fuel cell????

[relaxin]

Anyone seen any set ups utilizing a fuel cell to maintain a battery charge in an RV, a couple places I like to go are heavily shaded (in a forest) so solar is not very efficient, want to avoid using a geny and just maintain a battery with say 100 to 200 watts /hour (24/7) to offset normal usage, excluding any 120 volt appliances.

curious if the technologie is coming along.

I use to use a couple batteries, and then a generator to charge them when we went more than 4 days, but that sucks having to replace them every 5 years or so, for just a week or so of dry camping in a year.

[StirCrazy]

valhalla360 wrote:

StirCrazy wrote:
didn't say they havent been around for a long time, saying this itteration of them is fairly new. if you average consumption in your rv is 50AH per day, whats wrong with having somthing that is capable of supplying more than that in the same day? and if you looked I said it would be great as an emergency back up for solar. I have never run out of power with my solar but I have come close several times as I don't live where it never rains and the sun always shines, I also don't limit my camping to july and augest when ther is lots of sun. I camped from march to november up north here where the solar footprint is also lower. so if we get threee days of rain the charge your getting is minimal and depending on your battery capacity is how long you can go. an example last october I was camping just outside of edmonton and hit three very overcast and rainy days and I got close to 50% of my capacity on the batteries (asid batteries in the camper still) but the next day the sun came out and I was good. if the rain and such would have carried on I would have had to look for a campsite with power to charge my batteries. having somthing like this could have topped me up again in under a day and I would be good for another three days of rain. this is why I was originaly looking at them a few years ago, but untill the price drops to under 1000 bucks I think they arnt worth it as its cheeper to expand your solar and battery capacity. both thoes companies do make bigger units that can be used like plugging in, but there big and bulky and expensive. not somthing you would have in a camper, where these ones can be used in a rv to offset battery usage and charge batteries when your not using power.

If you are only using 50AH/day, just add an extra battery or two if you are worried about a cloudy day limiting solar output.

If you really want a backup, a 1000w generator is small, cheap and puts out a heck of a lot more power.

Other than to say you have some neato technology, these make zero sense in an RV application.

thats what I did in the 5th wheel, but to even get 3 to 4 days of power in my camper I had to take the outside storage bay and shoe horn 2 GC2 batteries in there. eventualy I will be changing them to Li but thats all the room for batteries for now. no space for a genny and the gas to run it, nore the desire to ever have one of thoes noisey things. if it wasnt for the price they would be a nice quiet alternative to a generator, no polution, no noise and can recharge your batteries in under a day (for most people) will they work to run microwaves and such, no but I don't use mine when Im not pluged in unless we have the grandson with us and need to warm a bottle. if the 80ah one was priced in the sub 500.00 range it would be very handy to have and not just for the camper.

Steve

[time2roll]

For the price of a fuel cell you can build a monster LFP battery and simply not recharge. Should last 15 years with minimal cycling.
Fuel cell degrades with use also.

[free_radical]

relaxin wrote:
Anyone seen any set ups utilizing a fuel cell to maintain a battery charge in an RV, a couple places I like to go are heavily shaded (in a forest) so solar is not very efficient, want to avoid using a geny and just maintain a battery with say 100 to 200 watts /hour (24/7) to offset normal usage, excluding any 120 volt appliances.

curious if the technologie is coming along.

I use to use a couple batteries, and then a generator to charge them when we went more than 4 days, but that sucks having to replace them every 5 years or so, for just a week or so of dry camping in a year.

https://www.efoy.com/

[valhalla360]

StirCrazy wrote:
didn't say they havent been around for a long time, saying this itteration of them is fairly new. if you average consumption in your rv is 50AH per day, whats wrong with having somthing that is capable of supplying more than that in the same day? and if you looked I said it would be great as an emergency back up for solar. I have never run out of power with my solar but I have come close several times as I don't live where it never rains and the sun always shines, I also don't limit my camping to july and augest when ther is lots of sun. I camped from march to november up north here where the solar footprint is also lower. so if we get threee days of rain the charge your getting is minimal and depending on your battery capacity is how long you can go. an example last october I was camping just outside of edmonton and hit three very overcast and rainy days and I got close to 50% of my capacity on the batteries (asid batteries in the camper still) but the next day the sun came out and I was good. if the rain and such would have carried on I would have had to look for a campsite with power to charge my batteries. having somthing like this could have topped me up again in under a day and I would be good for another three days of rain. this is why I was originaly looking at them a few years ago, but untill the price drops to under 1000 bucks I think they arnt worth it as its cheeper to expand your solar and battery capacity. both thoes companies do make bigger units that can be used like plugging in, but there big and bulky and expensive. not somthing you would have in a camper, where these ones can be used in a rv to offset battery usage and charge batteries when your not using power.

