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 > can I tow on the ball

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Road Phantom

pa

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Posted: 03/14/22 11:16pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

The weight of my ram diesel is more like 7800lbs loaded, sorry about that. I have a Blue Ox WD hitch with a 10,000 lb capacity. I'd like to test it without the spring bars attached and may do that in an upcoming trip.

afidel

Cleveland

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Posted: 03/15/22 12:14am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Gdetrailer wrote:

HuckleberryHunter wrote:

CAN you? Yes. SHOULD you? IMO, no.

WDH is there for a reason.


OP has a 3/4 ton truck with a heavy Diesel engine and has 4K of cargo weight available..

That truck will never need any weight restoration on the front with even 1K lbs of tongue weight.. 1K of TW most likely will barely lift the front and I doubt because of the Diesel engine will every be missed.

WD hitches were designed to allow vehicles to tow much larger loads than they were originally designed for by pushing some of the tongue weight which would have overloaded the rear axles forward to the front axles..

OP has the option to not use WD if they choose to do so. The only caveat is to make sure the trailer TW is above 12%, ideally 15% for best towing stability..

For the record, I have never used WD on any of my 3/4 ton trucks and have towed 20ft and 26ft trailers with 7K GVWR and have a 10K GVWR 18 ft flatbed trailer that I have loaded well over 10K and never had the headlights point to the sky as folks love to banter about..


I've seen plenty of 2500 diesels with their headlights towards the sky. I'm not sure how much tongue weight those landscaping trailers have but they're the most common offender. Beyond that there vast majority of wdh also offer another significant advantage which is anti-sway and sway is one of those things that by there time it rears its ugly head it's generally too late.


2019 Dutchman Kodiak 293RLSL
2015 GMC 1500 Sierra 4x4 5.3 3.42 full bed
Equalizer 10k WDH


valhalla360

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Posted: 03/15/22 12:45am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

wildtoad wrote:

Why guess about your weights? Go weigh your truck and trailer as setup for camping and base your decision on facts.


Yep, just get the real numbers as your guesstimates appear way off.

Our 2008 F250 gas weighs in at 7500 per the scales. The diesel is typically heavier.

You are probably a bit higher, so with a 10k GVWR, you likely only have 2000-2500 payload (assuming you aren't one who thinks they know better than the manufacturer).

So do you strictly need a WDH...maybe, maybe not but properly set up with sway control built in, it will tow better.


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Gdetrailer

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Posted: 03/15/22 05:52am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

afidel wrote:



I've seen plenty of 2500 diesels with their headlights towards the sky. I'm not sure how much tongue weight those landscaping trailers have but they're the most common offender. Beyond that there vast majority of wdh also offer another significant advantage which is anti-sway and sway is one of those things that by there time it rears its ugly head it's generally too late.


Ah, yes, "antisway" WD, hate to break it to you but if you do not need weight restoration to restore weight back onto the front axles then your WD with antisway will not have enough pressure to be an effective anti sway device..

The two items go together (WD and antisway).

In other words if you do not have enough pressure on the spring bars, you will not have antisway.

Vehicle manufacturers no longer recommend 100% restoration to the front, restoration is what WD is all about..

OP having a 3/4 ton with Diesel engine is starting out several hundred pounds more weight than a gas engine.. The few pounds of weight that might get transferred from the front to rear will be statistically insignificant and the OP will most likely have the spring bars barely tight.. The only issue the OP will have is not overloading the rear axle.

As far as anti sway devices goes, they are a bandaid at best that folks use to cover up too low of tongue weight and/or in sufficient tow vehicle match.

One should never ever depend on an anti sway device to fix problems, one should always ensure they have a good towing match with a trailer of sufficient TW when loaded.. After all, WD hitches and friction anti sway devices can fail, and if they happen to fail when you need it most then you are in a heap of trouble. I am not talking about the bare minimum of 10% TW, but going the extra distance with 15%..

