Artic Fox TC Empty/Dry Weight

[otrfun]

We've been researching the weight specs for the 2019 Artic Fox 865 TC. I've read a number of weight threads on the AF TC's and it seems the general consensus is (at least for those who abide by the hard numbers) only a late-model dually will suffice for any of the Artic Fox TC's. This may be true. However, I'm still trying to make sense of Northwood's advertised empty/dry weights for the Artic Fox.

First, the empty/dry weight for the 865 is advertised as 2,641 lbs. (with no options) at the Northwood website. However, after a bit of research it appears this weight does not include the mandatory Fox Value Package which weighs 595 lbs. In reality, it seems the empty/dry weight of the 865 (with no "options") is actually 3.236 lbs.

Secondly, we also requested a pic of the black & white sticker (with the VIN, weight, etc.) off of two different 2019 865's, at two different dealerships, one with a generator, and one without. We found it very unusual that these two 865's, although optioned very differently, were both listed as weighing exactly the same, 2983 lbs.

Has anyone gotten past all these smoking mirrors . . . and actually CAT scaled their Artic Fox TC empty, right after purchase?

[Bedlam]

My 2005 F250 was 7250 lbs with 4500 lbs up front unloaded with no occupants. With my 2012 811 filled and loaded plus two occupants, the truck was 11,500-11,750 lbs with no unloading of the front axle (still at 4500 lbs).

[emcvay]

My first scale weight with the AF (a 990 not an 865) was as follows:

Front Axle 5200
Rear Axle 7680
Total weight 12880

That was right after picking up the camper but with some stuff in it. Two batteries, LPG, nothing in fridge, no clothes in camper, etc. I believe (memory fades now) it was after a fill up so full fuel.

Truck weighed in at 8260 with me, the tailgate and bed-liner but otherwise pretty empty and maybe 1/2 full tank. I'm 260 so drop the truck to 8000, remove the tailgate and bed-liner and you can fiber my 2010 F350 LB PS 4x4 CC weighs in about 8000lbs with a full tank (maybe slightly lower).

Next scale weight, ready to head out to go camper with my wife and I in the cab:

Front 5720
Rear 7520
Total 13240

My wife and I combined weigh in around 410lbs so drops that to 12830 (I try to keep down what we put in the camper by the way).

So the camper ready to roll hits the road about 4800lbs +/-

I didn't realize just how heavy it would be when I bought it, despite a fair bit of research but I did by the time I picked it up. Why? How? I made calls etc and asked around but had not seen actual cat scale numbers yet (when I ordered it). Northwoods spokeman said 'no problem on your SRW' provided I did some upgrades. I would argue today he was correct.

Upper and Lower Stable Loads, Air Bags, Hellwig Big Wig rear Sway bar, E Rated Toyo's (rated at 4080lbs), moved spare to the front (notice the weight reduction on the rear end?), Rancho 9000's etc etc.

My SRW is less expensive that a DRW and I couldn't have easily switched it out to one once I realized just how heavy the camper was but today I'm not interested in switching it out. It rides very well and I am happy with it as is and after over 5000 miles with this setup I'm comfortable.

Only change I'm planning at this time is to replace the wheels with better wheels (stock wheels aren't rated to carry the weight so should be replaced but no problems as of yet) and I am thinking of putting in an exhaust brake too.

On another note, when pulling a 4000lbs trailer my rear axle weight went up over 8000lbs (just and before I moved the tire up front) with the use of a supertruss 3 foot extension. So even though the tongue weight on the trailer is very light (I can pick up the tongue no problem and move it around easily) the extension exaggerated the weight on the rear axle quite a bit. However, I'd say the truck was even MORE comfortable to drive at that point though I took it slow.

Erik

[threeaces]

otrfun wrote:
Threeaces, thanks for posting all this info!

It certainly appears you went into this with your eyes open. Your weakest link were the tires and you have that covered with the 19.5’s.

Interesting that Artic Fox (AF) advertises the empty weight on your 811 as 2,873 lbs. Your AF 811 CAT scaled at 3,900 lbs. empty, with no water or gear. Those who would have run with the usual advice of adding 1,000 lbs. to a TC's empty/dry weight (as advertised by AF) would have still been underestimating their realworld weight (with water and gear) by over 1,000 lbs! So glad we have forums like this to get past all the smoking mirrors.

We have the same truck as you. Although we prefer the amenities in the 865 (weighs ~300 lbs. less than your 811), we're gonna pass and look seriously at the Northern Lite 8-11 SE. A bit more money, but they CAT scale at 3,000 - 3,100 lbs. with an a/c (optional on the 8-11), batteries, propane, empty tanks, and torklift hardware. That gives us 900 - 1,000 lbs. for water and gear based on our truck’s RAWR and GVWR.

Enjoy that 811!!

You are correct on AF advertising the weight of 2,873, however don't forget about the "mandatory" Fox Package. That ads another 500 or so and then I have a few options. Not sure where the 3,293 comes from that is listed on the sticker. Maybe it's the base weight of the 811 plus the Fox package? My understanding is that the posted weight is supposed to be after the unit is complete and it's weighed as it goes out the door. Who knows.

Whatever the case, I knew it would be very heavy and I love the unit.....I'm happy.