If you are only using 50AH/day, just add an extra battery or two if you are worried about a cloudy day limiting solar output.

If you really want a backup, a 1000w generator is small, cheap and puts out a heck of a lot more power.

Other than to say you have some neato technology, these make zero sense in an RV application.

[Grit_dog]

relaxin wrote:
Anyone seen any set ups utilizing a fuel cell to maintain a battery charge in an RV, a couple places I like to go are heavily shaded (in a forest) so solar is not very efficient, want to avoid using a geny and just maintain a battery with say 100 to 200 watts /hour (24/7) to offset normal usage, excluding any 120 volt appliances.

curious if the technologie is coming along.

I use to use a couple batteries, and then a generator to charge them when we went more than 4 days, but that sucks having to replace them every 5 years or so, for just a week or so of dry camping in a year.

Yeah just head down to Camping World. They’re on sale now!
Aisle 6 I think, right next to the left handed smoke benders and sky hooks….
:S

[Skibane]

Bobbo wrote:

Skibane wrote:
You need a Thermal Electric Generator.

Spec Sheet

480 watts at 12v (40 amps at 12v)
voltage adjustable from 11.4v to 12.6v
fuel consumption 20.1 gallons/day

A TEG unit which produced only 20 watts continuous would be roughly comparable to a 100 watt solar panel that got 5 hours of strong sunlight per day.

Fuel consumption of a unit that size would scale to roughly 0.8 gallons per day.

[StirCrazy]

pianotuna wrote:
Ballard Power Systems started in 1979.

https://www.ballard.com/about-ballard/ballard-in-canada

yes they did but it was 86 before they had there first working fuel stack available and it was 1989 when they incorperated in british columbia and beacame a full blown company sellign a product insted of just a research company.

Steve

[StirCrazy]

valhalla360 wrote:

StirCrazy wrote:
The Watt one celabrated there first instalation in a resident in 2018, which was a huge milestone going from lab theory to an actual instalation. 2014 is when they wone the contract for proof of theory, so hardly decades for this tech. yes fuel cells have been around for quite a while, a canadian company called Ballard has been leading the charge since the lait 80's with there hydrogen fuel cells. but for the RV market it is a fairly young concept, this one using propane to act as the catilist, but to me it isnt efficent enough as it uses 20lbs of propane to produce 87 AH of charge. I guess it would be ok to have as an emergency generator to supliment your solar. the other one is kinda cool using methanol for the catilist source and wont the european inovation award in 2021, but also have there roots around 2017. while I think the second version is ideal for the RV. the 2800pro will put out 80AH of charging a day and can go 43 days runing 24/7 with a outut of 125 watts on two fuel jugs. look like a DEF jug so they would be easy to store and don't have to worry about using your propane. only down side is your around 4-5000 bucks for this model in canada.

Steve

The fuel cell was invented in 1838.

They were fairly widely used by NASA back in the 1960's. Of course, cost wasn't a consideration.

So yeah, they have been around for a long time.

As far as putting out significant power:

80AH...at what voltage? At 5000v, that's great (400KWH per day). At 12v, it's silly to even consider (0.96kwh per day). Something around 240w (nominal rating) of solar will generate the same amount and you don't have to muck about finding suitable fuel or dealing with near one off specialty products.

didn't say they havent been around for a long time, saying this itteration of them is fairly new. if you average consumption in your rv is 50AH per day, whats wrong with having somthing that is capable of supplying more than that in the same day? and if you looked I said it would be great as an emergency back up for solar. I have never run out of power with my solar but I have come close several times as I don't live where it never rains and the sun always shines, I also don't limit my camping to july and augest when ther is lots of sun. I camped from march to november up north here where the solar footprint is also lower. so if we get threee days of rain the charge your getting is minimal and depending on your battery capacity is how long you can go. an example last october I was camping just outside of edmonton and hit three very overcast and rainy days and I got close to 50% of my capacity on the batteries (asid batteries in the camper still) but the next day the sun came out and I was good. if the rain and such would have carried on I would have had to look for a campsite with power to charge my batteries. having somthing like this could have topped me up again in under a day and I would be good for another three days of rain. this is why I was originaly looking at them a few years ago, but untill the price drops to under 1000 bucks I think they arnt worth it as its cheeper to expand your solar and battery capacity. both thoes companies do make bigger units that can be used like plugging in, but there big and bulky and expensive. not somthing you would have in a camper, where these ones can be used in a rv to offset battery usage and charge batteries when your not using power.

