Nasty wreck on video with a trailer being towed!

[JTLance]

Wow,

I don't post this for the wow factor, rather, so people are made aware of passing trucks and the affect the turbulence can have.

My heart goes out to these people.

****Beware of language ****


https://www.liveleak.com/view?i=daa_1504165064

[Turtle_n_Peeps]

Acdii wrote:
I see quite a few arguments regarding tail heavy. If I were to compare trailer loading to my RC planes, maybe it can help clear it up.

A Nose heavy plane lands fast, but lands, a tail heavy plane crashes. On a plane there is a balance point, usually landing on the spar of the wing, or in an area at the spar. For every ounce the tail is heavy, to balance you need 3 to 4 ounces in the nose.

While a Plane and a Travel trailer are completely different things, the one thing both have in common is a balance point, the plane, it is the spar, on the trailer, its the axles. Depending on where the axles are placed on a trailer, can determine the ratio of weight back to front to balance it, or make it tow happy.

Trailers that have a long area behind the axles, weight back there can be critical, for every pound added, you must add 2,3,4 or more pounds up front to compensate. As another poster pointed out, 100 pounds of clothes(really? Thats a lot of clothes) placed rearward can be the making of disaster, but move them forward and all is peachy.

So, the trailer in question appeared to have 128 pounds of stuff hanging off the back, and that can lead to disaster if not compensated for with 150 pounds or more up front.

If the trailers CG is dead center, you could add equal amounts front and back. Would I? Nope, that becomes a fine weighing game. I would always add more to the front to balance than what was put in the rear.

After reading the guys story about the wreck, it just proves what I have stated in several other posts about speeding up to correct sway. Don't! Unless you have a **** load of HP and torque and can do the 1/4 mile in 6.8 seconds, you wont be able to go fast enough to correct it. Knowing what I know about hitches now, if I found a crack in the hitch, I would not have purchased a hitch of lessor means than what is needed. Amazon can deliver to any address, and if I need a few extra days, I would take them in order to have the proper setup to take the rig home.

Great post! Especially about the speeding up when you encounter "true sway."

One thing. It doesn't matter how much trailer you have in back of the axels as long as the weights are correct. It's all about weight ratios. I know this from building one of my car trailers.

It towed great at any speed when it was just a flat deck. When I enclosed it, the trailer towed horrible. The reason was the heavy ramp door. The ramp door through all of the ratios off and it was light on the tongue.

The length of the trailer remained the same and the axel to rear of the trailer remained the same. The balance weight ratio changed a bunch and that made the trailer tow like garbage. After putting a tool box and a bunch of parts up front the trailer towed like a dream again.

[Acdii]

I see quite a few arguments regarding tail heavy. If I were to compare trailer loading to my RC planes, maybe it can help clear it up.

A Nose heavy plane lands fast, but lands, a tail heavy plane crashes. On a plane there is a balance point, usually landing on the spar of the wing, or in an area at the spar. For every ounce the tail is heavy, to balance you need 3 to 4 ounces in the nose.

While a Plane and a Travel trailer are completely different things, the one thing both have in common is a balance point, the plane, it is the spar, on the trailer, its the axles. Depending on where the axles are placed on a trailer, can determine the ratio of weight back to front to balance it, or make it tow happy.

Trailers that have a long area behind the axles, weight back there can be critical, for every pound added, you must add 2,3,4 or more pounds up front to compensate. As another poster pointed out, 100 pounds of clothes(really? Thats a lot of clothes) placed rearward can be the making of disaster, but move them forward and all is peachy.

So, the trailer in question appeared to have 128 pounds of stuff hanging off the back, and that can lead to disaster if not compensated for with 150 pounds or more up front.

If the trailers CG is dead center, you could add equal amounts front and back. Would I? Nope, that becomes a fine weighing game. I would always add more to the front to balance than what was put in the rear.

After reading the guys story about the wreck, it just proves what I have stated in several other posts about speeding up to correct sway. Don't! Unless you have a **** load of HP and torque and can do the 1/4 mile in 6.8 seconds, you wont be able to go fast enough to correct it. Knowing what I know about hitches now, if I found a crack in the hitch, I would not have purchased a hitch of lessor means than what is needed. Amazon can deliver to any address, and if I need a few extra days, I would take them in order to have the proper setup to take the rig home.

[Hannibal]

rbpru wrote:
People can and do, tow TTs which any tow vehicle they feel confident with; often never giving it a second thought.

Most will never have an issue but when things go wrong, physics wins. 🙂

This is also true with OTR tractor trailers.

[Camper_G]

dodge guy wrote:

Camper G wrote:
While I appreciate the drivers post and understand that stuff happens, the combination of highway speeds, brake failure (his statements) and in my opinion a marginal tow vehicle, improper loading (heavy items on the rear bumper, regardless of weight is not a good idea) was a recipe for disaster.

