Cold Weather Camping

[Photomike]

I got upset with some of the information that I was reading and hearing about cold weather camping so I wrote out my experiences for those that are interested.

AS mentioned this is my experience and yours may vary but with many years of cold weather camping under my belt this is what I have found. I take no responsibility for what you do with this information but hope you can add it to your knowledge base and that it is helpful for you to enjoy camping. If in doubt get professional advice to confirm or disprove my ideas!

Cold Weather camping

[brholt]

Here is an old post by INSP1505 which deals with preparing an AF1150 camper for real cold weather camping:

Very Cold camping

[Kayteg1]

When my idea for TC use is stay in places where you can wear T-shirt and shorts, my construction experience says that starting point for cold OR HOT stay, is to seal the camper and add insulation.
Simple experience between sleeping in 20' ClassC v/s sleeping in 40' Bus conversion.
I used them both in California cold nights using 1500W electric heater.
When small ClassC could not hold the temperature- the much larger bus did.
Why? ClassC had 3/4" walls with fiberglass insulation, when bus was all-metal, but 2" walls were sprayed with semi-solid polyurethane foam.
During my camper repairs I discover lot of holes in it.
Tank heating duct had no return, so hot air was pumped via gaps around sewer drain straight into the woods.
Electric cord compartment was open straight under bathroom sink, so with cable slot open, cold air was blowing into your bathroom.
Check the seals around refrigerator as the compartment is cold as well.
Than I discover that my furnace blows the hot air straight from the burners into metal cover exposed to the outside. Meaning you are heating your parking pad as much as you heat interior. There was no space for adding flat insulation, but I sprayed polyurethane foam on the cover interior, put plastic foil over and screw it back on the furnace. This way foam expanded to the shape of furnace- giving me +- R4 insulation, what sure beats sheet metal "heat exchanger" manufacturer design.
Jacks plugs have hefty holes on the inner side, generator and battery compartments are build as heat exchangers as well.
Bottom line - couple cans of polyurethane foam and some styrofoam left from Christmas packages can very easy double camper heat efficiency.

[jefe_4x4]

Well, if Rick 4x4x4 replied to this well written article, then I must also.
Mike, this is a fine piece re: cold weather camping. After retrofitting our ancient ill-insulated, one-season, wood framed Lance with insulation into and on every place possible, I still learned a lot from your piece about traveling and living in cold storage. I never thought about the stove top vent insulation or a thick insulating pad under our carpeting. I used 2 inch thick, foil covered, both sides, R-11, closed cell foam blocks cut to size and glued to inner walls and right over the pass through window, and all 3 front windows with some fiberglass batts and Reflectix in non flat locales like around plumbing and stuffed into drafty openings. I glued these cut blocks on 2 sides of the fridge box, a notoriously air leaky environment. I left one low opening door to the truck bed uninsulated and openable to let in cyclonic fresh air in for exhausting the moisture up through the roof vents.
jefe

[Geewizard]

Ditto on the InReach. I use one a lot for communications in parts of MT and ID where there's no cell coverage. I use the Recreation Freedom plan which I can turn on/off.

And yes, there is a subscription required. It's worth it to me.

Inreach is far better than a PLB or any other method, I think.

[sbryan]

Just one add to BB's post. PLB's are a great rescue tool. I'll add to the list the InReach by Garmin. It allows two way communication in places where there is no cell service and can be used to summon help in an emergency. I have had one since Delorme first came out with them and have used them around the world and across the US and Canada. The only drawback compared to the PLB's is you need a subscription but the cost is minimal for the security you get.

As far as cold weather camping, we have camped in the dead of winter in our Northstar (somewhere between 5 and 15 below) and have found just a little preparation and common sense go a long way to having a comfortable and fun experience. Lots of good info in the OP's blog.

[time2roll]

Good read. My preference for L3 and L4 is to heat the water system instead of draining it. But then I am probably not off-grid in those conditions either. Person must know their limit.

[bb_94401]

A few adds to what Mike said about level 4 (<20C, <-5F) and colder:

Consider taking a winter survival course if you are going to be winter dry camping. Have multiple contingencies to stay warm. A good 7-9" loft, -40F down bag is a good thing to have when your other heat sources fail. Propane vaporization rates drop rapidly at level 4 temperatures and colder

Cell phones can be used in an emergency, when coverage exists. Triangulation by cell tower, in limited coverage areas, results in very large search areas. GPS coordinates are better. Cell phone apps are available which show your actual GPS coordinates, or sends these to 911 as either a voice call or text message.

Large parts of MT, BC and AB have no cell phone coverage, or where you are may have a pocket of no coverage. A PLB (personal locator beacon, 5-6 oz, and 10-12 cubic inches) will directly send your GPS location to search and rescue personnel via satellite, as well as provide an analog signal to radio direction locate you once they get to the GPS location. McMurdo - FastFind or ACR Artex - ResQLink are two that I have.

[COboondocker]

There's not too many places where it can get too cold to camp. I believe the coldest we've been out in was -18F. No water lines froze but but the brackets that connected to the exterior were getting a solid layer of ice on the inside.

[Photomike]

Buzzcut1 wrote:
when you prep correctly winter camping is the best, nice write up Mike

That is not cold that is tropical :B :B :B :B

GREAT pictures!

[Photomike]

Re Catalytic heater - I knew that once people read this there would be mentions of my Little Buddy vs cat, etc, etc, etc. I feel I have put enough warnings in at the beginning and the end to do your own research and I think that should be enough. I know people who would say I need to put warnings in about many other things and honestly we have to leave some decisions for people to make on their own.

My opinion on my Little Buddy or even a non vented catalytic heater is that I would not sleep with one on. For many reasons, not just the obvious. I would and I do use my Buddy for many things like extra heat on a cold day, emergency when my battery is too low, etc and I am happy with it.

I also know many people that use other means of heat that are a lot more dangerous than a Buddy or a catalytic and they are fine.

Like mentioned in the article "Do your own research"

P.S. I just read the part that I mentioned that my Buddy was a cat and changed that. Typing one thing and thinking something else!!

[Buzzcut1]

when you prep correctly winter camping is the best, nice write up Mike

[RickW]

Hi Mike,

This is a great write up with very good observations and tips for cold weather. I am an infrequent level 1 temperature camper.

At the end, you mention a catalytic heater, but in your photo you show an open flame ceramic radiant heater with a low oxygen cut off feature. I also own one.

I hope this slight mention does not restart the annual winter argument between these and true catalytic ( i.e. Wave) heaters in RV's.

Again, great job.

[pianotuna]

PhotoMike,

Nice article--how about adding a link to it in the cold weather camping section of the full time forum?

The only quibble I have with what is written, is the failure to mention that extra ventilation is needed when using an unvented combustion heater. I.E. both roof vent and window.

I do have a tank heater for emergency use on the external propane storage. So far it has not been needed. It can 'double' as a block heater for a generator, too. I do know the Yamaha 2800 generator will start (reluctantly) at -30 C (- 22 f)

[2_many_2]

Very informative, thank you!