[pianotuna]

For anyone who wants info on solar with fuel cell.

https://register.gotowebinar.com/register/5331112290333008653

[valhalla360]

StirCrazy wrote:
The Watt one celabrated there first instalation in a resident in 2018, which was a huge milestone going from lab theory to an actual instalation. 2014 is when they wone the contract for proof of theory, so hardly decades for this tech. yes fuel cells have been around for quite a while, a canadian company called Ballard has been leading the charge since the lait 80's with there hydrogen fuel cells. but for the RV market it is a fairly young concept, this one using propane to act as the catilist, but to me it isnt efficent enough as it uses 20lbs of propane to produce 87 AH of charge. I guess it would be ok to have as an emergency generator to supliment your solar. the other one is kinda cool using methanol for the catilist source and wont the european inovation award in 2021, but also have there roots around 2017. while I think the second version is ideal for the RV. the 2800pro will put out 80AH of charging a day and can go 43 days runing 24/7 with a outut of 125 watts on two fuel jugs. look like a DEF jug so they would be easy to store and don't have to worry about using your propane. only down side is your around 4-5000 bucks for this model in canada.

Steve

The fuel cell was invented in 1838.

They were fairly widely used by NASA back in the 1960's. Of course, cost wasn't a consideration.

So yeah, they have been around for a long time.

As far as putting out significant power:

80AH...at what voltage? At 5000v, that's great (400KWH per day). At 12v, it's silly to even consider (0.96kwh per day). Something around 240w (nominal rating) of solar will generate the same amount and you don't have to muck about finding suitable fuel or dealing with near one off specialty products.

[pianotuna]

Ballard Power Systems started in 1979.

https://www.ballard.com/about-ballard/ballard-in-canada

[StirCrazy]

valhalla360 wrote:

StirCrazy wrote:
there is a couple comercial offereing out there that are targiting rvs but they are very expensive still but thats to be expected in there infancy.

https://www.wattfuelcell.com/uses/rv/

https://www.my-efoy.com/en/

Steve

They have been around for decades...don't expect them to get cheap and powerful any time soon.

The Watt one celabrated there first instalation in a resident in 2018, which was a huge milestone going from lab theory to an actual instalation. 2014 is when they wone the contract for proof of theory, so hardly decades for this tech. yes fuel cells have been around for quite a while, a canadian company called Ballard has been leading the charge since the lait 80's with there hydrogen fuel cells. but for the RV market it is a fairly young concept, this one using propane to act as the catilist, but to me it isnt efficent enough as it uses 20lbs of propane to produce 87 AH of charge. I guess it would be ok to have as an emergency generator to supliment your solar. the other one is kinda cool using methanol for the catilist source and wont the european inovation award in 2021, but also have there roots around 2017. while I think the second version is ideal for the RV. the 2800pro will put out 80AH of charging a day and can go 43 days runing 24/7 with a outut of 125 watts on two fuel jugs. look like a DEF jug so they would be easy to store and don't have to worry about using your propane. only down side is your around 4-5000 bucks for this model in canada.

Steve

[Fisherman]

Don't know if they gave up on these or not. http://www.chfca.ca/fuel-cell-electric-buses-fcebs/

[Reisender]

Lwiddis wrote:
Since my doctor bought a fuel cell car I’ve been looking for places to refill it as a game. One day I’ll find one other than the one near his home.

We were in Vancouver recently and saw a hydrogen filling station. And there was a Toyota something or other filling at it. We never see them in the interior as there is no where to fuel but apparently there are 3 or 4 stations in the Vancouver area. Apparently hydrogen is crazy expensive compared to gas but I couldn’t get any hard comparison numbers. The car was a fleet car with a company logo on it. Looked like a normal car. We couldn’t stop but I would have liked to talk to the driver. Interesting though.