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bobbolotune

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Posted: 08/06/22 12:53am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

The manual for my 2016 Ram 3500 dually shows tire rotation only side to side. Specifically, switch the driver front and the passenger front tires, switch the outer rear tires driver to passenger, and switch the inner rear tires driver to passenger. The picture showing how to rotate shows no rotation back to front.

The manual really doesn’t explain why not to rotate back to front. It does say the rear tires must be matched for wear. Possibly the concern is that if tires are moved back to front that wear won’t match.

The manual does explain why it says to keep the inner rear wheels inner and outer rear wheels outer. It is for the Tire Pressure Information System. To quote, “The Tire Pressure Information System uses unique sensors in the inner rear wheels to help identify them from the outer rear wheels, because of this, the inner and outer wheel locations cannot be switched”.

With my last tires it turned out that I had an alignment problem (now fixed) that I wasn’t aware of until I noticed that the tires were wearing unevenly. Since I was rotating the front tires only side to side both front tires wore unevenly on the outer edges. By the time I noticed this the tires were unsafe and I had to replace the tires probably 6,000 or 8,000 miles early.

I had to have the tires replaced during a trip. I ended up at a tire shop in a rural area that seemed to have plenty of experience with duallys. He told me to ignore the manual. He said that they rotate back to front all the time. He says they take the best looking tires from the back and put them on the front.

If I had rotated like that it would have stalled the uneven wear that killed my last tires.

I am about to get the new tires rotated for the first time. I have been telling the mechanic to follow the manual. I am now totally unclear what to do. It would seem that only rotating side to side in the same positions really isn’t going to help much because every other rotation the tires end up back in the same location.

It could be what the manual says that if you don’t keep the inner tires inner and outer tires outer it will confuse the Tire Pressure Information System. But really how important is that? It is nice to have the tire pressures in the instrument cluster because I look at the pressures frequently as I drive, much more often than I would find myself checking tire pressure manually. But I don’t care much about location. If a tire is low (something that actually has never happened yet) I can find out which one by checking the tires manually.

Does anyone know the correct answer to this question? A set of dually tires is expensive so I want to take care of the new tires.


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phil-t

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Posted: 08/06/22 03:34am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I have been doing this once/year (5 to 10k miles) for 7 years - no issues, good tires and they will age out, not wear out.

Opinions on the best way to rotate differ, but the general consensus among most tire pros seems to be that a counter-clockwise rotation on each side of the truck is the best approach.


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gbsteph

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Posted: 08/06/22 06:03am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I have gone one step further. I rotate my spare into the mix with my inner dual wheels since it has the matching steel rim. I hate that the spare sits there and never gets wear on it except in emergencies. I just dealt with the tire pressure sensor being "off" when the spare got rotated into the mix. I recently purchased an inner tire pressure sensor to be installed onto the spare tire rim and was told the system will "learn" the sensor once it gets spinning. We will see. It can also be programmed at the dealer for a few bucks I'm told. So I rotate outer aluminum wheels clockwise, and inner steel wheels clockwise including the spare. Picture a triangle with the spare as the top point.

eHoefler

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Posted: 08/06/22 06:16am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

For about 20 years of owning dually trucks, I have rotated the RR to the front on the first rotation of new tires, second time LR to the front, and if they last long enough, I rotate the RR to front again, etc.. I have manage to get all 6 tires replaced under milage warranty several time since all tires had worn with in 1/32 of each other.


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Tvov

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Posted: 08/06/22 06:45am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

When I had my F350, I "rotated" side to side. My 1987 F350 had limited slip rear end and creeper gear manual trans. The front tires would wear out long before the rear tires due to the tread on the fronts getting worn off when turning - fighting the rear duals wanting to go straight.

This was a work truck, rarely saw highway speeds.

When in doubt, do it like the owner's manual says.