Get it right first, then if it makes you sleep better at night apply some anti sway device.

OP does have plenty of cargo weight (2200 lbs) to cover their trailer without WD even with the revised weight they have given..

There are hundreds of thousands or more contractors towing cargo and flatbed trailers that have never had WD or anti sway devices attached.. Many commercial contractor rigs use pintle hitches (rings) which WD cannot be used with..

Only here on RV forums we have folks believing the WD and anti sway devices must be used across the board on all cases.

Gdetrailer

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Posted: 03/15/22 06:36am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Afidel,

Before you blast me, I suggest you watch the video demonstration in the link below..

HERE

In that small scale video around the 25 second mark they move the weight to behind the trailer axle and sway starts with very little to no input.

Around the 45 second mark, they move the weight back in front of the trailer axle and the sway stops almost immediately.

This video should be a sticky and a mandatory must watch video before folks start towing..

HERE is another video that goes over TW and how to determine and measure it (although on larger and heavier trailers one needs to make some adaptations to the way the common household bathroom scale is used which is not in the video).

For the bathroom scale, HERE is a good video demonstration on how to do this.

ssthrd

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Posted: 03/15/22 08:19am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Your class 5 receiver is good for 1,000# without weight distribution, so you should be well under that. When I pulled my 7,000# TT with my 3500, I dialed in enough WD to give me some sway control. Made a definite difference.

Just because you have a 2500 hd doesn't mean that you don't need sway control. It's for the trailer, not the truck. If it's not loaded right, it will sway.


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QCMan

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Posted: 03/15/22 08:19am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

What type of tt hitch does not use a ball??


2020 Keystone Cougar 22RBS, Ram 1500, two Jacks and plenty of time to roam!
The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits. A.E.

Sandia Man

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Posted: 03/15/22 08:49am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

We have a pretty stout truck and do not need WD as well, but for the life of me I would not get on any interstate and travel posted speeds with the kind of wind we get in our neck of the woods. Our WD hitch helps a bit with restoring weight to the front of our truck, more importantly for us it has integrated sway control that keeps sway down to a minimum, which is the primary we spend the 2-3 minutes it takes to install/remove bars. Can't tell you how many times we've seen HD trucks on the interstate that are going well below speed limit due to excessive swaying of the trailer they are pulling.

Gdetrailer

PA

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Posted: 03/15/22 09:39am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

ssthrd wrote:



Just because you have a 2500 hd doesn't mean that you don't need sway control. It's for the trailer, not the truck. If it's not loaded right, it will sway.


[emoticon]

And once again, load the trailer correctly in the first place..

Watch the videos I linked above..

Applying WD and/or antisway devices instead of correcting the trailer weight balance all you are doing is masking the problem..

What are you going to do when the WD or antisway device fails to provide enough correction under an emergency situation?

Get the trailer TW correct for the trailer weight as the first line of defense and then and only then add in antisway..

JRscooby

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Posted: 03/15/22 10:33am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Gdetrailer wrote:

Afidel,

Before you blast me, I suggest you watch the video demonstration in the link below..

HERE

In that small scale video around the 25 second mark they move the weight to behind the trailer axle and sway starts with very little to no input.

Around the 45 second mark, they move the weight back in front of the trailer axle and the sway stops almost immediately.

This video should be a sticky and a mandatory must watch video before folks start towing..

HERE is another video that goes over TW and how to determine and measure it (although on larger and heavier trailers one needs to make some adaptations to the way the common household bathroom scale is used which is not in the video).

For the bathroom scale, HERE is a good video demonstration on how to do this.


I'm sure glad you never got a chance to talk to the full trailer I pulled the most. MT TW was less than 0.05%. Loaded, less than 0.005%. Replace bushings in tongue about every 50,000 miles, and it tracked like it was on rails.
Now when talking RVs, or most other trailers, the TW is important. You should set things up to where sway is unlikely, then add sway control for when something goes wrong.

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