Buying a Former Rental Class C. How many of us out there?

[IAMICHABOD]

While researching these pages for my next Motor Home I saw a few threads discussing Rentals, most were Pros and Cons but very few posts from people who had purchased one.

I thought it may be a good resource and helpful to hear from these people. The good, the bad, what they liked and what they didn’t. Also if they had any problems, things they changed, if they would recommend this to others or do it again.

Here is my story: I am not a novice, having owned a Class A for more than 15 years and doing the camping thing with my wife and two daughters, I can say “been there done that” But life changes, and I sold everything so I have been away from this for several years. Starting over I lurked here for a while and got a lot of good insight then went looking.

My criteria was: A Class C within by budget, less than 30 feet so I can keep it at home, saving storage $, a rear bed, and a lot of storage space.

What fit that was Winnebago, Fleetwood and a few others, what I found mostly was Jamboree / Tioga 26Q. In the year models 2002 thru 2006. I did my home work looking at NADA and other sites to find the fair prices for the models that I was looking for.

After several months of searching the internet, Craigslist, private ads and Dealerships for a Class C that suited my budget and needs, this is what I found. Of the dozen or so I inquired about.Most were upsidedown in their payments, owing more than they were worth. All were on Ford Chassis, 7 needed tires, all had the original 7 to 10 year old tires, and they all needed repair of the awning and most needed some work inside or out and the maintenance records were sketchy, but most had low mileage. The Dealerships offerings were better but they had a profit margin to maintain so I got older models within my budget or huge up sales that didn’t work for me.

My next step was looking at the rental market for sales. In my area there are 2 large companies that have rental sales, Cruise America and El Monte RV,who also sell Class A RVs.

First up was El Monte RV Their units are production RVs that are made by major manufactures, with TV antennas and hookups inside and out, Ducted A/C and heat, 2 house batteries, a rear ladder and parts are readily available from those manufacture’s. I looked at their web site and it detailed their warranty and what was checked and serviced by their factory trained technicians. The unit I looked at was like new inside, the upholstery on all the seats was new as was the floor mat in the driver’s area, it had a new mattress, still in plastic and a new bedspread. All of the curtains were new also. Newer (2010 mfg date) tires with 98% rubber and the mileage was ninety thousand (90,000).

Then there was Cruise America: Their units that I looked at seemed to be Spartan,no TV antenna or hookups for one,non-ducted A/C,small counter space and only one battery, no rear ladder for inspection and maintenance of roof and built just for them, they were all “refreshed” their words not mine. They offered extended warranties at a huge cost. All had high mileage, one hundred and thirty thousand (130,000) or more and the price range seemed a little high. The sales staff had a take it or leave it attitude and were not very forthcoming when asked about maintenance records and service,they claim to have proprietary info in those records,It doesn't seem to be a problem for El Monte RV.

At El Monte RV I took a test ride; This Unit was a 2006 Tioga 26Q on a Chevrolet Chassis it rode
Drove and handled much better than the Fords that I had driven. It also had more leg room and was quieter. We got back and I asked about the service and maintenance on it, the salesman, Joey, handed me a 28 page single spaced document asked if I wanted some coffee or something to drink and said “read this and if you have any questions I will answer them”.

It detailed everything that was done before and after each rental, the mileage, generator hours and hours billed. Each time it was washed and detailed inside and outside, all fluids were checked and replenished if needed, the holding tanks were washed, LP system was checked for leaks, all torque on wheel lugs were checked, brakes front and rear checked for wear and cracks, pressure in tires, all appliances, generator oil, lights inside and outside, the list goes on and on.

It also listed all oil changes,coolant change,trans service,fuel injector service and cleaning,fuel filters,air filter, new brakes, all repairs and replacements all with date, mileage and time spent in complete detail from day one to when it was pulled from the rental fleet and was refurbished. I have a complete service record on this vehicle.Also the service records on the Onan Generator,all oil changes,air filter and spark plug replacement with hours and date. I negotiated a good deal with them and am very happy with my purchase.

It came with a 1 yr. 12000 mile power train warranty and 30 day on all appliances. It also came with a 28 page maintenance record that detailed everything. Also the original sales packet from Fleetwood with the manual and serial numbers on all appliances,refrigerator, microwave,furnace, AC, water heater, etc. and the manual for the Chassis. I have had no problems with it so far.

(ON EDIT) 5 Years and close to 14000 miles.Just Scheduled Maintenance and new tires,old ones were at the 5 year mark and I wanted new Michelin LTX M/S2s.