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Lwiddis

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Posted: 08/06/22 08:28am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Every vehicle owner’s manual I’ve ever seen discusses tire rotation and how to rotate tires on that vehicle. Does your manual discuss the manufacturer’s recommendation?


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CA Traveler

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Posted: 08/06/22 08:50am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

The best answer considering your TPMS is to follow the manual. You could do otherwise and likely not a issue.

There are many variables like: Duals should all be the same diameter so that the wear is the same, the inner dual is usually warmer, the outer dual temperatue is higher with sunshine, typical road crown causes more weight on the inner dual, turning has more effect on the steers, passenger side tires may have different wear, etc. These are likely minor concerns.

I see differences in PSI and temperature during a days travel but the above factors vary throught the day including ambient temperature. For most RVs that pay attention to the tires they age out and should be replaced to lessen any problems.

* This post was edited 08/06/22 08:58am by CA Traveler *


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Bob


Grit dog

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Posted: 08/06/22 10:46am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

bobbolotune
There is no one “right” way to rotate tires that fits all scenarios.
Idk anything about dual rears having “different” pressure sensors which inhibit changing tire position. Although it makes sense if the rf signals from tires in the same proximity can not be differentiated from each other. (I have no knowledge though)
Bottom line, tire rotations “should” be based on tire wear and correcting any abnormal wear by putting it in the best location to do that.
And then there’s the issue of polished wheels, steel inner dual rims etc.

Generally in industry where gramps isn’t rotating tires every oil change, need it or not, rears stay on back and fronts get rotated side to side.
Maybe rears get rotated side to side to correct tread feathering.
If you notice rent and rear tires on a rwd feather in opposite directions. This is corrected by swapping side to side, or on a srw, corrected more efficiently by swapping straight front to back.
It is a rare day when I rotate in a X pattern on a srw as that generally is not the best option for increasing tread life.
If one is paying $ for tire rotations, also consider the cost of rotation vs how much tire life (also $) you are saving.


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Grit dog

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Posted: 08/06/22 10:54am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

And the rural shop wasn’t really wrong either. But again it’s situational.
Example, our truck with 37s had fairly new tires when we got it but the PO was well on his way to screwing them up.
I’ve been adjusting pressures and rotating as needed to the position needed even including flipping them on the rims now, to increase tire life.
Result, 40k miles ago, there was 3-4/32 difference between tires. And tread cupping on the front. Now, tires are almost equally and perfectly worn and still have 9-10/32 left center tread
This would have not been the case if I just blindly rotated in some pattern and used “recommended” pressures. At $2000 a set now (FJB) it’s worth understanding tires, imo.

bobbolotune

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Posted: 08/06/22 02:47pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

phil-t wrote:

I have been doing this once/year (5 to 10k miles) for 7 years - no issues, good tires and they will age out, not wear out.


You do which? You follow the manual and only switch the same positions side to side?

Lwiddis wrote:

Every vehicle owner’s manual I’ve ever seen discusses tire rotation and how to rotate tires on that vehicle. Does your manual discuss the manufacturer’s recommendation?


Yes. As I discussed in my original post the manual says to rotate the same positions only side to side. But my question came from what the service manager said at the tire place where I had the tires replaced. He said that they rotate back to front (he said that they do it every day) and if I had done that I would have gotten more life from the tires.

It makes sense to me that only switching the same positions side to side, as the manual says, is of limited value because with every other tire rotation the tires will end up in exactly the same place they started.

I’m still unclear. I suppose when in doubt it is probably best to follow what the manual says. Yes the front tires may wear out faster than the back tires but maybe that is just how it goes.

The guy at the tire place told me that I needed to replace all 6 tires even though it was only the front tires showing wear. He said that on a dually you need to replace all tires at once. I told this to someone in a campground who said it is completely untrue. Maybe there is concern about matching the 4 rear tires, but he said the front tires can be replaced independent of the back tires.

So maybe follow the manual and if the front tires wear out sooner I can replace only the front tires. Opinions?

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