Looking for new tow vehicle

[Frenchracer21]

Question for everyone. I have a 33ft sunset creek travel trailer that I pull with my 2013 f150. The camper`s dry weight is 6700 pounds but with 4 kids we most likely come in around 8200 with everything loaded. We are looking at getting a new vechicle that can tow this camper( have thought of switching campers but this has a double bunk and it's in great shape so we don't want to get rid of it). Looking for vechicles that can tow but allow for the most comfortable ride and most importantly a safe ride. We don't want our son in the middle of the bench seat in the truck so are exploring suvs and vans. We have it narrowed down to an expedition max, suburban/yukon, chevy express passenger van and Nissan nv nl 3500 van. Problem is the suburban would be at the highest rated tow capacity and I'd like some wiggle room and the rest ofthe choices we have narrowed down to I want real knowledgeable people that know what they can pull (dealers will tell you a car can pull but have no idea since they just want the sale). Are we going down the wrong roas and need to just stick to a pickup truck? Thank you in advance.

[theoldwizard1]

FordMastertech wrote:

I have a 2000 Ford Excursion Limited 4x4 7.3 diesel with around 103k on it and plan on taking this to my grave, best vehicle I have ever owned but I will say she is a garage queen and only comes out for towing and traveling,

Because it is a garage queen is the only reason it has not turned into a pile of rust !

[Frenchracer21]

We are definitely looking into the nissan and chevy vans still. I have come across a few 2500 and 3500 chevy express uplifter vans. They are definitely nicer than regular express but they look like the same tow ratings as the regular express vans. Can anyone confirm that or if they use this type of van?

[CharlesinGA]

afidel wrote:
Are you going down the wrong road? Not at all, the Express van and Nissan are very popular tow vehicles for larger families. The Express van in passenger form with the V8 diesel are super rare though zero listed on cars.com anywhere in the US currently), the 6.0 is a little more available. The Nissan is a great choice all around and actually available used with the 5.6.

The last year for the Duramax diesel in the Express/Savannah was 2016. Basically he would need to find a church bus in 3500. The 6.0L engine would be more than enough. Be aware that the max weight is the same, be it short or long WB and the long WB is heavier thus a lower cargo carrying capacity in the van. Long wheelbase is best for towing stability. The Youtube channel Less Junk, More Journey used one for a couple of years pulling a 30 ft Airstream.

Charles

[SloeJoe]

Pretty strong opinion without having seen the van. Anyways, what would you recommend?

No offense intended, but I just looked on A_totrader. I found no reasonably-priced diesel passenger vans nationwide that could seat 4 people in real seats, store four days worth of camping equipment in the back, and easily pull a loaded enclosed car trailer to Pittsburgh.

[Grit_dog]

The 6.0 Flowerjokes were significantly detuned to a very milquetoast unimpressive power level in the van applications. 240/440 or something like that. They also lived longer healthier lives with respect to some of the common 6.0 issues like headgaskets and egr, due to the reduced power. They were/are still just a finicky on maintenance, alot due to the maligned (without pristine maintenance) oil fired injection pump (HPOP) and some issues like FICM and waterpump, which are easy fixes compared to head studs.

I too would expect better service out of the detuned versions of these engines.

[Gdetrailer]

SloeJoe wrote:
Every truck owner will have different results. I'm only saying that my 6.0 has been great.

I made the same decision when I bought the van in 2012. I researched it on-line, read the horror stories, talked to local diesel shops, and talked to people who actually owned them. Like I said, the contractor who owned four said that all of his were fine.

In the end, I bought the van and drove it for nine years. The only non-consumable it ever required was a vacuum pump for the brake system. I would not hesitate to drive the van cross-country as it sits.

No sales pitch. Just facts.

Take care, Diesel Dudes.

The Ford 6 OHH was a first gen in smog compliancy, it definitely had issues, some in fact were perfectly fine stock from factory and those owners were the lucky ones. However, those were the minority, the majority however had a lot of issues which stemmed mainly back to what was done to get them emissions compliant.

That is where "bullet proofing" came to be..

But bullet proofing is not a cheap process and requires a lot of parts upgrades..

From HERE

"The idea of bulletproof mods took off in the 6.0 world and it became a common term. However, Bulletproof is really a company that makes tons of great upgrades for the Ford Power Stroke engines. A few popular upgrades to build a bulletproof Ford 6.0 include the oil cooler, EGR cooler, water pump, FICM, and head studs."


