WFCO WF-9875 Replacement

[BobKrogstie]

I am looking at a Progressive Dynamics Series 9200 replacement for my now defunct WF-9875 converter but PD does not have a 75A unit. Their 80A unit requires a 20A AC source but my current converter circuit in the basement has a 15A breaker so I'm ruling out the PD 80A unit. This leaves me with the PD9270 as a replacement unit. Would like input as to whether or not the PD9270 is adequate to replace the WF-9875.

[MrWizard]

The 70 amp is a good replacement for the the 75
You won't notice any difference in your 12v power or your battery charging
Make sure you get the pendant so you can kick onto body mode

[time2roll]

Unless you have some monster 12v load like tank heaters... a 45 or 55 amp converter would be fine for just being plugged in.

Or are you charging multiple batteries with a generator?

[BobKrogstie]

BFL13 wrote:
PD 9280 Specs:

Input: 105-130 VAC, 1,300 Watts
Note: Requires 20 amp rated outlet
Output: 13.6 VDC, 80 Amps

Also see specs table at bottom of this:
http://www.bestconverter.com/9200-Series-Deck-Mount_c_84.html

So what does that all really mean? 13.6 x 80 = 1088w. They claim at least 80% efficiency. 1088/1300 = 83.6% so they are doing the specs at 13.6, not 14.4

At 14.4v, 14.4 x 80 = 1152w output, and at 83.6% efficiency, input would be 1378w

BUT as discovered in the other thread, the PF correction is 0.7 and you use that for input. 1152 x 100/70 = 1645VA drawn from the AC power source.

1645VA requires 12 wire and 20a CB by NEC rules for appliance left on more than 3 hours.

http://forums.trailerlife.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/29016351/srt/pa/pging/1/page/1.cfm

And now you know the rest of the story ... excellent post.

[otrfun]

Thanks for the explanation, BFL13. Good to know what's behind the PD9280's need for a 20 amp breaker.

[BFL13]

PD 9280 Specs:

Input: 105-130 VAC, 1,300 Watts
Note: Requires 20 amp rated outlet
Output: 13.6 VDC, 80 Amps

Also see specs table at bottom of this:
http://www.bestconverter.com/9200-Series-Deck-Mount_c_84.html

So what does that all really mean? 13.6 x 80 = 1088w. They claim at least 80% efficiency. 1088/1300 = 83.6% so they are doing the specs at 13.6, not 14.4

At 14.4v, 14.4 x 80 = 1152w output, and at 83.6% efficiency, input would be 1378w

BUT as discovered in the other thread, the PF correction is 0.7 and you use that for input. 1152 x 100/70 = 1645VA drawn from the AC power source.

1645VA requires 12 wire and 20a CB by NEC rules for appliance left on more than 3 hours.

http://forums.trailerlife.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/29016351/srt/pa/pging/1/page/1.cfm

[bpounds]

wa8yxm wrote:
The 9280 Plug In model comes with a 20 amp plug, not a more common 15, however it will work just fine on a 15 amp breaker,, you just need to hang a 20 amp outlet in the bay for it to plug into

The hard wired version is even easier.. no need to hang the outlet.

HOW DO I KNOW THIS

I have a 9180 with optional charge wizard.. (Basically the 9280) and I needed the 20 amp breaker for something lese so I hung it on a 15 as I did not have another 20 handy.. Works great, has for 11 years.

This sounds correct to me. No way does that thing draw enough to need a 20A circuit.

So why does PD do that? Possibly because they are concerned about the DC side. They are in the replacement business. Many DIY'ers would try to upgrade by installing the highest rated converter, when the DC side of their coach is not wired for that. By using a 20A plug, PD can discourage installing the 80A in coaches not designed for that. That's all just speculation on my part.

[wa8yxm]

BobKrogstie wrote:
I am looking at a Progressive Dynamics Series 9200 replacement for my now defunct WF-9875 converter but PD does not have a 75A unit. Their 80A unit requires a 20A AC source but my current converter circuit in the basement has a 15A breaker so I'm ruling out the PD 80A unit. This leaves me with the PD9270 as a replacement unit. Would like input as to whether or not the PD9270 is adequate to replace the WF-9875.