[Kayteg1]

I found it very interesting that even 9' camper took off 250lb from front axle.
My 12' takes off about 300 lb, but having 3 feet more behind that is expectable.
I bet not too many owners of shorter TC calculate COG being behind rear axle.
When empty camper loads 3700 lb on each rear tire, adding 1000lb of water, supplies and gear sure will not leave much margin for waste water carrying even with 19.5 wheels.
Than with 400lb of water alone, I think 1000 lb estimate for loading is very conservative.

[otrfun]

Threeaces, thanks for posting all this info!

It certainly appears you went into this with your eyes open. Your weakest link were the tires and you have that covered with the 19.5’s.

Interesting that Artic Fox (AF) advertises the empty weight on your 811 as 2,873 lbs. Your AF 811 CAT scaled at 3,900 lbs. empty, with no water or gear. Those who would have run with the usual advice of adding 1,000 lbs. to a TC's empty/dry weight (as advertised by AF) would have still been underestimating their realworld weight (with water and gear) by over 1,000 lbs! So glad we have forums like this to get past all the smoking mirrors.

We have the same truck as you. Although we prefer the amenities in the 865 (weighs ~300 lbs. less than your 811), we're gonna pass and look seriously at the Northern Lite 8-11 SE. A bit more money, but they CAT scale at 3,000 - 3,100 lbs. with an a/c (optional on the 8-11), batteries, propane, empty tanks, and torklift hardware. That gives us 900 - 1,000 lbs. for water and gear based on our truck’s RAWR and GVWR.

Enjoy that 811!!

[threeaces]

Not an AF 865, but here are very accurate weights of my 2019 AF 811 that I picked up from the dealer 6 days ago. These are honest and very accurate numbers as I have a CAT scale not to far from my home.

My truck: 2017 Ram 3500 SRW short bed diesel, GVWR of 11,700. Tradesman model with only added rubber bed mat, two sets of tire chains in vehicle, lower stableloads, Firestone airbags with onboard compressor, big wig sway bar, and 19.5” wheels / tires.

My camper: 2019 AF 811. Options include factory solar (two panels), rear camera, 2 batteries, large grab handle, AM/FM-CD-DVD (no tv yet), thermal pane windows, side boxes, and slide out awning. Of course has the Fox value package. (note, no Onan generator, but is pre-wired)

Truck without camper (me in truck and tailgate on):
Front - 5,100
Rear - 3,250
Total - 8,350

Truck with camper on my way home from dealer (zero supplies loaded, no water, no propane..... of course Torklift and Fastguns on).
Front - 4,850
Rear - 7,400
Total - 12,250

So, camper weights exactly 3,900 pounds right off the lot......exactly what I was anticipating. That’s why I added the 3 suspension products and upgraded to 19.5’s before even thinking of carrying the camper.

So how does it drive? Better than I had thought it would. Extremely stable, stops great, and of course plenty of power. We immediately went on a 3 night trip and it was great. Included chaining up truck to get over mountain due to snow/ice. I’m guessing my truck upgrades made a really big positive difference. Yes, I’m over GVWR.

Here is the sticker on the camper. Translate it however you’d like:

[Grit_dog]

Irdew wrote:
Here you go a Ram 3500 DRW long bed with a 2015 865 loaded up and ready to go. GVW is 14000 lbs on that truck.on the scale with driver and passenger.

Steer axle 5940
Drive axle 8320
Total. 14260

You’re hauling a lot of extra weight somewhere. That’s unusually heavy.

[otrfun]

Irdew wrote:
Here you go a Ram 3500 DRW long bed with a 2015 865 loaded up and ready to go. GVW is 14000 lbs on that truck.on the scale with driver and passenger.

Steer axle 5940
Drive axle 8320
Total. 14260

Thanks for the numbers.

A moderately equipped 2013-2018 Ram 3500 DRW CC LB 4x4 Cummins scales totally empty (with a full tank of fuel and driver) at around 8,400 lbs. Based on your total scaled weight of 14,260 lbs., and assuming you have a similar truck as I've described, it's possible you may have ~5,760 lbs. of payload. No doubt a good portion of this payload is your AF 865, but exactly how much is anybody's guess.

[GeoBoy]

Irdew wrote:
Here you go a Ram 3500 DRW long bed with a 2015 865 loaded up and ready to go. GVW is 14000 lbs on that truck.on the scale with driver and passenger.

Steer axle 5940
Drive axle 8320
Total. 14260

What is the weight of your truck without the TC?

[Irdew]

Here you go a Ram 3500 DRW long bed with a 2015 865 loaded up and ready to go. GVW is 14000 lbs on that truck.on the scale with driver and passenger.

Steer axle 5940
Drive axle 8320
Total. 14260

[towpro]

Northwood probably does give you the true empty weight, but that number is before factory required options you end up with.

[otrfun]

brholt wrote:
Truck Camper Magazine lists the dry weight at 3236 lbs . . .

Ok, good to know my guess at the true empty/dry weight was right. Can't imagine the number of folks who took the website's empty/dry weight at face value and purchased one. Disappointing they're not more forthcoming about something that can potentially affect the safe operation of a vehicle. You cannot purchase an AF without the 595 lb. Fox Value Package, so it's very unfortunate they feel the need to advertise an empty/dry weight for a TC configuration that does not exist.

[GeoBoy]

Arctic Fox is way off on their weights, but are correct when they say to use a dually to carry their campers.

[towpro]

I found mine was very close to numbers posted by truck camper mag back when I got it.