other regulatory issues.


I have looked at heavy trucks for over 50 years, seen changes in patterns. I remember ads in industry magazines from early '70s International selling Glider Kits (Steering axle, frame and cab) set up for 427 GMC spark plug motor. (Last 427 I worked was in '71 Diamond Rio) Back then, if you took good care of engine and drive train, the numbers often worked to upgrade at parts counter than (GK) instead of show room. Then the oil embargo forced major changes in engines. (Friend replaced his 8V71 that needed overhaul with 6V92 in his old cabover IHC. Said by the time he changed oil 3rd time had saved enough fuel to pay the difference) At the same time, laws changed so GK stopped selling. But over the last 15 years, emission regulations change, some are buy GKs and running older engines, (3406E out of my last truck, '95 Pete, is in 2019 Western Star)
And how many people on this site have bought new pickup, with all the whiz-bang tech, had problems and been told the best solution is to delete the emission control system? Nobody will admit that for a very large percentage of RVers a better available option would of been buy gasoline powered where the emission system problems have been worked out to the point we have both more power and better economy than pre emission standard levels. A perfect world, another option would be use the last half of the life of the engine out of the truck that has started to nickel/dime you.

Quote:

Then you have the PR issues when people take photos of the new 2022 Brand X truck broken down on the side of the road because someone mucked up the engine install.


Sorry, but I assume most people/shops that would take on the job of building a truck out of a pickup glider kit would be able to do a quality job. And would that PR be that much worse than multi-thousand dollar engine repair right after warrantee ends?

Quote:

Honestly, if you are OK with outdated technology, you can keep chassie and engine going for 40yrs...but after a point, it doesn't make much sense.


If I could prove it, I would bet that a very large percentage of people don't much care about tech of engine as long as it does a good job, compared to the number that demand all of what I call FREDs in the cab.


I've been involved with theoretical improvements like this (not in the automotive field)...they usually turn out to be a waste in the end. Trying to design for specifications 20yrs from now is a fools game. It's never as simple as it seems.

As mentioned HDT are a different world and not relevant to your 3/4 & 1 ton pickups. I would expect your average trucking company has qualified mechanics performing work. Your average guy with a 20yr old truck that he's stringing along likely cuts a lot of corners...so your assumption that the engine transfer would be done professionally is sketchy at best.

I'm sure individuals mostly could care less about the engine technology but that doesn't mean it must meet current regulations and that it must mate with the new technology on your new chassie.

As far as keeping a truck going for 40yrs...if you dump $40-50k into the chassie, you can do a major overhaul making it like new at 20yrs (probably a good bit cheaper if you don't live in rust belt states)...giving you an additional 20yrs. If it's really that the engine will last 40yrs, you can keep the chassie going and it's much more straight forward.


Tammy & Mike
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valhalla360

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Posted: 01/15/22 07:23pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

rhagfo wrote:

valhalla360 wrote:

4x4ord wrote:

If F350/3500 SWR trucks were labeled F250/2500 and the 2500 series trucks were discontinued. A 3500 series truck should have duals.


How exactly does fewer options make the world a better place?

If you want a dually, buy a dually.

If you want a SRW 1 ton, buy one.

If you want a 3/4 ton, buy one.

This isn't 30yrs ago when you would have to go to each individual dealer and ask for the specs on various options when it came time to purchase. It's easy to get them on the internet.


Yep, and when people go looking at the internet for specs, they look at towing and payload for a stripper TV, and then buy a loaded TV, and if it is a 250/2500 they end up with less payload than a 150/1500!!


The people who have no interest in understanding...still won't understand.

valhalla360

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Posted: 01/15/22 07:23pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

rhagfo wrote:

valhalla360 wrote:

4x4ord wrote:

If F350/3500 SWR trucks were labeled F250/2500 and the 2500 series trucks were discontinued. A 3500 series truck should have duals.


How exactly does fewer options make the world a better place?

If you want a dually, buy a dually.

If you want a SRW 1 ton, buy one.

If you want a 3/4 ton, buy one.

This isn't 30yrs ago when you would have to go to each individual dealer and ask for the specs on various options when it came time to purchase. It's easy to get them on the internet.


Yep, and when people go looking at the internet for specs, they look at towing and payload for a stripper TV, and then buy a loaded TV, and if it is a 250/2500 they end up with less payload than a 150/1500!!


The people who have no interest in understanding...still won't understand.

JIMNLIN

Oklahoma

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Posted: 01/15/22 07:43pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

someone wrote:

Yep, and when people go looking at the internet for specs, they look at towing and payload for a stripper TV, and then buy a loaded TV, and if it is a 250/2500 they end up with less payload than a 150/1500!!

Probably true for some rv folks who have no idea which specs to look at for a LDT actual usable payload.

Many rv folks simply look at the trucks gvwr based payload sticker (both axles and assume the rawr can carry all the weight from the gvwr based payloads.

Fleet Ford Specs...GM ordering Guide....Dodge/Ram Body builder guide from the internet shows all the trucks fawr/rawr and different gvwr packages.

Newer gen F250/2500 trucks can have 6000-6600 rawr/11550 gvwr vs a F150HDPP 4800 rawr/7850 gvwr.

Doesn't take a brain surgeon to see which truck can carry the most actual usable payload for a rv trailer or a truck camper.

I would bet their are many more 250/2500 trucks sold than their srw sisters. And most of those probably never tow a TT or 5th wheel rv trailer.


"good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment" ............ Will Rogers

'03 2500 QC Dodge/Cummins HO 3.73 6 speed manual Jacobs Westach
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time2roll

Southern California

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Posted: 01/15/22 08:14pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I want super singles tucked under the SRW fenders instead of a dually. Going to be a bit narrower between the wheel wells and that is fine by me.


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