Need Hot Water Heater Advice

[mikebreeze]

Last weekend I went to turn on my hot water heater and had some issues. After a few minutes I saw and smelled a smoke and a burning smell coming out of the outside vent on my rig. Since this smoke was coming out right above the propane flame I immediately shut off the hot water heater. I then looked at the hot water heater itself and saw water around the base of it and also a small leak at the bottom of the RV. So I think that I either had a leak in the plumbing pre-water heater that caused insufficient water levels in the heater, which caused the element to burn. Or I had a leak in the water heater itself, which caused the same result. So I believe that I will be needing a new hot water heater.

So I am now deciding on replacing my conventional 6 gallon hot water heater with the same device or going with a tank-less hot water heater. Pros that I have read for the tank-less include instant, unlimited hot water and less weight for the device itself. Cons include more expensive price, the faster the flow, the cooler the water and excessive start up spike in current. Has anyone here replaced their hot water heater and which route did you go? Thanks in advance.

[Mocoondo]

j-d wrote:


Who's selling replacement tanks for these now? I'd seen them on MarksRV but not recently...

The tanks are everywhere. Atwood P/N 91641. Under $200 usually.

Assuming it is original, the water heater in an 06 Cruise unit would have been put into service in Spring 05. That puts the water heater at 8 years old. He can swap out the tank, but if I were a betting man, it won't be long before he's shopping for other parts. The circuit boards, burners, and t-stat/ECO are what goes out most frequently. When you add all that up, he's close to new water heater territory.

Something like the Atwood GC6AA-10E would be a direct "plug and play" replacement and he would gain the option of heating water with electricity or LP.

[j-d]

I agree 100% with adding 120VAC capability to an LP tank-type water heater with Direct Spark Ignition. The very least expensive type is LPG with "standing pilot" which is the kind you have to go outside and light. They use LP when not needed, and you won't stay in the habit of climbing in and out of the RV to light it and shut it off to meet your demands. They also blow out and leave you without hot water when you expected to have it. We had one and it was a pain. I might replace the tank in a DSI/Electric water heater. Any other kind and I'd opt up to have DSI/LP.

Who's selling replacement tanks for these now? I'd seen them on MarksRV but not recently...

[Mocoondo]

I see you have a retired Cruise America unit. As such, you have the Atwood G6A-8E water heater. I've replaced many of these things. What you are describing is water leaking out of the tank. For whatever reason, either corrosion, a burn-thru or poor winterization, water is leaking out and you will either need to replace the tank or replace the entire water heater. The tank is about $200 and a new water heater is about $400. Either project can be done in a couple hours with a few simple hand tools. Considering the age, I would probably do a complete replacement if it were my rig. Burner, t-stats, circuit board, etc. are all life limited components and are probably nearing the end of their service limits on that unit.

The only upgrade worth considering in my opinion is to consider a water heater with both LP and electric heating. As you know, your water heater is only LP because that is what Cruise specs when they buy motorhomes. For a few extra bucks, you can get one that is both electric and LP so when you are plugged into electric at your campsite, you can heat your water off electric and conserve LP.

One thing though ... before you do anything, just make sure that you actually have a breach in the tank. A couple of times I have seen the ECO (emergency cut out) switch fail which kept the water heater on after desired temperature was reached, which ultimately caused an overpressure condition in the tank and venting of steamy hot water through the overpressure relief valve. This scenario could manifest itself with the symptoms you describe, but it would take a considerable amount of run time for it to happen. If this all occurred in the span of say 10 minutes run time, then my bet would be on a tank breach versus an overtemperature/overpressure/venting overboard scenario.

[CloudDriver]

Kit Carson wrote:

CloudDriver wrote:
Before you spend a bunch of $$ on this issue, it would be wise to determine whether there is actually a problem with the water heater.

The picture below shows the burner section of our Atwood 6 gallon water heater. Spiders are known to be drawn to the odor of propane and may have built a web inside your burner tube. A few years back I had a spider do that right at the elbow of the tube and when I turned the heater on flames came shooting up out of the air slots. This could be the source of your fire and smoke. If so, cleaning of the burner tube will eliminate the problem.

Another possible source of smoke is that wasps or other insects may have built a nest in the larger tube that carries the flame into the heater.