There were a few things that it didn’t have as it was a rental and the ones from private parties did have.
• Power steps, outside Stereo/CD don’t need or want them.
• An Awning, this I wanted and had installed. A Swivel Seat and a new Window in The Door that I installed.
• Wheel Simulators, I like the looks so I had them installed and at the same time had Tire Man valve stem kit put on.
• Replaced the Chinese WFCO with a US Made converter/charger
• It came with mini blinds and not the day/night that most have, these are more practical and have a lot less failure.

• It also came with Stainless Steel sinks,easier to maintain than the cheap plastic ones that come in the noncommercial units.
  

I am very happy with my Rig, it suites my needs and it was in my Budget range, I think I got a good deal.

So if you bought a rental please share your experience here for others to use as a resource.
Or if there are any other questions that have not been covered in these pages, just ask, there are many helpful people on this thread.

[justinhscott]

Anybody add any sound dampening material to their rig? I have an '06 CA 28a class C. The cab is a basic, spartan cargo van. It's fine, and noisy on the highway. Any thoughts on cutting down the road noise?

[path1]

510dogmom wrote:
New question: 2012 23A Majestic. It appears the fridge is not turning off. It's cold all the time. I live in California, so it is colder than the ambient temperature around it. I've tried turning it off using the renters manual that came with the rig, but it is still on. Now what?

Renters manuals... like most general manuals that don't go into detail enough or they end with "see your dealer" which don't help much.

What I would do to get a better and more responses is from Tech section of the forum, not this rental thread ... find the make and model number and post the problem in the tech section of this forum. My off hand guess is the "thing" that controls the temp. Thermister or something like that might just need adjusting.

[craz_z]

60-65 in the front is about right after that the front end does feel abit icy not enough weight on the front to justify going up over that the rear is a different story.

Rears are around 70-75 up to 80 depending on load.

Load E tires go to 80psi max. which is what all of the 23a's should be. IF you don't have the borg tire valves I highly recommend buying them on the next tire change.

[510dogmom]

New question: 2012 23A Majestic. It appears the fridge is not turning off. It's cold all the time. I live in California, so it is colder than the ambient temperature around it. I've tried turning it off using the renters manual that came with the rig, but it is still on. Now what?

[Bea_PA]

Weigh the rig loaded for a trip then go in on the tire chart for your brand tires and go from there.

[510dogmom]

Greetings all and Happy New Year!

I own a 2012 CD 23A. What should the PSI be in the tires? A little sticker says no more than 60 in the front and no info about the back at all. Inquiring minds and all that.

[path1]

I can state that if was paying someone to drive unit to dealer, than pay the dealer and then pay to drive it back... I would have re-think the entire process.

For me, in my side yard when I change any fluid, the worst part is taking the old fluid down to part store.

[blownstang01]

Mocoondo wrote:

path1 wrote:

I agree with Mocoondo on 99.999 things he says. He is one of the best resources on here. But if me I would change every fluid you have. You have no idea if someone took the rear diff for a swim or if some renter added whatever to trans.

Opinion -- Take it for whatever it's worth -- The odds of an average renter servicing a transmission with anything at all is as close to nil as you can get. They just don't go anywhere near it. After the first trans service, it becomes real iffy whether there is any added benefit servicing it again. Most trans guys that I know insist that if you have managed to take a trans over 100K miles, to just leave it alone beyond that and only take action if you notice changes to the trans fluid either color, clarity or odor. This has generally been my practice, even in my personal automobiles, and I have never lost a trans due to lack of maintenance. Also, trans problems won't fix themselves with a fluid change. If you see changes to fluid color or odor, it means your trans is wearing excessively and you will soon be in rebuild/replace territory. Some mechanics that I know flat out refuse to do a trans flush on a higher mile trans because they insist that the odds of losing a transmission after a flush go way up.

Take the advice for the value paid, but with these Ford transmissions, once they hit 100K, they get a full service and that is the last time they ever get opened until it gets replaced. And for the record, I have run these things for millions of miles and had a failure of exactly one Ford transmission and it had nothing to do with maintenance. It was a 6,000 mile transmission that suffered a catastrophic failure. No amount of maintenance could have prevented that.

Not to start an argument, you have your opinion and rightfully so. But, I disagree with the leaving it alone if it's never been serviced mindset, it's IMO an old wives tale. However, you are 100% correct that once an issue arises, no amount of flush is going to fix it. I started my "career" as a transmission rebuilder (still do many on the side) and was the Operations manager at a large Ford dealer for years. While yes, many tech's will not service a high mileage trans for the reasons you listed, I think it's just trickled down that way for many years. The problem is most of these stories are because the trans was acting up before the service. You simply do not cause issues by installing a new filter and fresh fluid. My opinion.

[FunTwoDrv]

I think I will steal your sofa mod for ours!!