Those are the top 5 parts that must be replaced and all insanely priced, your looking at dumping as much as $8K plus labor in parts and there are other parts that should be replaced to make it more reliable. You skip upgrading any one of the top 5 parts and it will fail again..

There were reasons why Ford handed out "silent" extended warranties to some owners of 6.0s and many owners bought extended warranties to 100K and then dumped them just before the warranties ran out.

Sure for $10K or more you can make a 6.0 run good and perhaps last, but in reality anything with a 6.0 in it isn't worth taking this kind of costly risk when you can buy a newer vehicle with the newer Diesel engines that have far better reliability records and not to mention more power and TQ plus improved transmissions.

A 06 van from PA is going to have moderate to severe rust damage, repairing a old technology 6.0 in a 2006 van worth maybe on its best day $2K in pristine condition would be a devastating loss.. For the records, no one buying used vehicles cares about "upgrades" and will not be willing to pay for them with the exception of perhaps a properly bullet proofed 6.0 engine all other upgrades are a loss of your money.

[SloeJoe]

Every truck owner will have different results. I'm only saying that my 6.0 has been great.

I made the same decision when I bought the van in 2012. I researched it on-line, read the horror stories, talked to local diesel shops, and talked to people who actually owned them. Like I said, the contractor who owned four said that all of his were fine.

In the end, I bought the van and drove it for nine years. The only non-consumable it ever required was a vacuum pump for the brake system. I would not hesitate to drive the van cross-country as it sits.

No sales pitch. Just facts.

Take care, Diesel Dudes.

[Kavoom]

I saw one of those Nissan Vans at a local gas station and it looked like a beast. I asked the owner as he and three kids piled into it and he was pulling like a 7 to 8K TT. I don't remember what he had in it but it was gas and he said it had plenty of power but they were very hard to find.

A very carefully chosen half ton pick up can do it, but research capabilities and don't settle for less. Any 3/4 ton can tow that all day long without a thought. Good luck finding one at a price that doesn't take your breath away new or used.

[Gdetrailer]

SloeJoe wrote:

Quoted material removed by moderator for advertising

SloeJoe, your post looks like a pretty cunning "for sale" ad minus the price..

But for the record, you can't pay me enough to take any Ford 6.0 Diesel engine off your hands. Even if the non Ford fixes to make it bullet proof have been done, if it wasn't done properly that engine is a expensive time bomb waiting to eat up a boat load of cash in repairs..

That is not including the PA/rust belt rusting issues which are a real buzz kill.. I had a 06 F250 with gas engine, engine ran fine, when I sold it, but I could not keep up with all the rust repairs, silly things like hose clamps simply rusted off, the entire bed frame members needed replaced ($800 in materials alone not including labor)..

OP has a 2013 and moving back to 2006 is like going back to the stone age in engine and transmissions, there has been major improvements in HP, TQ and longevity since 2006..

[wowens79]

falconbrother wrote:

Grit dog wrote:

falconbrother wrote:
I'm towing 5800 dry with a Suburban. The chassis handles the weight fine. The power is not great. A 2500 would be better. You'll pay a premium for one, especially now. The 6.0s with 4x4 bring a premium. The 8.0s are cheaper but, not as popular. I love my Suburban. The 5.3 makes it's horsepower at higher RPMs. Pulling mountains is where you have to pull the gearing down and let the RPMs up. Then it does fine. I would get the longer Expedition with tow package in a second.

I drive or have driven/towed with most every model and configuration of 1500 and HD LS powered truck in the last 20 years, and apples to apples, the 6.0 pulls marginally better in some scenarios and the result is the opposite in other scenarios. A comparable 2500 to whatever year 5.3 Burb you have is not a huge step up in towing power and potentially a bit more of a slug.

I'm surprised and not surprised, all at the same time, to hear this. I assumed the 6.0 would do better. But, I have seen comparisons where the difference doesn't really exist when it comes to towing. The good news is I'm getting old so, I'm never in a hurry. Actually, for our lifestyle, the 5.3, 1500 Suburban does just fine. There are times when people pulling travel trailers blow me off of the road running 70-80 MPH. More power to em. I say a little prayer that they don't have a blow out.

I tow with the 6.0, and it does the job, but does now wow you. I think the biggest draw to it, is that it is basically bullet proof. I've got an 02 with 253k miles that has been rock solid, and still runs great.