I'm glad everyone is ok and that's what is most important. Can you tow a rig that long and heavy with an suv? Yes. Should you? I wouldn't personally. To me that rig is at least 2500HD truck or one ton van territory. I like to have more margin than most which improves my chances and safety when bad things happen.

That's an Excursion. A 3/4 ton SUV based on the 3/4-1 ton Super Duty. Vehicle wasn't an issue. Loading was. Your 2500 Ram is basically the same vehicle.

Not really. My truck has a stiffer suspension, load range E tires and over 3100 lbs of payload. I don't know of an excursion that has that much payload. The X is a good tow vehicle, but it is an SUV.

[rbpru]

People can and do, tow TTs which any tow vehicle they feel confident with; often never giving it a second thought.

Most will never have an issue but when things go wrong, physics wins. 🙂

[dodge_guy]

Camper G wrote:
While I appreciate the drivers post and understand that stuff happens, the combination of highway speeds, brake failure (his statements) and in my opinion a marginal tow vehicle, improper loading (heavy items on the rear bumper, regardless of weight is not a good idea) was a recipe for disaster.

I'm glad everyone is ok and that's what is most important. Can you tow a rig that long and heavy with an suv? Yes. Should you? I wouldn't personally. To me that rig is at least 2500HD truck or one ton van territory. I like to have more margin than most which improves my chances and safety when bad things happen.

That's an Excursion. A 3/4 ton SUV based on the 3/4-1 ton Super Duty. Vehicle wasn't an issue. Loading was. Your 2500 Ram is basically the same vehicle.

[Camper_G]

While I appreciate the drivers post and understand that stuff happens, the combination of highway speeds, brake failure (his statements) and in my opinion a marginal tow vehicle, improper loading (heavy items on the rear bumper, regardless of weight is not a good idea) was a recipe for disaster.

I'm glad everyone is ok and that's what is most important. Can you tow a rig that long and heavy with an suv? Yes. Should you? I wouldn't personally. To me that rig is at least 2500HD truck or one ton van territory. I like to have more margin than most which improves my chances and safety when bad things happen.

[Clockman]

When in Doubt, throttle out! Ya right....

[RandACampin]

The driver posted his own account on the other three. No speculation needed.

[rbpru]

I could be really simple, a blow out, spring failure, an unexpected wind gust or as mentioned an unstable loading of the TT.

Without additional information it as just speculation. Never the less it does serve as a reminder to remain vigilant.

[Turtle_n_Peeps]

Hannibal wrote:
This one appears to have begun with a little help from a passing SUV. He wasn't speeding, doesn't appear to be windy, road looks normal, no evasive maneuver, just oscillation that continued to get worse. I'd bet lunch the owner lightened tongue weight to accommodate the Expedition. Doesn't make him evil, stupid or careless. He may have been ignorant of how little it takes off the tongue to induce sway.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miE3MOcqn7E

My Layton is pretty light on the tongue. How much? Don't know, never weighed it. If the ol lady puts two suit cases of cloths on the bed (rear bed) my trailer will sway even with my sway bar adjusted as tight as I can get it. If I move those to suit cases up front to the dining room; no sway. Just like magic!

I bet the suit cases weight about 50 to 75lbs apiece and it's not on the rear bumper. In fact it's about 4 to 5 foot inboard.

Just goes to show how little it takes with a trailer with a light tongue weight.

[Hannibal]

This one appears to have begun with a little help from a passing SUV. He wasn't speeding, doesn't appear to be windy, road looks normal, no evasive maneuver, just oscillation that continued to get worse. I'd bet lunch the owner lightened tongue weight to accommodate the Expedition. Doesn't make him evil, stupid or careless. He may have been ignorant of how little it takes off the tongue to induce sway.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miE3MOcqn7E

[Hannibal]

Let's go to the holy grail of hitches and gander at their thoughts on causes of sway, compare them to the video and the account from the owner of the rig. Then eliminate the ones that don't count. I don't believe the driver was an idiot or a maniac. Causes of other than trailer induced sway will correct themselves when the cause ceases. This kept getting worse instead of better as the accident unfolded.

https://www.propridehitch.com/what-is-trailer-sway/

This one was obviously caused by an irregularity in the road as he drifted out of his lane onto the margin, his swerve to get back in his lane and, not being trailer induced. The sway was pretty bad. It corrected on it's own with the driver keeping the TV in line.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABg20TEfY-8

[mike-s]

dodge guy wrote:
And the owner of the setup in he video states he had plenty of hitch weight, but it's apparrant in the video that is not the case. How can you argue your point when the video proves otherwise?!!

BS. You simply think tongue weight is the only possible cause of uncontrolled sway. It isn't. The video proves nothing of the sort.