One error in what you posted:
The 9280 Plug In model comes with a 20 amp plug, not a more common 15, however it will work just fine on a 15 amp breaker,, you just need to hang a 20 amp outlet in the bay for it to plug into

The hard wired version is even easier.. no need to hang the outlet.

HOW DO I KNOW THIS

I have a 9180 with optional charge wizard.. (Basically the 9280) and I needed the 20 amp breaker for something else so I hung it on a 15 as I did not have another 20 handy.. Works great, has for 11 years.

The only time, I mean the ONLY time it has given me problms is when.. Well mine is a plug in model, and occasionally I snag the cord and it becomes an UNPLUGGED IN model, and then.. it does not work for some strange reason.. I usually figure this out long about 3AM the next morning so I turn on the back up converter, then plug it in later in the AM. And then, Like magic, it works again :).
(Converter 2 has an issue, but it is a prosine 2.0 Inverter. Blang thing likes to overcharge a couple of volts (leaky pass transistor I suspect) so I keep it on standby.. I like the Charge Wizard's program better anyway.. batteries lasted 9 years from date of purchase of Motor home.. A bit longer from date of install.)

[rhagfo]

MEXICOWANDERER wrote:
Do any rigs get wired with 12 AWG? All I've seen had 14 AWG.

20 amp requires 12 AWG., the outlet in discussion, in my WFCO 8955 power center is a single outlet snap in, that is part of the center.

[otrfun]

MEXICOWANDERER wrote:
Do any rigs get wired with 12 AWG? All I've seen had 14 AWG.

Our toy hauler has yellow, 12/2, romex run to both air conditioners, the microwave, and to the converter. Each of these four circuits are connected to a 20 amp breaker (total 4).

[MEXICOWANDERER]

Do any rigs get wired with 12 AWG? All I've seen had 14 AWG.

[BarneyS]

Moved to Tech Issues forum from 5th Wheels.

[rhagfo]

bpounds wrote:

rhagfo wrote:

:h

Change the breaker to 20 amp, and the outlet to a 20 amp configuration, maybe $15 worth of the parts.

Not knowing the size of the wiring in the trailer, I would never recommend changing the breaker.

Change the outlet, okay. Change the plug on the cord, okay. Because it is still protected by the original breaker.

Moot point though, since the PO has already made a wise decision.

Well on my center the outlet for the converter is part of power center, a simple pigtail single outlet unit complete with correctly sized wire. I doubt many are on a separate wall outlet, but in that case yes 12 gauge wire.

[otrfun]

rhagfo wrote:

otrfun wrote:

BobKrogstie wrote:

bpounds wrote:
I think you would be okay either way.

But, where did you get the 20A info? Because I see a draw of 1300W on the input, which would only be 11.x amps. No where near needing a 20A breaker.

Link to a good source:
PD 9280

Here under Specifications: Link to Specs

The WF-9875 in our toy hauler was connected to a dedicated 20 amp breaker, which I believe is what WFCO recommends for the WF-9875. Unless you want to use a 15 amp breaker with the PD9280 (against PD's recommendation), I'd say you have no choice but to go with the PD9270 (or smaller).

According to the WFCO WF-9875 installation manual the WF-9875 draws 15.7 amps under maximum load. Slightly more than 15 amps.

:h

Change the breaker to 20 amp, and the outlet to a 20 amp configuration, maybe $15 worth of the parts.

If the existing wiring will support that amperage (run length and gauge) could be a viable option. However, without knowing the OP's run length and gauge I wouldn't feel comfortable recommending this.

[BobKrogstie]

bpounds wrote:

rhagfo wrote:

:h

Change the breaker to 20 amp, and the outlet to a 20 amp configuration, maybe $15 worth of the parts.

Not knowing the size of the wiring in the trailer, I would never recommend changing the breaker.

Change the outlet, okay. Change the plug on the cord, okay. Because it is still protected by the original breaker.

Moot point though, since the PO has already made a wise decision.

Roger that bpounds.