[falconbrother]

Grit dog wrote:

falconbrother wrote:
I'm towing 5800 dry with a Suburban. The chassis handles the weight fine. The power is not great. A 2500 would be better. You'll pay a premium for one, especially now. The 6.0s with 4x4 bring a premium. The 8.0s are cheaper but, not as popular. I love my Suburban. The 5.3 makes it's horsepower at higher RPMs. Pulling mountains is where you have to pull the gearing down and let the RPMs up. Then it does fine. I would get the longer Expedition with tow package in a second.

I drive or have driven/towed with most every model and configuration of 1500 and HD LS powered truck in the last 20 years, and apples to apples, the 6.0 pulls marginally better in some scenarios and the result is the opposite in other scenarios. A comparable 2500 to whatever year 5.3 Burb you have is not a huge step up in towing power and potentially a bit more of a slug.

I'm surprised and not surprised, all at the same time, to hear this. I assumed the 6.0 would do better. But, I have seen comparisons where the difference doesn't really exist when it comes to towing. The good news is I'm getting old so, I'm never in a hurry. Actually, for our lifestyle, the 5.3, 1500 Suburban does just fine. There are times when people pulling travel trailers blow me off of the road running 70-80 MPH. More power to em. I say a little prayer that they don't have a blow out.

[wintersun]

A late model 1500 class pickup will outperform in all respects a 20 year old 2500 class pickup. More engine power, more transmission speeds, better engine and transmission cooling, better brakes, and often stronger frames. Pre-2016 Ford 2500/3500 trucks were notorious for the frame breaking in half right behind the cab.

With Chevy the only real difference between the 2500 and the 3500 trucks is that with the latter there is the option for DRW and there are fewer cab and bed options. Not so with the Ford and Ram trucks.

A key problem is that the 1500 trucks and SUVs ship from the factory with tall gears so as to get better EPA fuel economy ratings and so are ill equipped for towing a heavy trailer. To get a low gear ratio for all but the Toyota Tundra trucks one needs to special order the truck from the factory. And with Chevy it is even worse as their is no provision for a larger fuel tank and it is not legal to replace the factory gas tank with a larger one (OK for diesel trucks).

Stopping distances with a 7,000 lb trailer load is very different with an SUV as compared to a 1500 pickup or a 2500 pickup and when one has to quickly slow the vehicle and trailer when some yahoo pulls out in front of you. I sold my 2500 Tahoe after realizing that even with a 3500 lb trailer load I was 100% dependent on the trailer brakes operating perfectly.

What is also ignored and seldom tested for is how long (time and distance) does it take to go from 25 mph up to 65 mph to be able to safely merge with freeway traffic with a heavy trailer in tow. This is no fun even with lots of horsepower available but decidedly dangerous if it takes 30 seconds to get up to 65 mph.

[Frenchracer21]

Yeah we currently have an f150. We make ut work but my son is almost 9 and is getting taller. Makes for a tight squeeze in the front and it's not the safest. Yes we are doing it but it is obviously safer in the back where a dash isn't 3 feet from his face. Makes for a painful ride when you have 3 under 6 in the back. You get the I need a snack or drink or the she's to close and is touching me lol. Normally means my wife is reaching over the seat to hand something to them. Which isn't safe and is super awkward for her.

[Grit_dog]

afidel wrote:

wintersun wrote:
For the most comfortable ride the best class 1500 pickups are the ones from Ram which have coil springs on all four wheels. Advantage of a crew cab pickup is havingt the rear bed for cargo. Add a fiberglass cap and you can use the space for gear, like firewood, kids or a dog, that you do not want inside the cab or the trailer. Also adding a roof rack makes it relatively easy to transport kayaks.

Order the truck with the larger fuel tank and the electronic locking rear differential and the 3.92 rear axle ratio and the truck can tow up to 12,000 lbs safely. Add the Trailer-Tow Group to get the trailer brake controller, trailer TPMS, and trailer reverse steering control.

Did you miss where they said they have 4 kids? I've done 5 in a crew cab pickup for 5,000 miles and 2,500 miles and it's not a lot of fun, 6 would be downright bad. You technically could do it with a front bench pickup but a van is going to do it better from a comfort perspective.

That's what the topper is for!

But, hey, I found another guy who's cool with towing 12k behind a 1/2 ton! Rock on wintersun!