Gary

[Mocoondo]

STEVE-OTR wrote:
Well Hello to all of my Fellow "Former Rental" Motorhome owners and Happy New Year!!! It's been almost 1 year since I purchased my Thor Four Winds Majestic 28A from Cruise America. Since then I have takin it on many wonderful camping trips. No issues so far. Right now I am impatiently waiting for Spring so that I could De-Winterize and prep this baby to hit the open road again!!! Any who, since it's been kinda quiet in this forum for awhile, I thought I'd share some of the modifications I did with my unit over the summer of 2017.

Clever use of the space under the jacknife sofa. That has always been a waste of very usable real estate. I always envisioned a hatch door of some sort to store cases of water, etc. No idea why they never did that.

The USB charging ports are now standard on the new units. There are two USB outlets in each standard 120V receptacle.

Many years ago, the dinette had factory installed cupholders, but they were deleted a decade or more ago.

Nice job with the mods!

[STEVE-OTR]

Well Hello to all of my Fellow "Former Rental" Motorhome owners and Happy New Year!!! It's been almost 1 year since I purchased my Thor Four Winds Majestic 28A from Cruise America. Since then I have takin it on many wonderful camping trips. No issues so far. Right now I am impatiently waiting for Spring so that I could De-Winterize and prep this baby to hit the open road again!!! Any who, since it's been kinda quiet in this forum for awhile, I thought I'd share some of the modifications I did with my unit over the summer of 2017.

You know that space that's under the sofa bed? Well I decided to make great "shoe storage" space out of it since I didn't like the shoes crowding the RV entrance:



Also, decided to install an inverter under the dinette area for use only while driving to power up a Laptop or Cell phone:


Even added a USB charge port on the opposite side of Dinette:


Finally, I added some Stainless Steel cup holders right to the Dinette table (we can still fold the table to make the bed, cup holders don't get in the way):


Gotta admit this RV turned out to be a nice little project to keep me busy but I love that I can make it my own!!! Happy Camping you all and let me know what you think of these little upgrades!!!

[path1]

Mocoondo wrote:

path1 wrote:

I agree with Mocoondo on 99.999 things he says. He is one of the best resources on here. But if me I would change every fluid you have. You have no idea if someone took the rear diff for a swim or if some renter added whatever to trans.

Opinion -- Take it for whatever it's worth -- The odds of an average renter servicing a transmission with anything at all is as close to nil as you can get. They just don't go anywhere near it. After the first trans service, it becomes real iffy whether there is any added benefit servicing it again. Most trans guys that I know insist that if you have managed to take a trans over 100K miles, to just leave it alone beyond that and only take action if you notice changes to the trans fluid either color, clarity or odor. This has generally been my practice, even in my personal automobiles, and I have never lost a trans due to lack of maintenance. Also, trans problems won't fix themselves with a fluid change. If you see changes to fluid color or odor, it means your trans is wearing excessively and you will soon be in rebuild/replace territory. Some mechanics that I know flat out refuse to do a trans flush on a higher mile trans because they insist that the odds of losing a transmission after a flush go way up.

Take the advice for the value paid, but with these Ford transmissions, once they hit 100K, they get a full service and that is the last time they ever get opened until it gets replaced. And for the record, I have run these things for millions of miles and had a failure of exactly one Ford transmission and it had nothing to do with maintenance. It was a 6,000 mile transmission that suffered a catastrophic failure. No amount of maintenance could have prevented that.

My opinion...OK, Agree to disagree on this one. I'm not paying shop rates to do my maintenance, so the question of "will we get our money back" doesn't come into play. But I get idea.

Copied here is 150,000 miles service Normal Schedule, see below for Special Operating Conditions.

Cars, Minivans, Light Trucks, Sport Utilities, Vans, 4x4, Natural Gas, Propane, and Diesel Vehicles

Change engine oil and replace oil filter
Inspect brake pads/shoes/rotors/drums, brake lines & hoses, and parking brake system
Inspect wheel ends for endplay and noise
Inspect engine cooling system and hoses
Change Premium Gold coolant (see exceptions page 34 and record page 48)
Inspect exhaust system and heat shields
Inspect steering linkage, suspension and, if equipped, driveshaft and ball joints
Inspect tires for wear and rotate
Replace engine air filter (except PZEV Focus see below)
Check air filter minder, replace filter as required (Focus PZEV engine)
Replace fuel filter*
Replace cabin air filter, if equipped
Change automatic transmission/transaxle fluid and filter
Change rear axle lubricant on all rear wheel drive (RWD) vehicles (see page 35-36)
Replace accessory drive belt(s) (if not replaced within last 100,000 miles)
Replace climate-controlled seat filters (Navigator, Aviator, and LS if equipped)

Additional services for: Light Trucks, Sport Utilities, and Vans
Inspect and lubricate 4X2 ball joints (except F-450/F-550)
Replace 4X2 wheel bearings and grease seals, lubricate and adjust bearings

Inspect and lubricate steering linkage (E and F series, Excursion)

*If vehicle is registered in California, the California Air Resources Board has determined that the failure to perform this maintenance item will not nullify the emission warranty or limit recall liability prior to the completion of the vehicle’s useful life. We, however, urge that all recommended maintenance services be performed at the indicated intervals and the maintenance be recorded.