As far as the source of the water you are seeing, propane is a hydrocarbon fuel that produces water and carbon dioxide when burned. With cold water in the heater, the water from combustion will condense on the walls of the tube inside the heater for a while until the tube warms up. This condensate will run out of the low end of the tube, which looks like a leak, but isn't.

How did you rig up that drain line? Looks like something that is very convenient.

It's pretty much what it looks like. Each end of the 1/2 inch hose has a barb to male thread nylon adapter, plus the 1/2 inch ball valve on the end. I used reinforced tubing due to the water pressure and hot water. All parts came from either Lowes or Home Depot.

At the end of the season, I remove the drain hose from the tank so I can flush the hard water crud out of the tank, then screw the original nylon plug in finger tight to keep the bugs out.

[Kit_Carson]

CloudDriver wrote:
Before you spend a bunch of $$ on this issue, it would be wise to determine whether there is actually a problem with the water heater.

The picture below shows the burner section of our Atwood 6 gallon water heater. Spiders are known to be drawn to the odor of propane and may have built a web inside your burner tube. A few years back I had a spider do that right at the elbow of the tube and when I turned the heater on flames came shooting up out of the air slots. This could be the source of your fire and smoke. If so, cleaning of the burner tube will eliminate the problem.

Another possible source of smoke is that wasps or other insects may have built a nest in the larger tube that carries the flame into the heater.

As far as the source of the water you are seeing, propane is a hydrocarbon fuel that produces water and carbon dioxide when burned. With cold water in the heater, the water from combustion will condense on the walls of the tube inside the heater for a while until the tube warms up. This condensate will run out of the low end of the tube, which looks like a leak, but isn't.

How did you rig up that drain line? Looks like something that is very convenient.

[j-d]

I'd guess it needs cleaning. Either the burner "tube" (that passes through the water tank to transfer the flame's heat) or the Burner itself. If it's Atwood, there's a thermal "fuse" that's designed to shut the gas off if it flames back, so you might find it won't light without replacing that.
But... I must ask... How do you USE the water heater? We camp mostly at state parks without sewer hookups, and shower in their bath house. I use it mostly for washing dishes, and it takes only a few minutes, on LP or Electric, to get plenty of hot water. Then I turn it off again. The few times we've been on full hookups, we've used our own hot water and the heater was just fine. Suburban SW6DE, which is six-gallon DSI LP and Electric. If we were on full hookup all the time and wanted long showers, then maybe tankless. For our use, no way. For me the DSI with Electric is top of the line.

[CloudDriver]

Before you spend a bunch of $$ on this issue, it would be wise to determine whether there is actually a problem with the water heater.

The picture below shows the burner section of our Atwood 6 gallon water heater. Spiders are known to be drawn to the odor of propane and may have built a web inside your burner tube. A few years back I had a spider do that right at the elbow of the tube and when I turned the heater on flames came shooting up out of the air slots. This could be the source of your fire and smoke. If so, cleaning of the burner tube will eliminate the problem.

Another possible source of smoke is that wasps or other insects may have built a nest in the larger tube that carries the flame into the heater.

As far as the source of the water you are seeing, propane is a hydrocarbon fuel that produces water and carbon dioxide when burned. With cold water in the heater, the water from combustion will condense on the walls of the tube inside the heater for a while until the tube warms up. This condensate will run out of the low end of the tube, which looks like a leak, but isn't.

[pianotuna]

Hi,

The tankless units for RV's need to be propane fired as even a 50 amp rv only has 12000 watts to "play with". I prefer to use a ten gallon unit that would be 120 volt electric and propane.

Since I'm in a class C, when my water heater fails I'll try to upgrade to a "motor aide" unit that uses waste heat from the engine to heat the water in the tank.

mikebreeze wrote:
So I am now deciding on replacing my conventional 6 gallon hot water heater with the same device or going with a tank-less hot water heater. Pros that I have read for the tank-less include instant, unlimited hot water and less weight for the device itself. Cons include more expensive price, the faster the flow, the cooler the water and excessive start up spike in current. Has anyone here replaced their hot water heater and which route did you go? Thanks in advance.

[WoodGlue]

My new Atwood regular water heater has an 18 gallon per hour recovery capability. I could have chosen the Atwood Tankless WH, but decided that 18 gallons of hot water an hour was enough for my purposes.

I understand Girard is in their 2nd phase of Tankless WH's now, the first phase were sorta unsatisfactory to consumers.

WoodGlue