Special Operating Conditions

Towing a trailer or using a camper or car-top carrier, Extensive idling and/or low-speed driving for long distances as in heavy commercial use such as delivery, taxi, patrol car or livery, Operating in dusty conditions such as unpaved or dusty roads

Every 3,000 miles or 3 months Change engine oil and replace oil filter
Every 30,000 miles Change automatic transmission fluid
Lubricate 4X4 front hub needle bearings (F Super Duty)
Every 60,000 miles Change transfer case fluid
Change rear axle fluid if equipped with XY-75W90-FEHP
As required Change manual transmission fluid
As required Inspect and lubricate U-joints

[Burns813]

Thanks to both of you. That gives me a lot to think about. Checking the dipstick the tranny fluid is still clear pink and doesn't smell burnt. When I added the Lucas I dropped about 24oz of fluid to make room for the 24oz bottle of Lucas since the fluid level was full. Of course the fluid I dropped from the pan seemed dark but still didn't smell burnt, etc. Other than the diagnosed "normal" torqshift clunking the tranny shifted very nicely. I'll sleep on it for about 5 months lol.

[Mocoondo]

path1 wrote:

I agree with Mocoondo on 99.999 things he says. He is one of the best resources on here. But if me I would change every fluid you have. You have no idea if someone took the rear diff for a swim or if some renter added whatever to trans.

Opinion -- Take it for whatever it's worth -- The odds of an average renter servicing a transmission with anything at all is as close to nil as you can get. They just don't go anywhere near it. After the first trans service, it becomes real iffy whether there is any added benefit servicing it again. Most trans guys that I know insist that if you have managed to take a trans over 100K miles, to just leave it alone beyond that and only take action if you notice changes to the trans fluid either color, clarity or odor. This has generally been my practice, even in my personal automobiles, and I have never lost a trans due to lack of maintenance. Also, trans problems won't fix themselves with a fluid change. If you see changes to fluid color or odor, it means your trans is wearing excessively and you will soon be in rebuild/replace territory. Some mechanics that I know flat out refuse to do a trans flush on a higher mile trans because they insist that the odds of losing a transmission after a flush go way up.

Take the advice for the value paid, but with these Ford transmissions, once they hit 100K, they get a full service and that is the last time they ever get opened until it gets replaced. And for the record, I have run these things for millions of miles and had a failure of exactly one Ford transmission and it had nothing to do with maintenance. It was a 6,000 mile transmission that suffered a catastrophic failure. No amount of maintenance could have prevented that.

[path1]

Mocoondo wrote:

Burns813 wrote:
Ok I just got back from a 2000 mile trip. 2007 E350 chassis now has over 153k miles, Anyone got that beat?

The clunk is normal. No action needed. You do not need to flush the trans as it would have been done at 100K miles and is not needed again until 200K miles.

I've taken a few 350's up to 170K miles. Very few powertrain issues other than a coil pack here and there resulting in a misfire. Probably also due for ball joints by that time as well, but I'll bet they have already been done at least once. Check for a zerk on the BJ's. If present, apply a few pumps of grease. If not, consider installing zerks so you can apply grease.

I agree with Mocoondo on 99.999 things he says. He is one of the best resources on here. But if me I would change every fluid you have. You have no idea if someone took the rear diff for a swim or if some renter added whatever to trans.
I would do a complete change of fluid bumper to bumper. Drop trans pan replace the filter and drain torque converter and replace trans fluid with OEM spec. Same with other fluids to include coolant and power steering. I do carry a spare COP and injector and cheap trouble code reader. Be gentle re-torqueing trans bolts start and thread in finger tight as far as you can, then hand torque...unless you like heli coils.

You never know what your unit has been through. Matter of fact I watched a renter get in and put on her seatbelt and mash the gas to the floor, while in park. Couple CA employees ran over to her and ask what the problem was. Turns out she never drove an automatic before, only stick. Sort of funny... She told CA people in her own language (what ever that was) if it was truly "automatic" transmission, she should not have to "manually" put it in drive. Hinse her mashing the gas...because CA told her it was "automatic":)